Gun Porn

I strongly support you schools position on arming staff. I spent 10 years here in my community as a School Resources Officer, by far the most rewarding law enforcement job I've ever had. Teachers and cops are a natural fit, as long as the focus is on what's best for the youth, district and community.

I was fortunate I worked with some awesome school administrators, and teachers who were awesome, we were a team, this was not a cop in a school system, this was a cop on a team of folks doing and making informed choices which were in the best interest of our community and our youth.

Face it, our youth are our future leaders. What better way to teach them then to incorporate all of them into solution identification.

An example is, I'd see a minor crime committed, I'd contact the student and ask them to drop by my office when they were available. When the youth got their I would explain the violation. I would read exactly what the law said, and then I would ask them, " how you going to solve the issue" We let them fix it, as long as their solution was " reasonable"

The trick was don't let their solution be so outlandish, that we allowed the kid to set themselves up to fail, knowing the solution they offered up was pie in the sky. Again the question is " what's reasonable"

This was in the mid 90s.welearned that once the kids knew the rules, that the kids made good informed choices, generally.

The teachers and me introduced a class we called it " law Chat". I made a huge mistake, my wife's a teacher so I prepared a ciriculm, went into class and failed miserably. So I winged it, I asked the kids to ask law related questions they wanted answered, and we explored the written letter of the law, and reasonable parts. We talked about " teachable moments, and the class was to,my surprise a complete sucess, the students made it so.


I was always amused the absolute first legal questions in EVERY first class where's sex related, boys girls age and consequences. I,taught search and seizure anywhere the students wanted to go. They were read the rules and we discussed application and outcomes, in their language.

St one point I was advised by the teachers that on Friday nights my associates were pulling the kids over and without Proboable cause searching the cars. The teachers were offended and asked me to educate the students on their rights. And I did.

After those classes were over. I got called into the Chiefs office, all the command was present and they were pissed. Seems my associates were pissed that I was teaching our community youth, their constitutional rights. I was floored, I was pissed and I pushed right back.

Two commanders ordered me to NOT teach search and seizure. And I told then to F off. Our youth had every right to know what their rights are. We had an obligation to teach them.

I was disiplined over this, cuz I told then to F off. Went to the school told the admin and teachers I'd be gone for a week, and told them why. The school district called the district attorney demanding an audience. Once the DA learned what the PD admin had suggested he called a meeting between everybody.

I was called in and ordered to not repeat what the commanders had said in the closed door meeting. Yea right. Sure chief.
Someone invited the media. " not me". By the end of the day. Two commanders had been demoted, and the media made a huge deal about it. The unlawful car searches were a big deal. And not happening anymore.

The teachers school admin saved me. And they were right. Truth of the matter is, the chief should have been fired aswell. I should mention that the DA and the Judges were very involved in this SRO program, we as a team had turned our youth, their education and their rights into a win win situation.

Sadly I felt huge heat. And I just wasn't comfortable working for a police department who wanted me to lie to our youth.

The SRO,program was the best ten years of my 25 year career. Nothing but respect for my associates within our school districts. Not so much for my old agency.

With a heavy heart I retired about six months later, went back to California, where I'd started.

Sorry long winded. Our youth our schools, everybody in those schools need to be protected at all costs.

I was involved in the SRO thing early on and was able to set security protocols for our community. As an example in the infancy of SROs doctrine for school shooters was for officer to respond but to await for at least a second officer before entering.

That can not happen,, seconds count people are being killed. And I got in trouble for telling the bosses I refused to wait, I was going after the shooter, ain't no waiting. Their was no love loss between me and them,

I'm so pleased that your school has the wisdom to see what needs to happen. I believe schools with armed staff with not be targeted. Make sure you have HUGE signs at every entrance announcing school staff are armed and cleared to aggressively engage a shooter.


Congrats to you and your district

Dirk Williams
Retired Police Officer Oregon
Retired Deputy Sheriff California.
 
I strongly support you schools position on arming staff. I spent 10 years here in my community as a School Resources Officer, by far the most rewarding law enforcement job I've ever had. Teachers and cops are a natural fit, as long as the focus is on what's best for the youth, district and community.

I was fortunate I worked with some awesome school administrators, and teachers who were awesome, we were a team, this was not a cop in a school system, this was a cop on a team of folks doing and making informed choices which were in the best interest of our community and our youth.

Face it, our youth are our future leaders. What better way to teach them then to incorporate all of them into solution identification.

An example is, I'd see a minor crime committed, I'd contact the student and ask them to drop by my office when they were available. When the youth got their I would explain the violation. I would read exactly what the law said, and then I would ask them, " how you going to solve the issue" We let them fix it, as long as their solution was " reasonable"

The trick was don't let their solution be so outlandish, that we allowed the kid to set themselves up to fail, knowing the solution they offered up was pie in the sky. Again the question is " what's reasonable"

This was in the mid 90s.welearned that once the kids knew the rules, that the kids made good informed choices, generally.

The teachers and me introduced a class we called it " law Chat". I made a huge mistake, my wife's a teacher so I prepared a ciriculm, went into class and failed miserably. So I winged it, I asked the kids to ask law related questions they wanted answered, and we explored the written letter of the law, and reasonable parts. We talked about " teachable moments, and the class was to,my surprise a complete sucess, the students made it so.


I was always amused the absolute first legal questions in EVERY first class where's sex related, boys girls age and consequences. I,taught search and seizure anywhere the students wanted to go. They were read the rules and we discussed application and outcomes, in their language.

St one point I was advised by the teachers that on Friday nights my associates were pulling the kids over and without Proboable cause searching the cars. The teachers were offended and asked me to educate the students on their rights. And I did.

After those classes were over. I got called into the Chiefs office, all the command was present and they were pissed. Seems my associates were pissed that I was teaching our community youth, their constitutional rights. I was floored, I was pissed and I pushed right back.

Two commanders ordered me to NOT teach search and seizure. And I told then to F off. Our youth had every right to know what their rights are. We had an obligation to teach them.

I was disiplined over this, cuz I told then to F off. Went to the school told the admin and teachers I'd be gone for a week, and told them why. The school district called the district attorney demanding an audience. Once the DA learned what the PD admin had suggested he called a meeting between everybody.

I was called in and ordered to not repeat what the commanders had said in the closed door meeting. Yea right. Sure chief.
Someone invited the media. " not me". By the end of the day. Two commanders had been demoted, and the media made a huge deal about it. The unlawful car searches were a big deal. And not happening anymore.

The teachers school admin saved me. And they were right. Truth of the matter is, the chief should have been fired aswell. I should mention that the DA and the Judges were very involved in this SRO program, we as a team had turned our youth, their education and their rights into a win win situation.

Sadly I felt huge heat. And I just wasn't comfortable working for a police department who wanted me to lie to our youth.

The SRO,program was the best ten years of my 25 year career. Nothing but respect for my associates within our school districts. Not so much for my old agency.

With a heavy heart I retired about six months later, went back to California, where I'd started.

Sorry long winded. Our youth our schools, everybody in those schools need to be protected at all costs.

I was involved in the SRO thing early on and was able to set security protocols for our community. As an example in the infancy of SROs doctrine for school shooters was for officer to respond but to await for at least a second officer before entering.

That can not happen,, seconds count people are being killed. And I got in trouble for telling the bosses I refused to wait, I was going after the shooter, ain't no waiting. Their was no love loss between me and them,

I'm so pleased that your school has the wisdom to see what needs to happen. I believe schools with armed staff with not be targeted. Make sure you have HUGE signs at every entrance announcing school staff are armed and cleared to aggressively engage a shooter.


Congrats to you and your district

Dirk Williams
Retired Police Officer Oregon
Retired Deputy Sheriff California.


Thank you for your amazing story and your commitment to protecting and educating those kids. It's a shame that your time as SRO ended in disappointment. We've always had an SRO, but until this year, the SRO was an on-duty policeman who didn't want to be in the school and took every opportunity to leave the campus. Fortunately, that's changed, and we now have a dedicated officer who has kids in the school. He wants to be there.

Before moving to administration, I taught social studies - American History and American Government. I inserted a 6-week program of "Street Law" into the Government class that the students loved. It was much like what you taught your kids. I agree that kids should be taught their rights and responsibilities under the law. It was one of the most rewarding things I've ever done as an educator.

I also agree that when confronted with a shooter, there isn't time to waste. We have been trained to buy time. Police response time has been estimated at 3-5 minutes. That's how much time we have to try to buy. If we can do that, law enforcement can take over. The problem is that a lot of bad stuff can happen in that amount of time. We just hope that we can get there early.

And yes, every door in the district has a large, obnoxious sticker that reads, "PROTECTED BY ARMED SECURITY." We're in the process of making large street signs to post at all vehicular entrances as well. Hopefully, that will serve as a deterrent.

The one area that seems lacking to us is the training. We only got 40 hours before being certified. To deal with this lack of training, some of us are planning to become Level II law enforcement officers (those who work less than 20 hours per month). We will get 240 hours of training, which should help us in the event of an actual shooting. I'm not exactly sure what this training will include, but I am sure that it will be better than what we've had so far.
 
You guys will be ok, the key to response is training, entry/exit points, the truth of the matter is you have anybody with a gun in a school, the switch has been flipped. That individual needs to be addressed swiftly. " If" the shooters NOT shooting, oppertunity exists to talk them down from cover, in fact if that situation pops up, the shooter hasn't engaged anybody a great oppertunity exists to talk them down.

I have to share a concern with you. I'm sick and tired of all the needless killing by my brothers and sisters, of innocent people. Their is no need for it. I attribute these senseless killings as piss poor police training, and then the District Attorney's protecting the police shooter.

I also attribute the killing of unarmed citizens to cops who are a poor fit in law enforcement. It is rare that a cop is held accountable for,what is clearly a murder, under the color of authority. A badge and the trust of the people, we police serve is not a license to kill. I expect better from EVERY officer.

Back to your school. I've got one piece of advice, shoot, shoot and shoot some more. Try combat pistol courses, " if part of your job description is " protection of the kids" which it is, you may be able to write off th ammo and training.

I attended many trainings at my own expense, which I was able to write off. I spent a great deal of time at weapons related schools, from advance advance sniper schools to entry, to advanced pistol schools, not to be a better shooter, but to better understand that I didn't need to shoot.

May I suggest a book to read, it's named " On Killing" I think it's Dr Fackler, contribution. I may have the author wrong. Anyways their are several studies and books available to better understand the mind of a shooter, again it's all tools to learn with and from.,

Lastly I need you to understand this killing a fellow american citizen, in our home community is nothing like killing an enemy combatant in dirkadirkastan, the physiology of killing a fellow citizens in our own home community is devastating for the shooter, their wife, their children. It is likely that you, your family will know the deceased. Their family their extended family. Shop in the same stores, perhaps even pray in the same house of worship.

The personal costs is HUGE. A healthy relationship with ones higher power, whom I call God, is helpful.


Bottom line know yourselves, know your strengths, know your weaknesses. The wise man works very hard on their weaknesses. I know I do. I try hard to move my weaknesses into,my strengths side. God forbid, you have to address a shooter, and shots have been fired, the focus, for you must be locate and kill the shooter. All the while you may be passing your kids in the hallway whom are seriously injured, and asking, begging for your assistance.

That's a tough one, but you MUST first shut the shooter down.

One of the protocols I developed was to instantly dial 911, as I moved thru the school, keeping a running dialog for the dispatchers. Don't answer questions just talk, identify who,you,are, that you are an armed teacher and that you are searching to,engage the shooter. As you walk describe exactly what your wearing, " this is critical" but continue to hunt, describing everything you seem , locations where the shots are coming from, numbers of students down, should you cross empty bullet casing, identify possible caliber, it you can't try to identify pistol VS rifle casings.

Keep talking and putting your location out, and where you think your going, which will be the fastest route to the shooter. When you do locate the shooter, don't announce your arrival shot him/her, shot them until,they are no longer a threat. Move forward and recover their weapon. " understand that you just picked up critical evidence" however leaving the shooters weapon is unexceptable.

After your certain their are no more shooters, you have secured the weapons, immediately start EMS, on your students, starting with the gravest wounded. Realize that some are not going to make it. ,remain focused and continue to talk on your cell to 911.

You will be the police's eyes and ears, direct them in and to your exact location. Dispatch will also be directing EMS, per your detailed directions you gave as you moved to engage the bad guy. The Intel you putting out WILL save lives.

Understand that after the incident your weapon, and any officers involved will have their weapons sized as evidence. It's ok, it routine stuff.

Also understand you may be read your rights per Miranda " I've had my weapon Siezed three times in my career" along with Miranda rights read to me. It's surreal, but it's just how it works. Understand that you may not know the answers to the questions being asked. It's ok the schools indoor cameras will have tracked you, and documented your actions.

I'll leave it at that. Carrying a weapon comes with a lot of responsibility. While your actions will be questioned, your going to be fine.

Sorry I just think it important to understand the nuts and bolts of how it works.

Best to you. I'm really proud of you and your district for stepping up and finding solutions that are truly in the best interests of your community.



Dirk Williams
 
You guys will be ok, the key to response is training, entry/exit points, the truth of the matter is you have anybody with a gun in a school, the switch has been flipped. That individual needs to be addressed swiftly. " If" the shooters NOT shooting, oppertunity exists to talk them down from cover, in fact if that situation pops up, the shooter hasn't engaged anybody a great oppertunity exists to talk them down.

I have to share a concern with you. I'm sick and tired of all the needless killing by my brothers and sisters, of innocent people. Their is no need for it. I attribute these senseless killings as piss poor police training, and then the District Attorney's protecting the police shooter.

I also attribute the killing of unarmed citizens to cops who are a poor fit in law enforcement. It is rare that a cop is held accountable for,what is clearly a murder, under the color of authority. A badge and the trust of the people, we police serve is not a license to kill. I expect better from EVERY officer.

Back to your school. I've got one piece of advice, shoot, shoot and shoot some more. Try combat pistol courses, " if part of your job description is " protection of the kids" which it is, you may be able to write off th ammo and training.

I attended many trainings at my own expense, which I was able to write off. I spent a great deal of time at weapons related schools, from advance advance sniper schools to entry, to advanced pistol schools, not to be a better shooter, but to better understand that I didn't need to shoot.

May I suggest a book to read, it's named " On Killing" I think it's Dr Fackler, contribution. I may have the author wrong. Anyways their are several studies and books available to better understand the mind of a shooter, again it's all tools to learn with and from.,

Lastly I need you to understand this killing a fellow american citizen, in our home community is nothing like killing an enemy combatant in dirkadirkastan, the physiology of killing a fellow citizens in our own home community is devastating for the shooter, their wife, their children. It is likely that you, your family will know the deceased. Their family their extended family. Shop in the same stores, perhaps even pray in the same house of worship.

The personal costs is HUGE. A healthy relationship with ones higher power, whom I call God, is helpful.


Bottom line know yourselves, know your strengths, know your weaknesses. The wise man works very hard on their weaknesses. I know I do. I try hard to move my weaknesses into,my strengths side. God forbid, you have to address a shooter, and shots have been fired, the focus, for you must be locate and kill the shooter. All the while you may be passing your kids in the hallway whom are seriously injured, and asking, begging for your assistance.

That's a tough one, but you MUST first shut the shooter down.

One of the protocols I developed was to instantly dial 911, as I moved thru the school, keeping a running dialog for the dispatchers. Don't answer questions just talk, identify who,you,are, that you are an armed teacher and that you are searching to,engage the shooter. As you walk describe exactly what your wearing, " this is critical" but continue to hunt, describing everything you seem , locations where the shots are coming from, numbers of students down, should you cross empty bullet casing, identify possible caliber, it you can't try to identify pistol VS rifle casings.

Keep talking and putting your location out, and where you think your going, which will be the fastest route to the shooter. When you do locate the shooter, don't announce your arrival shot him/her, shot them until,they are no longer a threat. Move forward and recover their weapon. " understand that you just picked up critical evidence" however leaving the shooters weapon is unexceptable.

After your certain their are no more shooters, you have secured the weapons, immediately start EMS, on your students, starting with the gravest wounded. Realize that some are not going to make it. ,remain focused and continue to talk on your cell to 911.

You will be the police's eyes and ears, direct them in and to your exact location. Dispatch will also be directing EMS, per your detailed directions you gave as you moved to engage the bad guy. The Intel you putting out WILL save lives.

Understand that after the incident your weapon, and any officers involved will have their weapons sized as evidence. It's ok, it routine stuff.

Also understand you may be read your rights per Miranda " I've had my weapon Siezed three times in my career" along with Miranda rights read to me. It's surreal, but it's just how it works. Understand that you may not know the answers to the questions being asked. It's ok the schools indoor cameras will have tracked you, and documented your actions.

I'll leave it at that. Carrying a weapon comes with a lot of responsibility. While your actions will be questioned, your going to be fine.

Sorry I just think it important to understand the nuts and bolts of how it works.

Best to you. I'm really proud of you and your district for stepping up and finding solutions that are truly in the best interests of your community.



Dirk Williams

Thank you for that. You should be in the business of training LEOs and school security personnel as myself - as everything you just mentioned was part of my training (almost verbatim). You should write a how-to manual for this...seriously.

When I was first approached with this idea, I said no. I wanted no part of it. But after a couple months, I decided that if the worst scenario developed, I just couldn't stand by and do nothing while my kids were harmed. That's why I'm in this situation and seeking advice wherever I can find it. Thanks again!
 
A large-caliber 6-shot snubbie is what one might call "40 ounces of security on my hip" :)
(S&W 625, .45 cal. Model Of 1989)

View attachment 1210465

Where did you find a holster for that. I have a 5 inch barreled one. Uh, I mean, I might have one if it didn't fall into the river last summer...

Anyway, it is in a crappy one size fits all nylon holster now, when it's out of it's case, but would love to find a nice one for it. I love the 625. It is a beast. Mine was owned by a competition shooter and has a nice light trigger.
 
I'm amused, when I walked from law enforcement, after 25 ish years, I never looked back. The corruption of a few, tainted us all, especially us honest ones. I will NEVER be a part of any law enforcement agency ever again. I shared my views on the unlawful police shootings. My anger for the system protecting the system, will Never abate.

If I can help guys like you, I'm fine with that.

Keep in mind an entire new industry has evolved out of school saftey. For them, it's about the money, not the children. I could never be apart of that either.

The saftey of our children is far to important then trying to capitalize on. The limited dollars each school district has yearly, needs to be about education. When you split a dime all you have is a nickel.


Best to you.

Dirk Williams
 
May her retirement ROCK. I don't know the name, I think female SRO s do fantastic jobs. They somehow sense the specific need our youth need and for some reason can't or won't ask. Pride especially in Hispanic communities is an amazing thing.

Our community is 60% Hispanic. These wonderful families simply would not except help. So I use to purchesed burritos and other food specific to the Hispanic community. By the 100s. My wife taught in the district aswell. We believed in supporting our people. Not uncommon to purchase 1000 items a year, the food was authentic and fantastic.

For the ten years I was the SRO, our families got authentic cooked foods, when we explained to my parents, my wife's parents aunts and uncles why we purchased quantities to help support 15, sometimes 25 families in the non farming season.

I also worked closely with the local food bank again supporting our families in need. Coats for kids, shoes for kids,

And I delivered it all in my black and white patrol car.

It's Christmas, and I get choked up. I pray that these programs are still happening, although I don't know if they are.

My hours were 7:30 to 4:30, I got to school at 06:00 trouble shot issues needing addressed before school, and I usually got back to the station around 18:30 19:00 long days, but effective days.

Congrats to you lady SRO friend on making it,

Merry Christmas to you all.

Dirk Williams
 
Picked up a new plinker, a Ruger Precision Rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor...any suggestions and/or personal experiences with nice optics for this let me hear them!

Nice "plinker" there, rudedogg! I've been wanting to try the 6.5 Creedmoor in an RPR.

Let us know what you think after you get the chance to shoot it some.

I'm partial to Vortex Optics. Great value for the money. I use a couple of their Crossfire II models and really like them.

Good luck with the plinker,
 
Nice "plinker" there, rudedogg! I've been wanting to try the 6.5 Creedmoor in an RPR.

Let us know what you think after you get the chance to shoot it some.

I'm partial to Vortex Optics. Great value for the money. I use a couple of their Crossfire II models and really like them.

Good luck with the plinker,
Thanks Yamaki.
I have been wanting to get a long range “toy” if you will, for awhile now. When younger, I loved to go into the local quarry and shoot 22lr, .223, and .308 rifles at targets or beer cans ( in a valley with a high natural backstop). I never shoot for fun any more, and I figured this may prompt me to get back into it somewhat. With this rifle, I can go out to the longest local range and really test myself! I think there is a 700 yard range pretty close by.
I still read the occasional gun and sportsman rags, and the RPR has been the talk of the town as a relatively “inexpensive” precision rifle for awhile soooo....
Merry Christmas to me! Lol. I have talked with a few enthusiasts, and as you say, Vortex is highly regarded. Also some recommendations on Night Force optics (ugh!$$$$) as well. I know glass for this will be a little pricey, just want to stay somewhere around $1k or under...
 
Nice stick, lots of nice glass on the market, what's your budget. No arguments with the high end Vortex scopes. I've got three of the the Vortex Razor HDII's their 4.5x27x56, their all the EBR - 2C in MRAD. After I quit shooting for my police agency, I could no longer justify my Schmidt& Bender PM II With thef4 reticles. I've also got three of these on rifles aswell.

The PM II's were 3800.oo, back in the late 90s. By far the best scopes I've used. I changed to the Razor, with our dept letter head we could pick up the razor for 1700.00 and change. A very fine scope. I've also got lupold Mark4s and a MK 6. I'm just not a fan of the mk4 and the MK-6. I'm a fan of a zero F stop, the MK 4 Will dial right thru your zero, screwing up everything. Even on the range I dial down after every shot, then reapply my dope for the next shot. It's just how I do it. I like consistency. I've seen so,e world class shooters fail to dials their turrets back to,zero. Then at the next station range, and dial in their new dope right on top of the last range correction.

I've had the honor of shooting many many high end scopes at sniper schools, some dam fine glass.

If I were purchasing a new scope, and money wasn't an issue I'd be looking for the Tangant Theo, this purchase. remarkable glass. Use to be US Optics. The American scope builders have come light years in glass prism making, some really decent glass on the market.

If you have access, you need to shoot over many different scopes. You need to find what works for you. Every scope has a issue. The S&B PMII tends to tunnel at times once you know the brands weakness their are always work arounds.

Good luck to you.

Dirk Williams
 
1911s are gods gift to pistol,shooters!. I collect 1911s, carried,a,1911 on duty for 25 years. Some very nice pistols here. Also collect Hi Powers.

Priced a 70 series yesterday, it's a colt, and an awesome pistol in perfect condition. 1800.00. I've got 12 already, " not all colts" springfields, Para's Kimber, and believe it or not a Taurus 1911.best 500.00 pistol,I've,ever,shot, triggers sweet, and I'm amazed at the accuracy.

Nice pistols. Yamaki, did you use to be a deputy sheriff in Hood River County?


Dirk
 
Nice pistols. Yamaki, did you use to be a deputy sheriff in Hood River County?

Thanks, Dirk. I spent a lot of time going back and forth on what to buy. I've had wheelguns and semi-auto handguns from Ruger, several Colt, S&W and even Walther. For some reason I ended up with fewer 1911 style handguns and they are all Springfields. I still have my Ruger GP100, a Ruger MKII & MKIV plus one Smith Model 29

No sir, I was never an LEO. My service was through the USAF. I have relatives that have served as an LEO with the OSP, Linn County & Multnomah County Sheriff's Departments and one just retired after an officer with the Woodburn PD.

Are you out in the Hood River area?
 
Yamaki, regarding Hood River, I did spend 18 months with the Hood River County Sheriffs Office. Nice area, I'm from Klamath Falls, and was offed a job back here, with the PD. My family was in KF, so I took the Job. Was good to get home, the agency is/ was very problematic.

Still in KF, have been since 90. Love the area.

Merry Christmas.

Dirk
 
I hesitate to mention this but, it's worth consideration. All my sniper grade rifles each have their own suppressor. I've become a big fan of cans. I still shoot with a crew who are retired Special Forces troopers retired. It's so pleasant to not require ears on the range.

As long as your behind the shooter the DB's are reasonable. We're old and our ears ring constantly anyways so we don't worry about it.

Anyways the reason each rifle has it own can is, a can WILL change zero most of the time. Mine are all tuned to the specific rifle.

Just for fun, my rifles are

338lm
300wm
3006
.308
.243
.223

The 06 is out of the lime up now, being rebarrel ex, with a Krieger #9 26 OAL.
The .223 is really my rat gun but it's accurate to 600y, when I'm having a good day. Rarely shoot rats past 200y.

The .243 was my solution to the 6.5. All my associates all built 6.5s, I'm not one to follow the pack. By the way I'm running the 115 grain DTAC bullets. We routinely stood the .242s and the 6.5s to 1200y. We have hits out to 1670y, one mile. The problem with those shots is calling splash, for corrections. While we leave the mile target it's rare we shoot it anymore.

Before I get reamed about the virtues of the 6.5, it should be understood that the 6.5, the .243. The .260. And the NOW popular 6mms are ballistically the same. The bullet BC"s are incredible.

Shooting those distances requires one to have the ability to accurately measure the distance. Then accurately dial the measure dope and environmental data into the shoot computers.

Crap data in, crap shots. Solid data solid shooting.


Our range is my friends 7k achre ranch, we have 25,,, AR500 targets and roughly 30 mild steel targets we can move, we shoot off of the top of a field in valcano crater picture a high semi circle, we have targets fron 560y to 1760y. Up hill down hill we even have a couple targets in the middle of the lake, it's a shorter steep downhill shot, I love impact and spall hitting the water like a frag granade going off, kinda Kool.

The Kool part is the majority of the targets can be ranged and shot from multiple directions and distances.

The other guys have their still AD " active duty" friends visit and shoot our range. When your with this crowd, you don't ask questions, but you sure here some interesting stuff.

The range is mine, has been since I started building it in 1991. I've had these guys visiting ask if they could bring their friends out and do their " Work Ups" out their. To the man, theve com,ended on just how Sand box-ish the area is.



Lastly the ranch is at 4200ft to 45ooft. In the summer when we're doing our environmental data recording. The DA, " Density Altitude often measure at 9000ft to 11000ft, . If your a shooter you will understand the significance of the actuall differences.

Rather then dialing your dope, for the known 4200 ft. The weather machines are telling us were at 10.000 ft, so you dial that series of numbers into the shoot computers. The " Kestrel line of pocket Weather trackers are amazing tools. If your a serious shooter, you need something capable of measuring DA, and other units of measure wind cross wind, wind direction etc etc.

I'm running a kestrel 4500, she's 9 years old now, I'll be purchasing a new Kestrel end of Jan, or Feb. mines just the weather station, I have a separate shoot computer. Kestrel has perfected the kestrel 6000 or 6500 it's now the weather station and the shoot computer all in one.Their a fantastic piece of kit.

We all have high end range fimders, mine are "Leica binos" Their the " Geovid: 10x42 HD, models. Their now ten years old as well. They work as if their brand new. The goal was a very high end bino, and a range finder combo,.so I don't have to carry a bunch of different pieces of kit.

The last piece of kit that needs to be decent is your spotting scope. I had been using an older German Stiener Spotter, but it just got old , I replace that spotting scope with the newer Vortex Razor HD, 20x60x85 unit with the angled eye piece. This spotting scope is fantastic.

All the guys who are AD, bring their kit when they come out. So I've shot some unreal rifles, and used some gear most are not even aware off. This includes military spotting scopes. I would put this Vortex spotter up against any of the SF guys equipment I've played with. In my humble opinion the Vortex is that good.

Even better a LIFE TIME warrantee!. I've had to send in some early vortex red dot sights, off of my m-4s in,,,,and without question they were replaced without the newer versions. I admit I literally beat the crap out of those red dots, dropping my m4s, sliding down mountains rifle beating on rocks.

I also sent in one of my three HD rifle scopes two years ago. They repaired the scope, something was loose in the turrant . They told me if it came loose again they would replace the scope with a new unit. Solid company.

Wow, if you can't tell I love talking long range and gear.


Good guns require good kit to keep em in the game. I've missed many family vacations to buy a high end piece of kit. I've never regretted it.

Their's just something magical about ranging a target you can hardly see, measuring the environmental's plugging all the dope/data into the computer scrolling to " come ups" dialing the correct numbers pressing the trigger, sweeping to re aquire the target, and calling your own shot, based on bullet " trace" it's very rewarding.

I've never grown tired of the art of lomg range shooting.

I've been fortunate, being a police officer, I've had access to some of the best shooting schools in the nation. I've been instructed by some of the best shoot instructors on the planet. I've paid my own way thru about 1/2 half of the schools. Anything above advance sniper schools came out of my pocket, travel, bullets, room etc etc.

From time to time some of those instructors happen to be in the area, or passing through, and crash here for the night. Our student teacher relationships turned into,some great friendships.

They say LIFE is the lesson. I agree, I would add that we onLy get out of life, what we invest in life. I've been Blessed.


Sorry didn't mean to ramble.

Merry Christmas to you all, and A Happy New Year.

Dirk
 
@Dirk Williams ... I'm headed your way with stacks of rifles and boxes of ammo!!! That range sounds awesome.

What tripod are you using for the spotting scope? I have a cheaper photographer's aluminum one but hate how the thing barely supports the weight of the Vortex I have plus it always seems to droop and move around with the slightest touch. I'm in the market for a better tripod and love the scope I have.

-Michael
 
Mike come on down. I'm available starting Fed 1. I'm having a lower back procedure Jan 23, should be GTG, by the 1st.

I guess I should finish the range description. Their's a pit we use for m4 and pistol, actually theirs two pits. Can shoot up to 90y in the pits.

Like two years ago we set targets down a dry creek bed. the sheriffs office was using it to practice inserts, and exfil The 500 helo Would land quickly, by the count of five the driver was pulling pitch headed out. The deputies would go to ground, when clear a patrol was sent down the creek bed, engaging targets as they moved.

I was safety officer, didn't do any of the fun stuff. Think it went ok. The training is used to magnify problems, many were identified. Police don't have a clue what battle drills are. When you mention flank, they look at their hip. Not understanding that some of the gardens actually have folks I. Them with their shit in one sock.


They picked it up quickly.

Seriously come on down, we may have to set some of the targets, the fall cattle out their, love to use the targets to scratch their backs. Usually a few targets get tipped over. It's no big deal set em, walk back start shooting.


Dirk
 
I'm gonna have to get me a long range rifle! I gave my boys their grandfather's & great grandpa's rifles I had inherited so I have nothing with a tube longer than 16" now, those being both Ruger AR platforms in 5.56 & 7.62.

I've been looking at the SA M1A Loaded and the Ruger Precision Rifle, both in 6.5 Creedmoor. I've never built a rifle for long range nor do I have a lot of experience in setting up for distances beyond 300 yds so I have a pretty steep learning curve nor do I know if a gas or traditional bolt action rifle would be more accurate at longer distances.

I got a buddy down in Roseburg with a SA M1A Loaded in 7.62 and he really likes the piece. I keep looking back at that one as well (I do like the 7.62/168 gr round) but I think when it gets down to how you plan on using it, the 6.5 shines when punching steel or paper due to it's BC. If I was hunting game at relatively sane ranges, I'd go for the additional bullet weight & kinetic energy of the 7.62.

I'm undecided on which way to go, i.e., gas vs. traditional bolt action. But I'll eventually get there.
 
Back
Top Bottom