Todays Speakers vs Vintage Speakers

[Hawkeye83]

$100 says your KEFs aren't *flat* to 20hz, regardless of what the spec sheet says. I say that knowing how much effort it takes to get a dedicated sub to do that in your average listening space.

Agreed there as well! Spec sheet says -3 dB I believe. I don't think they probably hit that either, in-room. Still, they are "full range" and to get that from a new speakers these days means $$$. All I know is I can't afford BRAND NEW speakers that can do what my KEF's can do. New-ish, sure, probably (if I stretch the budget). Vintage, yeah. Brand new, no, not a chance.

Lots of ways to get to audio nirvana, and I haven't heard even half of them yet, so take my opinion for what it cost ya.

 

[EngineerNate]

I think a well done sub setup not only extends the bass but majorly reduces distortion in the mains by letting the drivers do what they're best at. For me, if I'm going to cross to a sub at 60-80hz having an f3 in that range is no problem.

That said, I do like high efficiency and big cones are a good way to get it if the space can handle them. I think that is a better justification for larger speakers/drivers than bass extension.

 

[SiliconTi]

While I'll admit modern tech is a help, it really comes down to a properly designed speaker that is made to sound good, not to look good on paper.

Case in point: Klipsch Heritage line. Still sound great, still selling well, very old designs.

 

[transmaster]

One issue with vintage speakers no matter how good they are is can they be restored. The main issue is the speakers. It took me 5 years to collect the replacement drivers needed to bring back my Warfedale W35’s. There are other great speakers that are much rarer and it is all but impossible to find replacements. Sure in many cases you can substitute speakers but than you lose the sound these speakers were ment to have. Woofers at least in the larger speakers can sometimes be substituted but good luck on tweeters, and midranges.

 

[darkblue94]

Why do so many people have a problem differentiating the spelling of the words lose and loose?

 

[EngineerNate]

Why do so many people have a problem differentiating the spelling of the words lose and loose?

Are you loosing sleep over it?

 

[Putterman]

I am very happy with my system. Think I'll sell it all and start over now.

That's the Audiokarma way.

 

[Harvestor]

Because their chains are too loose...
Time to tighten them up or you might lose them!

 

[darkblue94]

Are you loosing sleep over it?

No but I'm loosing my patience not to mention loosing my mind.

Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most.

 

[3db]

I was at a Audio store and the guy there said that although Vintage speakers are nostalgic. They don't even come close to the sound that is produced with today's speakers.

He basically said that with all of the 3D modeling and technology they can create speakers that produce the absolute best sound.

I had another person say he didn't understand that because all you are doing is pushing air out of box.

I am sure components and materials have improved over the years along along with technology.

Anyone have any input on Today's speakers vs the Advents and Kloss and other vintage speakers of yesteryear?.

Vintage speakers were designed with a "house" sound and people who bought them bought the house sound that appealed to them the most. Today's speakers are designed to be as neutral as possible without coloring the sound with a house sound. Whether you want a neutral sound or a house sound is subjective. I prefer the neutral sound of today's speakers. The flatter response curves, the narrow baffles that minimize diffraction effects of a wider baffle, the better internal bracing of today's speakers cabinets all contribute to a cleaner tighter sound.

 

[transmaster]

Why do so many people have a problem differentiating the spelling of the words lose and loose?

How about then, than, there, their, they’er, to, too, two, bough, bow, tear, tear. If you look at when English was restored at the court language of Britain by Henry VI. The peers set out, on purpose, to make the spelling conventions of the English language as difficult as possible to keep the language exclusive,

 

[GD70]

My observations with new/er vs. vintage as of last night's listening session. This was at lowish volume as my wife was asleep.

My newest acquisition is a set of Vienna Acoustics Mozarts, from 2005, the youngest speakers I own. They sound very good, and beautiful rosewood veneer cabs. Worth 2K+ when new, not to me. They have pretty good bass for twin 5 inch mid-woofer drivers and the highs are delicate and airy. Worth 2K+ when new, not to me. I also listened to my restored 1963 KLH Six's.

The Mozarts powered with 210wpc SS amp, the Six's powered with 35wpc tube amp.
At the same volume, playing the same song, the Six's bass was outstanding, the Mozarts couldn't come close. The highs went to the Mozarts with tone settings set flat. With the Six's, to equal the highs, I needed to add a little treble, not quite 2 o'clock position, to equal the Mozarts.
So my take away with this comparison was the newer technology drivers and crossovers and cab design vs. the vintage was not really better, and in this case, were not as good as the Six's.

Two years ago, I attended the NYC Audio show. There were amazing, very expensive systems being demoed. There were maybe 2 systems that blew me away, the rest, nice but nothing I would buy, even if I had the 40-60K to play with.
The next morning while it was all fresh in my mind, I went to the cave, and listened to my main system, listening the the ADS 910's, at equal volumes that I heard at the show. My vintage system sounded just as good and better than most of the gear I heard the day before. Again, vintage can sound just as good as modern gear from my experiences.

 

[Mark Davis]

Again Thank you all for your input. It has been a pleasure reading everyone's thoughts and opinions!!!!

 

[transmaster]

I think a well done sub setup not only extends the bass but majorly reduces distortion in the mains by letting the drivers do what they're best at. For me, if I'm going to cross to a sub at 60-80hz having an f3 in that range is no problem.

That said, I do like high efficiency and big cones are a good way to get it if the space can handle them. I think that is a better justification for larger speakers/drivers than bass extension.

That is exactly what I found with the Monitor 10B’s. I like pipe organs, especially Wurlitzer's, the 10B’s got ugly when these beauties started thumping, and roaring in their lower ranks. With the Edition of the subwoofer and the removal of 70Hz down the 10B’s were transformed. A powered subwoofer is a great way to buffer a vintage speaker system. You can operate these old systems with optimal watt levels, much lower than is common now, note I am not thinking of adding a subwoofer to the large speaker arrays like a Wharfdale W90 but the smaller systems like the AR’s.

 

[tubed]

I think a well done sub setup not only extends the bass but majorly reduces distortion in the mains by letting the drivers do what they're best at. For me, if I'm going to cross to a sub at 60-80hz having an f3 in that range is no problem.

I agree "well done" low frequencies enhance the midrange.
How do you plan to eliminate the distorted low frequencies of the mains?

 

[EngineerNate]

I agree "well done" low frequencies enhance the midrange.
How do you plan to eliminate the distorted low frequencies of the mains?

High pass filters.

 

[tubed]

High pass filters.

Digital or passive?

 

[EngineerNate]

Right now digital. I have plans to make a passive line level crossover and compare to the digital approach. I bought a little audio interface and a small form factor PC to do digital room correction and I found some plans and a couple of different kits to check out for line level active analog crossovers.

 

[GD70]

I agree "well done" low frequencies enhance the midrange.
How do you plan to eliminate the distorted low frequencies of the mains?

Exactly the situation with my SMG's and Supercube II. The sub relieves the maggies allowing much louder volumes without distortion and adds the terrific low end.

 

[Whaddup]

Do modern TVs offer better picture quality vs TVs from the 60s,70s, and 80s? Do modern microwaves offer better performance than microwaves of the 60s, 70s, and 80s?
Cars? Home furnaces? Cars? Power tools? Everything made? This is your answer.

I notice you typed cars twice. I think the best cars were made in the late 60's- early 70's. The best lawn mowers as well.