Yamaha ca-1010 will it fail without a recap?

[orenshem]

Hello
Just got "new" ca 1010. it was sitting in a friends house without use for some time.
i opened it and the 2 big cap are a little swollen.
Could it harm the amp if i use it with bad caps ?
i don't mind the sound right not .... just worrying if a bad cap along the way might cause a damage to the amp.
there are so meany caps in there . does anyone know which caps should be changed for "health" resons?
tnx

 

[moodydan]

There are a few service bulletins that should be applied, regarding transistors and resistors that burn out. I believe they apply to the 1010; that's the bare minimum that I would do or have done.

EDIT: Nevermind, looks like that's the CR-2020 I'm thinking of. Sorry!

 

[Robisme]

Are you sure they are swollen? Is is that you push on the top and it feels like a bubble that you can push down? If so, that is just the plastic piece that hides the aluminum case top.
Not a problem.

Rob

 

[jheu02]

Your title says it all, but can't really be answered...maybe, maybe not. However, I'll ask this question...if your friend had a 40 year old car siting around "for some time" not being driven, no maintenance having been done, would you just go driving it without checking out the systems, changing the oil, brake, transmission and coolant fluids, and spark plugs? If the levels were ok and it started up, I'd drive it to a shop and have those things done or do them myself before using it as a daily driver. YMMV

 

[mbz]

I'm expecting the domes of the main caps have distorted, I'd replace them, it's an easy job, AK members can walk you through it.
I would not cause it an urgent need to replace them, maybe within the next few months, so might as well replace them now.
The main concern for me is the power supply (relay) board underneath. These take a hammering, check for any with a receeded
plastic sleeve, normally about 2mm lip on the top. The CA-1010 is an easy amp to work on so I'd suggest a total recap but the
main needs would be power supply board then main caps then ...

 

[avionic]

There are a number of fusible resistors within.Might want to check them all. I've found a surprising amount of " out of tolerance" fusible resistors.

 

[avionic]

Are you sure they are swollen? Is is that you push on the top and it feels like a bubble that you can push down? If so, that is just the plastic piece that hides the aluminum case top.
Not a problem.

Rob

I'm expecting the domes of the main caps have distorted, I'd replace them

Best way is to put them on a ESR meter. I'm going to have to concur with Rob's statement. Replacement is not always absolutely necessary. But .. If it gives you peace of mind. Go for it..

 

[NAD80]

Hello orenshem. Welcome to AK. The Service Manual, Schematics, Wiring Diagram, Owners manual, are on HiFi Engine.com. Real nice integrated amp. Hope you can get it working so it will give 30 years of good listening. Avionic's right about checking the caps. Don't want them to fail and take something else out.

 

[avionic]

BTW Welcome to AK.orenshem

 

[orenshem]

TY for the warm welcome guys .
since i am a total beginner i will take it a step at a time ...
i will order a full set of Nichicon caps from Ebay and strat with the filter anb PSB caps.
i have a nice setting here so there is no need for me to rush the work .
this amp look like it worth the time for a restoration project

 

[blhagstrom]

Buy parts from Mouser.com or Digikey.com

Ebay stuff is very suspect.

 

[wmgwizard]

Hello Orenshem, welcome to AK and the wonderful, wild, wacky world of audio enthusiasm.

You are asking a highly debated question that really has no clear answer.

The used car analogy really isn't very accurate. Fluids in a car absorb moisture, contaminants and break down over time and should be changed but there aren't any fluids inside your Yamaha, it wouldn't make sense to replace all of the bulbs in a used car just because they are old.

Can you post a couple of pictures of the suspect caps ?
As stated earlier, many were wrapped/covered and the covering itself may have distorted while the actual component inside may be fine.

Just like test driving an old car, take things slowly, you wouldn't make your maiden voyage in an old car to the race track, "test drive" your amp for a bit before you "put the pedal to the metal".

Check for DC voltage on the speaker terminals, if the DC Offset is within spec hook up a pair of expendable speakers and give it a listen. Just like an old car, go slowly at first, play at low volume and gradually increase the volume. Once your comfortable there are no issues like imbalanced output, strange noises/static/popping etc, hook up your preferred speakers and listen some more.

The CA 1010 is a great looking and sounding piece of gear, hope it brings you years of enjoyment.

 

[jheu02]

Hello Orenshem, welcome to AK and the wonderful, wild, wacky world of audio enthusiasm.

You are asking a highly debated question that really has no clear answer.

The used car analogy really isn't very accurate. Fluids in a car absorb moisture, contaminants and break down over time and should be changed but there aren't any fluids inside your Yamaha, it wouldn't make sense to replace all of the bulbs in a used car just because they are old.

No, there are no fluids per se (except in the form of the electrolyte of some capacitors that can dry out over time). Values can change which can make the circuits behave in unintended ways. As Avionic mentioned, fusible resistors (typically solid white in this age of Yamaha) tend to drift (especially high in value) and/or open up. Transistors that are mounted on heatsinks because they tend to run hot, frequently have cracked solder joints (as evidenced by a ring-shaped crack typically) and may conduct or may not. Switches can get very dirty and/or develop a carbon layer which prevents the signal from passing. These units sometimes have the "sky blue" Sanyo caps which are known to open up and cause trouble, and I've seen the lavendar-sleeved Matsushita caps in these units (probably from a previous repair) which tend to have issues with being open due to leaking electrolyte which causes a corrosion issue. Trimmers for bias and offset may or may not function properly.

I stand by my analogy, because all it was meant to do was show the OP that you check things out on 40 year old electronics as you would a 40 year old car before using it much, which you later alluded to. As a brand new member, it isn't likely that the OP has the equipment or knowledge YET to do all these tests himself, or he would have done them or be in the process of doing so. If he does have the equipment (at a minimum to solder/desolder and a multimeter) great. Plenty of folks who can help walk him through it.

 

[willyrover]

.
The main concern for me is the power supply (relay) board underneath.

There will be bad caps on this board. I would bet money on it.

 

[orenshem]

Glad i didn't took your bet.
these caps have seen better days..
one of the filter caps is swollen and other caps have leakage . especially on the psc - ty mbz (i had to open the bottom of the amp to look for this)
so better safe then sorry... i will change these BEFORE turning on the amp.

some pics...

 

[savatage1973]

Those mains look very suspect--I'd do the replacement before anything else goes awry.

 

[redk9258]

That 'leakage' looks like glue used during assembly.

 

[Robisme]

That is glue and he main caps would vent from the bottom. That is just distorted plastic. If you can push the "bubble" down, The cap is not bulging.

The cap is a metal can with a plastic cover.

The darker that glue gets the more corrosive it becomes. Clean it off.

Rob

 

[zaibatsu]

As others have said the "leakage" is just glue. You should use acetone to soften and remove it (can take a few applications and some time).

Please don't buy caps off ebay @orenshem, most of them are fake. You may do more harm than good.
As blhagstrom suggested, only buy from mouser/digikey/RScomponents/etc. Big electronics suppliers direct.

 

[jheu02]

I edited some of your pics to show what you're looking for...

First pic shows some of the fusible resistors. You'll need to lift one leg to get an accurate meter reading. If bad, they can be replaced by Metal Film resistors that have a flameproof coating. 1/4W is probably correct, though some may be 1/2W rated. DO NOT INCREASE THE WATTAGE RATING of any replacements. You want them to fail if needed to protect other components.

2nd pic shows many caps in or near the power supply have been exposed to heat over time. The PVC sleeves have begun to shrink. Others show what look to be smoke marks, which may just be dust that got hot, but all the caps in this pic should be changed for 105C rated ones such as Nichicon PW, PM, or HE series, or Panasonic FM, FR, or FC.