50nstillhifi
Super Member
They will negotiate.. or stop negotiating.. mostly on "how badly you want it".. meaning you (the buyer with $$) steer the "bargain barometer".
What to offer a dealer on a used car
- Thread starter toxcrusadr
- Start date
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
Because happen to be a dealer I can't have an opinion?
I didn't interpret it that way. You are certainly entitled to an opinion and thanks for sharing it.
I agree American cars are a lot better than they were years ago. The difference between my wife's '80 Pontiac Sunbird (a fairly 'small' car by US standards at the time) and Japanese cars of that era was much greater than comparable cars today.
Frankly I would not have a problem with driving many other brands. I drove some Nissan and Hyundai and Toyota when I was shopping a year ago and they seemed fine mechanically. I don't like the Toyota front ends (ugh! really don't), the Mazda 3 I drove seemed very plastic-y inside, and so on. I can't complain about any of these with the Civic. And people do tend to gravitate to what they're used to, especially if the last one was pretty darn good. As for the current car, the wife is going to drive it so I'm mostly a consultant. 
I didn't interpret it that way. You are certainly entitled to an opinion and thanks for sharing it.
I agree American cars are a lot better than they were years ago. The difference between my wife's '80 Pontiac Sunbird (a fairly 'small' car by US standards at the time) and Japanese cars of that era was much greater than comparable cars today.
When I had prefaced my earlier remark with "I personally think...", I thought that sufficient to convey I was rendering an opinion. No harm, no foul.
Anyway, to each his own. De gustibus non est disputandum - In matters of taste there are no disputes.
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toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
It's all good.
Funny story: We also drove a Mazda CX-5. Also a lady salesperson, and she really wanted my wife to see ALL the fabulous electronic features. As though that would sell the car. So we go for a drive, her in the back seat (why do they always climb in without you inviting them?). Continual patter about how wonderful Mazda engineering and technology is. Mention any other brand, Mazda has perfected whatever they tried to do. Complain about hard seats in another car you drove, she says Mazda seats are SO good that she has friends who MUST have Mazdas because if they drive 2 hours to Kansas City in any other car, they can't walk when they get out! It just goes on and on. I'm biting my tongue since this is not my deal. Start talking about CVT transmissions, does this vehicle have one, etc. No it doesn't. Wife asks, "So what kind of a transmission does it have?" Which you or I might not have asked - it's an automatic so presumably it's a traditional type of automatic transmission. Instead of saying that though, or passing it off, she demonstrates having no actual knowledge about the drivetrain by saying...wait for it..."Oh, uh....it's a dual overhead cam system."
I almost spit coffee on the windshield but somehow held it in.
Funny story: We also drove a Mazda CX-5. Also a lady salesperson, and she really wanted my wife to see ALL the fabulous electronic features. As though that would sell the car. So we go for a drive, her in the back seat (why do they always climb in without you inviting them?). Continual patter about how wonderful Mazda engineering and technology is. Mention any other brand, Mazda has perfected whatever they tried to do. Complain about hard seats in another car you drove, she says Mazda seats are SO good that she has friends who MUST have Mazdas because if they drive 2 hours to Kansas City in any other car, they can't walk when they get out! It just goes on and on. I'm biting my tongue since this is not my deal. Start talking about CVT transmissions, does this vehicle have one, etc. No it doesn't. Wife asks, "So what kind of a transmission does it have?" Which you or I might not have asked - it's an automatic so presumably it's a traditional type of automatic transmission. Instead of saying that though, or passing it off, she demonstrates having no actual knowledge about the drivetrain by saying...wait for it..."Oh, uh....it's a dual overhead cam system."
I almost spit coffee on the windshield but somehow held it in.
I don't know what's up with that! I never was really motivated to own their cars, but never ruled them out either. Those Toyota and Lexus models with that big ugly gaping black gash on the front is IMHO a very poor styling decision, and not at all appealing. But it's a trend--it'll pass, and the next generations likely will look better.
Oh jeesh, what a dolt!!I almost spit coffee on the windshield but somehow held it in.
Motor Trend was running a series online, posted by a car salesman with an insider look at the business. Good reading if you have a few minutes! (And it proves there are both good and bad salespeople out there, both bad as in deceptive, or bad as in clueless/not cut out for the job.)
https://www.google.com/search?q=motor+trend+car+salesman+confidential
Old Ears too
Super Member
If the car your wife is looking at (the 2016 Accord) is actually a CPO vehicle from a Honda dealer, it should have more than a 12k/12month extended warranty on it. Our last CPO Honda came with a 7 yrs/100k miles one if I recall correctly. Note, this is from the 'In Service' date of the vehicle.
When they ask what it will take for her to drive it home, hit them up with "You already have my offer for what it will take."
- As a bit of background, I worked as a 'salesman' at an Acura dealer for one week way back in '93. I had a customer, couple actually, come in on a rainy night (I know, rare here in So Cal) looking at buying a Legend. We talked for a while and he explained they were going to Europe but wanted to buy a car when they got back at the end of the month. While I was getting a brochure for them I told my manager they were interested. He immediately got the top sales guy involved. Now this guy was, to me anyways, your prototypical sleazebag sales guy. Slick suit, slick hair, slick talking, sounded like he was from Jersey (hey wait, I'm from Jersey too!). Anyway, they (manager+slick) sit down in a booth and start in on the couple. They end up walking out without a deal being made, and it's well past closing time so I'm outa there. I go in the next day and explain why they didn't close the deal. They didn't want a new car sitting in the garage for 2 weeks while they were in Europe. Manager's jaw drops, 'I didn't know that'....Duh, you didn't talk to them you brow beat them instead. I ended up quiting right then and there as that is not how I was told they sold cars there when I hired in. Another dealers training session started out with "Everyone who walks onto our lot has $800 of YOUR money in their pocket." I didn't go to work there either.
I've sold a lot of our cars out of my garage. Got full asking for them too. Now, I'd rather just take it to CarMax and not deal with the public.
If the 2016 isn't the way you'd want it if ordering it new, tell you wife to walk away. There's plenty of them out there, even in the middle of Missouri.
When they ask what it will take for her to drive it home, hit them up with "You already have my offer for what it will take."
- As a bit of background, I worked as a 'salesman' at an Acura dealer for one week way back in '93. I had a customer, couple actually, come in on a rainy night (I know, rare here in So Cal) looking at buying a Legend. We talked for a while and he explained they were going to Europe but wanted to buy a car when they got back at the end of the month. While I was getting a brochure for them I told my manager they were interested. He immediately got the top sales guy involved. Now this guy was, to me anyways, your prototypical sleazebag sales guy. Slick suit, slick hair, slick talking, sounded like he was from Jersey (hey wait, I'm from Jersey too!). Anyway, they (manager+slick) sit down in a booth and start in on the couple. They end up walking out without a deal being made, and it's well past closing time so I'm outa there. I go in the next day and explain why they didn't close the deal. They didn't want a new car sitting in the garage for 2 weeks while they were in Europe. Manager's jaw drops, 'I didn't know that'....Duh, you didn't talk to them you brow beat them instead. I ended up quiting right then and there as that is not how I was told they sold cars there when I hired in. Another dealers training session started out with "Everyone who walks onto our lot has $800 of YOUR money in their pocket." I didn't go to work there either.
I've sold a lot of our cars out of my garage. Got full asking for them too. Now, I'd rather just take it to CarMax and not deal with the public.
If the 2016 isn't the way you'd want it if ordering it new, tell you wife to walk away. There's plenty of them out there, even in the middle of Missouri.
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
Doesn't look like 7 years to me! I wish. Here's what the dealer's website lists for THIS car:
* Powertrain Limited Warranty: 84 Month/100,000 Mile (whichever comes first) from original in-service date
* Limited Warranty: 12 Month/12,000 Mile (whichever comes first) after new car warranty expires or from certified purchase date
Car is a 2016 and my notes say there is an original 3 yr/36k miles warranty on the entire car. So if it was bought, say, 1/1/6, it has two months of that warranty left, then a year of additional on the whole car, plus whatever is left of the powertrain warranty from the orig. date of purchase.
Thx for the story. Don't worry, I'm telling her as often as I can. She gets impatient and wants to move on to the next chore. Buying a car is second only to buying a house though, it requires some patience, IMO. Also, I don't like to let the douchebags win.
* Powertrain Limited Warranty: 84 Month/100,000 Mile (whichever comes first) from original in-service date
* Limited Warranty: 12 Month/12,000 Mile (whichever comes first) after new car warranty expires or from certified purchase date
Car is a 2016 and my notes say there is an original 3 yr/36k miles warranty on the entire car. So if it was bought, say, 1/1/6, it has two months of that warranty left, then a year of additional on the whole car, plus whatever is left of the powertrain warranty from the orig. date of purchase.
Thx for the story. Don't worry, I'm telling her as often as I can. She gets impatient and wants to move on to the next chore. Buying a car is second only to buying a house though, it requires some patience, IMO. Also, I don't like to let the douchebags win.
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
It does seem they are offering a whopping 1 year of extra warranty - or less than that because we'll use this thing for trips and rack up at least 12k in less than a year - for a $1200 premium over KBB. My graph earlier in the thread of price vs. mileage for the same car shows the same discrepancy. Yet they say they're selling it for 'market rate.'
Poultrygeist
Lunatic Member
I much prefer to buy a used car from an individual. You can tell so much more from the individual and they can often produce invaluable maintenance records plus a good reason for selling the car. If the seller lives in a well kept house and yard more than likely they take care of their cars. It's far easier to dicker with a private seller. My favorite question after hearing their asking price is to ask "so what's the least you'll take for the car?" With that simple question I've had owners drop their price by $500.
Dealers have no scruples and will say or do anything. Quote one price over the phone and then another when you get there. Just recently new Kia Souls were advertised here on TV for $11,990. Called them on the phone late one evening and they said they had plenty at that price in various colors. Went there early next morning and was told they sold them all and then they tried to sell me on more expensive models. That same ad ran again that night and all week long. Although illegal, bait and switch tactics are alive and well in our country.
Dealers have no scruples and will say or do anything. Quote one price over the phone and then another when you get there. Just recently new Kia Souls were advertised here on TV for $11,990. Called them on the phone late one evening and they said they had plenty at that price in various colors. Went there early next morning and was told they sold them all and then they tried to sell me on more expensive models. That same ad ran again that night and all week long. Although illegal, bait and switch tactics are alive and well in our country.
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
True about private sellers. Trouble is she wants a late model one with limited miles and an uncommon trim package, in a city of 150,000, and there just aren't that many of them around except for trade-ins or leased cars from people who get a new one every couple years. Which you find at the dealers. Would be easier if we were looking for a lightly older or less special model.
50nstillhifi
Super Member
So many cars.... so few people to own and drive them all... 
If you really want to know how a vehicle will perform for future ownership... rent it for the weekend and take a trip.
You'd be amazed at what you will learn!!
If you really want to know how a vehicle will perform for future ownership... rent it for the weekend and take a trip.
You'd be amazed at what you will learn!!
savatage1973
Addicted Member
Buy new--order what she wants and tell her to shut the f*ck up. Other than that, the dealers won't help you much because "dealer trades" and shipping to your destination are not making them any money. Either that, or check off a few boxes that are not "deal-breakers".
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
Thanks for your kind advice. I'll tell her to shut the f*ck up next chance I get.
I'm actually the one who's more against buying new. That car is $30,000+ new and you can find one with 25k miles on it for $20k and change. We are not $30k car buyers, especially when the depreciation is that much in just a couple of years.
The right car will come along. It's just more work avoiding the salesmens' snares. $200 mystery 'fee' that goes away if I take a loan? BS. Think of the audio gadgets I could buy.
I'm actually the one who's more against buying new. That car is $30,000+ new and you can find one with 25k miles on it for $20k and change. We are not $30k car buyers, especially when the depreciation is that much in just a couple of years.
The right car will come along. It's just more work avoiding the salesmens' snares. $200 mystery 'fee' that goes away if I take a loan? BS. Think of the audio gadgets I could buy.
savatage1973
Addicted Member
Thanks for your kind advice. I'll tell her to shut the f*ck up next chance I get.
Wasn't meaning to be rude, but it seems like you got the joke. But looking for a VERY specifically equipped vehicle (knowing that it is a "rare" package) in the perfect shade of whatever color with XXX # of miles and for XXX price has the odds of winning the PowerBall. Unless you order exactly what you want new, some compromises are going to have to be made. I'd have rather had my new Jag (the one in my avatar) in all black on black on black, but getting a dealer demo (the owner's demo car) with 3300 miles on it in charcoal grey saved me over $25K off sticker--I can live with that, so all is good. My new Challenger HellCat RedEye was a different story--I ordered it exactly the way I wanted it, had to wait weeks to get it, and paid pretty much MSRP--but it is a "rare" car to start with, and (at this point in my life), I just really didn't care, so I just bent over and bit the pillow, so to speak.
Good luck with the search. If necessary, maybe widen the net and see what turns up that can be shipped to your locale--you may have to take a little "hit" to do that, but it will surely be less than MSRP on a new one. Happy Hunting!!!
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
Ford Fusion, I've driven it from the company motor pool, seems OK. Not sure the wife has. Worth a look if not. I love my 95 Ranger but that was a long time ago.
Unfortunately the Toyotas have a hideous front end look these days (IMO) and I would scratch my own eyes out of she bought one. I don't care if it's the most reliable and fun car on the road, it looks awful.
Unfortunately the Toyotas have a hideous front end look these days (IMO) and I would scratch my own eyes out of she bought one. I don't care if it's the most reliable and fun car on the road, it looks awful.
Poultrygeist
Lunatic Member
How did those cowcatcher grills suddenly become so popular?
Shadowdog
Super Member
I don't like the Toyota front end either!
My father has had his 2017 Ecoboost 1.5 SE Fusion with no troubles for a year now. They are quiet and solid feeling along with nice handling. I fix my own and even if I had the $ to buy new I would still stick to RWD based platforms as they are much easier and less costly to fix.
My father has had his 2017 Ecoboost 1.5 SE Fusion with no troubles for a year now. They are quiet and solid feeling along with nice handling. I fix my own and even if I had the $ to buy new I would still stick to RWD based platforms as they are much easier and less costly to fix.
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savatage1973
Addicted Member
The recall for the steering wheel literally falling off in your hands.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...-fusion-lincoln-mkz-steering-wheel/423395002/
Ford Fusion, I've driven it from the company motor pool, seems OK. Not sure the wife has. Worth a look if not. I love my 95 Ranger but that was a long time ago.
Unfortunately the Toyotas have a hideous front end look these days (IMO) and I would scratch my own eyes out of she bought one. I don't care if it's the most reliable and fun car on the road, it looks awful.
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