Where is your point of diminishing returns?

Where is my point of diminishing returns? My point would've been right after my very first upgrade years ago. Those upgrades steadily climbed in cost and there's been less of a night and day difference ever since. Now those returns cost thousands for what I believe to be an upgrade or more often a sideways move. But I'm not ready to throw in the towel just yet.:no:
 
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Then again, you don't really need to be Bill Gates to do that - maybe in auditorium scale, yea... But else? I'd say with 5K and a normal sized room, you can get to 95%. 10K 99%.

Just saying: Genelecs or Adams, measurement s/w, room treatment - done. I can certainly do that for under 5K. And it will sound better than many audiophile setups!

I don't know, 99% of what goal? If you're talking about hearing everything which has been laid down in a recording, for the purposes of critical listening... i.e. professional type use, I totally agree with this. That will certainly give you what you need, and then some.

I'm thinking more along the lines of the maximum enjoyment of reproduced music, versus maximum technical "accuracy". For this I think the "audiophile" market has plenty to offer, many ways to do it too, and the "fun" can get pretty expensive.
 
Mcintosh mono amps are just not my cup of tea. They take up to much space, cost to much, for what they do. I mean where would I put 14 MC 301's. Even 7 MC 302's is a little extreme. Thats why I have 2 MC 207's and a 206. The 206 drives one pair of electro static headphones and remote speakers. The 2505 drives more head phones. The 2 207's push my tri- amped and Bi amped speakers, leaving me two spare channels. I guess if I had XR 290's, I would have a pair of MC 3500's , though I really like MC 602. If I were going old school, the 3500's would have to be included.
Even if I had Magico S7's I would want a pair of 3500's. They sound better with 2301's versus 601's. Lets see I could heat my house with 14 3500's ducted into my heating system. . But to my mind a speaker with less than 94 db/1 watt/4 ft is not my cup of tea. 300 watts would be ideal and all you really need .
 
Here's a case in point with me.

I have two tube amps, an Almarro A205 SEP EL84 amp and a bit of an AK favorite, plus a Magnavox 8802 6V6 PP console amp Kegger reworked into one of his wonders. Now since Keg's amp was always a keeper as he was my friend and it was special too me, I had a chance to audition a $2700 Manley Stingray and a custom built 2A3/45 amp of one of my local friends for a couple weeks each. Both are very nice amps and superior to my Almarro, but I didn't get any real audio grab me epiphanies from either one and that's usually what spurs my purchase. I just didn't see where spending the extra dollars to buy or build similar amps would get me that much more bang for the buck.

And right now, I'm listening to some Brubeck on a set of ADS L880s driven by a Sansui AU-G77XII integrated and it's sounding pretty darn nice too.

So for me, maybe it's not so much the Point of Diminishing Returns, but a point of what sounds good and is enjoyable. I've never been one to eek out the last little bit or strive for the superlative, as I've found out that in a gret many things most of the time good enough really is good enough.

Or like the song says...

"You can't always get what you want
But if you try sometime you find
You get what you need"
 
Definitely agree, but FWIW, I sometimes can't help thinking this way. For an automotive analogy, I believe the point of diminishing returns sets in at about the price of a Hyundai Sonata. It doesn't mean that you don't get more by spending more: clearly you do. Just means you're no longer maximizing value for dollar spent. (Yes I recognize that everyone understands this point!) But...this acknowledgment hasn't stopped me from spending much more than the cost of a Hyundai Sonata a few times! Life is for living, I always say. Do what makes you happy.

Which reminds me: when I was just out of college and living in NYC, I had everything I owned stolen more than once. I resolved to spend my money on intangibles then--things like travel, theater, education. Experiences like those can never be stolen from you! But audio equipment, for me anyway, is a special case. Because I'm spending money on tangible goods but for the explicit purpose of experiencing music better. And so far most of it's been money well spent.
 
Absolutely! But we all differ and I just seem to have a lower floor than others, which I guess is what this whole thread is about. I get a great deal of enjoyment out of my music, and consider myself fortunate that I can attain that joy at a somewhat modest level.
BTW, I'm pretty happy driving my bought used 14 year old Ford Focus wagon with 232,000 miles on it, but cars always were just transportation to me, an appliance if you would...:D
 
It's not what you need, it's what you want!

That's the way a lot of the world and our consumerist economy basically runs, but I've spent decades going au contraire to that, and will be spending the next several years even more focused on paring down and minimalizing, without sacrificing much, if any enjoyment, and most likely gaining comfort and peace of mind from less.

But, I've always marched to a bit of a different drum...

To each his own!! :thumbsup:
 
For better or worse depending upon your point of view, my exposure to a wide range of systems is vastly different.

I find it takes more like $250k to get to a 99% realism level. :)

What about 95%? Give me a scale of your view?
 
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I don't know, 99% of what goal? If you're talking about hearing everything which has been laid down in a recording, for the purposes of critical listening... i.e. professional type use, I totally agree with this. That will certainly give you what you need, and then some.

I'm thinking more along the lines of the maximum enjoyment of reproduced music, versus maximum technical "accuracy". For this I think the "audiophile" market has plenty to offer, many ways to do it too, and the "fun" can get pretty expensive.

I understand adding flavor to music, I'd probably go at that differently though. :)

Fun. Well. Its always expensive, eh?

I think I can accept that.
 
Just means you're no longer maximizing value for dollar spent.
No No No, some people think everything you spend on an audio system needs to product better and better sound quality. For one thing I don't look at diminishing returns at all, for one thing that's saying your going to stop trying other things. And second I don't psycho analize the music or sound quality of it. I buy good equipment and all the little details and supporting goods to put a system together and enjoy the music.
Is factory support Diminishing Returns?
Is longevity Diminishing Returns?
is quality build and parts Diminishing Returns?
None of the above have to do with sound improvements but it sure could cost a lot more getting that security and having a system that turns on day after day year after year

I resolved to spend my money on intangibles then--things like travel, theater, education. Experiences like those can never be stolen from you!
I look a stuff as commodities and prefer that opposed to just spending money and having a full belly, seeing something or feeding my brain.
 
I think I may have reached that point as I can't really see where I could improve things without spending really big amounts.
I recently thought I was ready to upgrade my speakers. Seemed reasonable as they were built by a friend who was experimenting with different speaker designs a few years ago.
They had cost me 6k NZ$, which seemed a lot for essentially DIY speakers but they had top quality componentry, beautiful woodwork and cowhide baffles and walked all over the Dynaudio Contour 1.8s I had before them.
So one Saturday I took them down to a local hifi shop to see how much I was going to have to spend to get better.
After a brief listen the dealer said I would have to spend 25 to 30k to get anything noticeably better (as opposed to different).
I haven't really thought about upgrading since - so I guess I have reached my level.
 
If you look at my signature for my tube system you can see what I'm using. My Altecs cost me a whole lot less, and I mean a whole lot less than speakers I have heard in higher end audio stores that left me totally unimpressed. I'm sure that there are better, but I stopped looking. My tube amps rock, my preamp "might" be improved upon and I'm sure my CD system could jump up a few notches.
Right now it sounds pretty darn amazing and I didn't spend near what you think I did. Like a lot of folks on here, I keep on looking for better gear, it's fun when you pick up something and it's not a sideways move but an upwards move. I just don't spend a fortune doing it.

BillWojo
 
It’s a question that breeds more questions. What’s my discretionary budget this year? What don’t I have? What do I want to have? What am I trying to achieve? How available is it? Can I buy it in or a year or two or will this not pop up again for a while? Is it a clear upgrade?

Etc.

Otherwise, this is a hobby. Don’t over analyze it.
 
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