Grenadeslio
Lunatic Member
Worse yet, could even be knob & tube.
Knob-and-tube wiring (sometimes abbreviated K&T) is an early standardized method of electrical wiring in buildings, in common use in North America from about 1880 to the 1930s.
Two receivers fried after being plugged into the same outlet
- Thread starter Roboturner91
- Start date
Knob-and-tube wiring (sometimes abbreviated K&T) is an early standardized method of electrical wiring in buildings, in common use in North America from about 1880 to the 1930s.
Roboturner91
Super Member
Hey, I'm not doubting your knowledge or anything. I was just trying to understand. It seemed to me like you were assuming that was the case and I was wondering why.
And FWIW, I have an electrician coming out next week.
Roboturner91
Super Member
The house had some knob-and-tube when we had it inspected, it was replaced and a bunch of other electrical items were resolved. The insurance company wouldn't insure the house otherwise. That's why I said earlier, I thought all the electrical stuff had been taken care of.
I've also had my share of weird, aged electrical headaches in my time. Fender amps that routinely, and randomly, gave me a shock when I played my guitar thru them due to stuff like this.
Here's hoping you get it worked out, Roboturner91.
Here's hoping you get it worked out, Roboturner91.
Hi,
I have been following your thread carefully.
Polarized plugs were instituted strictly as a "safety protection" device for personal protection and have absolutely nothing to do with your problem unless you have(had) a hot chassis and put the unit on a grounded water pipe.
For years audio equipment ,and most other household electrical devices,had regular plugs and they operated fine regardless of how the plug was oriented in the wall receptacle.
As far as a neutral wire issue, I will say this, I have personally witnessed a loose lug on the main neutral wire in the panel or bad neutral connection from the utility company cause a lot of problems with the operation of electrical appliances/devices.
Just for curiosity, can you please post some pics of your main electrical panel and maybe the outside meter/electrical service.
That will answer some of the questions about the age/condition of your home's electrical system and put at least some of the speculation to rest.
Disclaimer: Been a commercial/residential electrician for well over 50 years,seeing it all from old knob and tube residential up through commercial 480V 3 Phase.
As Walter Brennan used to say "no brag-just fact" for those of you old enough to remember.
Bob
I have been following your thread carefully.
Polarized plugs were instituted strictly as a "safety protection" device for personal protection and have absolutely nothing to do with your problem unless you have(had) a hot chassis and put the unit on a grounded water pipe.
For years audio equipment ,and most other household electrical devices,had regular plugs and they operated fine regardless of how the plug was oriented in the wall receptacle.
As far as a neutral wire issue, I will say this, I have personally witnessed a loose lug on the main neutral wire in the panel or bad neutral connection from the utility company cause a lot of problems with the operation of electrical appliances/devices.
Just for curiosity, can you please post some pics of your main electrical panel and maybe the outside meter/electrical service.
That will answer some of the questions about the age/condition of your home's electrical system and put at least some of the speculation to rest.
Disclaimer: Been a commercial/residential electrician for well over 50 years,seeing it all from old knob and tube residential up through commercial 480V 3 Phase.
As Walter Brennan used to say "no brag-just fact" for those of you old enough to remember.
Bob
Grenadeslio
Lunatic Member
One of my favorite shows back when it first aired, recently caught it on reruns with my lady, she really liked it.
bluestime
AK Subscriber
Could you explain how you made this test? Just the wires or with speakers hooked up?
woodj
Super Member
The plot thickens.
That's on a service usually; since we do not know the circuit configuration maybe it could happen.
Are these 3 prong from the factory?
Roboturner91
Super Member
No.
Twist leads together on one end, multimeter probes to the positive and negative wires on the other end.
I would be lying if I said I 100% understood your meaning, but I believe the house was grounded to a cold water pipe when we bought it. The house inspector recommended a ground rod be installed and it was.
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toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
What we were going for with the speaker wires was to make sure they weren't shorted together, even a loose strand, at one end or the other. Testing each from one end to the other, or twisting them together at one end, will not detect that, but I assume you've visually confirmed you had no shorts.
As for the loose neutral issue: OP reported he hooked up a hair dryer and the voltage dropped from 123 to 119. Is that a normal amount of drop? No one commented on the results so I was curious.
Following with interest as I've done some of my own electrical work and the more I know the better.
As for the loose neutral issue: OP reported he hooked up a hair dryer and the voltage dropped from 123 to 119. Is that a normal amount of drop? No one commented on the results so I was curious.
Following with interest as I've done some of my own electrical work and the more I know the better.
Roboturner91
Super Member
I was curious about that myself which is why I asked earlier.
Did the "hair dryer" test after replacing the outlet and the behavior is about the same.
OutlawSun
Well-Known Member
Yeah that's a possibility considering this pops up on the Wikipedia article on cheater plugs.
"In the professional audio and video fields, the cheater plug has been identified as a serious safety problem. Its casual use as a method for avoiding ground loops in analog audio and video signals (to eliminate hums and buzzes) is dangerous. Bill Whitlock, president of Jensen Transformers, writes, "never, ever use devices such as 3 to 2-prong AC plug adapters, a.k.a. 'ground lifters', to solve a noise problem!" Whitlock relates how an electrical fault in one device that is connected to its electricity source through an ungrounded cheater plug will result in dangerous, high current flowing through audio or video cables. Whitlock notes that in 1997, consumer audio and video equipment electrocuted nine people."
woodj
Super Member
The reason I ask is that if the neutral outlet side is "hot" and is attached to the equipment "common", ground etc.and is also also grounded you have a "hot chassis" which is also grounded while what is supposed to be the live side of the equipment is neutral.
Makes for interesting current flow.
woodj
Super Member
That's how they engineered to work.
satellite
Super Member
I have to clarify this post of mine and say that I'm not so sure this is normal. And I was so sure of myself.
I conducted some experiments, and wasn't able to get a significant voltage drop from my old 210 watt Weller soldering gun, or a decent sized fan on MY circuit.
I did get a 3.3 volt drop with my vacuum cleaner which I'm sure draws a helluva bigger load than your hair dryer, unless you're talking about something like this:
WillVT
Super Member
I have to clarify this post of mine and say that I'm not so sure this is normal. And I was so sure of myself.
I conducted some experiments, and wasn't able to get a significant voltage drop from my old 210 watt Weller soldering gun, or a decent sized fan on MY circuit.
I did get a 3.3 volt drop with my vacuum cleaner which I'm sure draws a helluva bigger load than your hair dryer, unless you're talking about something like this:
Actually, hair dryers are usually up around 1800 watts.
http://energyusecalculator.com/electricity_hairdryer.htm
satellite
Super Member
wow!
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