Finishing a 47 year old project and a mystery speaker gets a ride home

[Rolf Zetterberg]

No mystery.
The Seas is a kit called 85K.Meant to be put into a box of 60-90 liters volume.
30WK woofer
Mid called 38H(2x 15/11 TV-LGW)
Treble called 36H(3x9TV-LG)
Filter 806 with 300 and 2800Hz.
Standard impedance 4 ohms.
Probably around 1967-1970 or slightly later

There was a 95H version that could be furnished with mid and treble pots.

 

[Justgotohm]

Thanks for the specs, it was a cool console.

 

[Oldsansui441]

Hey Oldsansui,

I haven't tried the X2 poly caps. It sounds like they'd do very well. A gentleman that I've worked with extensively states that in his experience, the best combination for bypass caps is 1 .1uF and 1 .01uF cap for each capacitor. I've used Audyn caps for these, mostly because they're available at Parts Express when I buy Dayton caps for my Bozak crossovers. That being said, so far I've heard no benefits from using bypass caps. This might be because the systems I work on are so old, and maybe the drivers simply aren't of high enough quality to produce the audible nuances that others state they hear. Or, my hearing or my Ear simply cannot detect anything. When I build Bozak crossovers for others, I use bypass caps. Customers like to get all the extra additions that they read about online. But for my personal crossovers, I don't bother.

I suggest, when convenient, that you pick up the NP electrolytic caps and a handful of bypass caps. Run some A/B testing between the different flavors and configurations and you choose what your Ear likes to hear. Nobody can tell you whether you like chocolate or vanilla flavor, it's something you have to try for yourself. But most of all? Have fun with it! Take your time and play.

Biggles

Thank you for all of your help, that is very interesting information. Yes l will get some more NP crossover caps and go from there, it almost requires an external quick connect/disconnect setup for tweeter circuit caps to make experimenting easier before making a mod permanent.

No mystery.
The Seas is a kit called 85K.Meant to be put into a box of 60-90 liters volume.
30WK woofer
Mid called 38H(2x 15/11 TV-LGW)
Treble called 36H(3x9TV-LG)
Filter 806 with 300 and 2800Hz.
Standard impedance 4 ohms.
Probably around 1967-1970 or slightly later

There was a 95H version that could be furnished with mid and treble pots.

Thank you for that information, you certainly have shed some light on this early Seas speaker kit.

Thanks for the specs, it was a cool console.

Your welcome, Pioneer recommend a min cabinet thickness of 3/4'' in the instructions also, they don't mention any bracing though, l don't think these woofers would warrant it anyway.

 

[drbiggles]

Hey,

It is, or can be a PIA. But it's the only way you're going to find out which works best. As time and/or inspiration permits. For my recent DIY Bozak B302A project I built extra large crossover boards that accommodate 2 different tweeter networks with jumpers all over the darned place. And I built the speakers for external crossovers. I knew what I was getting myself into and went that route.

Biggles

 

[Oldsansui441]

They look absolutely stunning, super work. Your crossovers look the business, great idea on going the external route.

 

[drbiggles]

Thank you sir! Yeah, after doing it the old way more than a few times, I'd had enough. And I like the guts out where I can see 'em, kinda cool.

Biggles

 

[sunrayjack12]

Hey,

It is, or can be a PIA. But it's the only way you're going to find out which works best. As time and/or inspiration permits. For my recent DIY Bozak B302A project I built extra large crossover boards that accommodate 2 different tweeter networks with jumpers all over the darned place. And I built the speakers for external crossovers. I knew what I was getting myself into and went that route.

Biggles

Did you build the cabinets?
They are very nice,I'm always looking for ideas for the next pair of speakers to build, or to go into the idea book.

 

[sunrayjack12]

Thank you sir! Yeah, after doing it the old way more than a few times, I'd had enough. And I like the guts out where I can see 'em, kinda cool.

Biggles

I like having the crossovers out, it beats having to keep taking the back off overtime you want to tweak them or just try a different crossover.

 

[Oldsansui441]

Here are the Pioneer cabinets after three coats of Danish oil, with and without camera flash. I will prob give them two or three more coats.

 

[Oldsansui441]

Thank you sir! Yeah, after doing it the old way more than a few times, I'd had enough. And I like the guts out where I can see 'em, kinda cool.

Yes makes perfect sense. It is cool being able to see them.

 

[Oldsansui441]

I couldn't get 1.5uF electrolytics, so l used a 1uF bypassed with a .47uF X2 (polypropylene) and a .01uF X2. l also bypassed the mids with a .01uF X2. I did this on one speaker only.
I have been running both of them just in the baffles and to be honest l cannot notice any real difference, l would like to think l usually have a fairly good ear, l used to be a musician and can usually pick up any changes made when l work on my amps or other speakers.

As drbiggles alluded to earlier it might be the case with these also that they aren't of high enough resolution to be able to pick out small changes.

I find Adele's voice is usually good for this kind of work as on the wrong equipment some notes can get in your ears a bit too much .

I know my capacitor stack is becoming a bit of a dogs breakfast but there is very limited room and ideally l would just have two electrolytics and two SMALL bypass caps .

 

[drbiggles]

Did you build the cabinets?
They are very nice,I'm always looking for ideas for the next pair of speakers to build, or to go into the idea book.

I didn't build them, I found them empty like that. I believe they're from the 1950's and built like tanks, exceptional build and ingredients. They're 5.3 cubic feet, the perfect volume. But they're kinda squat, and with that lateral trim piece across the front, they don't lend themselves well to driver placement.

Here are a pair of DIY Bozak B302A cabinets (I speculate that they were made 40+ years ago) that I didn't build either. But I did put new maple trim on 'em, new maple banding around the top, new legs and refinished the top. The backs were also dialed in with black paint and attention to detail. I LOVE the design, and with having the bulk of them wrapped in grill cloth, it makes them easy to get looking perfect. My next project is to build new cabinets to match them, and will give them 3 cubic feet. Oh, and make them a little taller so the drivers will fit in a vertical array. I don't own them anymore, traded them for a pair of IMF TLS 80's.

Biggles

 

[drbiggles]

Oldsansui,

Oh man, wood rules! Those cabinets look GREAT. Your dog breakfast capacitor stack looks fine to me, gettem in there! Nothing like progress. MmMmmm, progress.

Biggles

 

[gdmoore28]

Hey,

It is, or can be a PIA. But it's the only way you're going to find out which works best. As time and/or inspiration permits. For my recent DIY Bozak B302A project I built extra large crossover boards that accommodate 2 different tweeter networks with jumpers all over the darned place. And I built the speakers for external crossovers. I knew what I was getting myself into and went that route.

Biggles

Doc, your Bozak cabinet shown in this picture is one of my all-time favorites. It just has a very rich look to it. I love it more every time you post it.

GeeDeeEmm

 

[sunrayjack12]

I didn't build them, I found them empty like that. I believe they're from the 1950's and built like tanks, exceptional build and ingredients. They're 5.3 cubic feet, the perfect volume. But they're kinda squat, and with that lateral trim piece across the front, they don't lend themselves well to driver placement.

Here are a pair of DIY Bozak B302A cabinets (I speculate that they were made 40+ years ago) that I didn't build either. But I did put new maple trim on 'em, new maple banding around the top, new legs and refinished the top. The backs were also dialed in with black paint and attention to detail. I LOVE the design, and with having the bulk of them wrapped in grill cloth, it makes them easy to get looking perfect. My next project is to build new cabinets to match them, and will give them 3 cubic feet. Oh, and make them a little taller so the drivers will fit in a vertical array. I don't own them anymore, traded them for a pair of IMF TLS 80's.

Biggles

I have never described cabinets as sexy, but those bozak's are over the top sexy!
Thank you for sharing the photos.
The blonde color does it for me and the nice legs, I guess I like blondes with nice legs !

 

[gdmoore28]

The blonde color does it for me and the nice legs, I guess I like blondes with nice legs !

I'll second that!!!!

GeeDeeEmm

 

[Oldsansui441]

Here are a pair of DIY Bozak B302A cabinets (I speculate that they were made 40+ years ago) that I didn't build either. But I did put new maple trim on 'em, new maple banding around the top, new legs and refinished the top. The backs were also dialed in with black paint and attention to detail. I LOVE the design, and with having the bulk of them wrapped in grill cloth, it makes them easy to get looking perfect.

These are VERY nice, beautiful work Biggles, they ooze cool.

Oldsansui,

Oh man, wood rules! Those cabinets look GREAT. Your dog breakfast capacitor stack looks fine to me, gettem in there! Nothing like progress. MmMmmm, progress.

Thanks Biggles for your kind words, l will give them a further run and re-evaluate.

 

[drbiggles]

You're welcome for the kind words, you earned 'em. I'm still twitchy over the inductor placement on those crossovers. Your values, your crossover points are going to all be off. The magnetic coupling that goes on when they're placed so close together ain't no joke. I'd be willing to be a batch of chocolate chip cookies that it would be an audible change.

Biggles

 

[Oldsansui441]

Thanks heaps Biggles for your advice. l will see how motivated l get with these.

 

[restorer-john]

The Pioneer AS-303A speaker kit is in the September 1973 catalogue, along with the AS-200 and the AS-305A.

Your pioneers are all alnico magnets.