Clear Coating with the Right Stuff!

[crispycircuit]

I love the looks of a clear coat. I've tried Rustolium clear over Rustolium paint, pure fustration! It reacts & wrinkles, I've tried letting the paint dry for 2 months. I've also used urathane, which turned yellow and peel off a year later. So I spent hours reading. So I'm trying Dupli-Color engine enamel Gloss Clear w/ceramic. You can find it at an Auto-parts store $7.29 12oz's. With stands heat to 500 degrees....So I tried it over Rusteoleum 1day old. and other items. The stuff worked like a miracle, NO problems! Dry's fast/ looks great. I'll see how it holds up for a yr. So if you have had good luck with this clear coat, let me know? So far it looks like a winner...

 

[elcoholic]

 

[Retrovert]

Rust-Oleum is an enamel paint available in different types, with each type having different solvents and amounts of solvents. Most of the Rust-Oleum line uses petroleum solvents, but some are acrylic. This is an important distinction.

Acrylic paints use an emulsion of polymer and water. Once the water evaporates and the polymer has cured (i.e. crosslinked) the paint is durable in the presence of water and many lightweight solvents. This permits stacking of multiple layers of acrylic paints. In your case, it appears you selected two paints using petroleum solvent, so the application of the top coat caused the solvents in the new layer to soften or dissolve the previous layer. I learned this lesson many years ago in elementary school. At the same time I learned to not use Rust-Oleum on plastic as the solvent destroyed it.

When you switched to an acrylic enamel, the water used to form the emulsion did not attack the previous paint layer.

Many urethane paints do not yellow and are very hard. The protective topcoat on a car is such a paint. The better formulations do not yellow, even when exposed to UV, but cost more. You will need to check with the manufacturer for the durability.

 

[blhagstrom]

I’ve used Rusroleum industrial paint, I worked in industrial supply in a previous life. I got to visit with factory reps and chat about paint.

The biggest problem with failed paint jobs is lack of proper preparations.

The second biggest issue is incorrect application.

The second issue is probably where things went south.

I had a pro painter tell me Rustolium is damn near bullet proof, and I can swear yo that. He also warned that repeat coats of Rustolium must be applied close together. He told me it’s great paint but you cannot do touch up. Once it’s dry, it’s done.

I tried a touch up. It failed. Bubbled up big time. I had to sand down through the coating and start over.

Tricky stuff.

 

[Retrovert]

I had a pro painter tell me Rustolium is damn near bullet proof, and I can swear yo that. He also warned that repeat coats of Rustolium must be applied close together. He told me it’s great paint but you cannot do touch up. Once it’s dry, it’s done.

I tried a touch up. It failed. Bubbled up big time. I had to sand down through the coating and start over.

Right. Because the Rust-Oleum is solvent soluble and the new paint has plenty of solvent to dissolve it. Once the solvent hits the paint it turns back into uncrosslinked oils. You might be able to touch it up using one of the low VOC solvent versions but that's tricky.

 

[crispycircuit]

I've used many RustOleum cheap spray cans with great success, and like them. It's Clear coating them with RustOleum Clear. You would think they would work good together? They don't! However it seems I can still used the cheap RustOleum rattle cans of paint, then clear coat with Dupli-Color Clear and be a happy camper. I just wanted a reliable well done combination. Any down falls?

 

[4-2-7]

Any down falls?

Yeah incompatibility.
I love Dupli-Color engine enamel and use it all the time at home, and I'm a professional finisher. Why don't you use Dupli-Color, colors and then their clear coat on top of it? Not that you really need it because the gloss is very glossy.

 

[Retrovert]

I've used many RustOleum cheap spray cans with great success, and like them. It's Clear coating them with RustOleum Clear. You would think they would work good together? They don't! However it seems I can still used the cheap RustOleum rattle cans of paint, then clear coat with Dupli-Color Clear and be a happy camper. I just wanted a reliable well done combination. Any down falls?

A petroleum-solvent based paint can be removed with a solvent, so I would not expect compatibility between two petroleum solvent-based paints. The Rust-Oleum is an oil based paint which is cross-linked then dissolved in a mix of acetone and petroleum solvents. At least half of the can is solvent. So you're adding enough of the solvent which originally dissolved the resin to dissolve whatever it is sprayed on. Certainly enough to cause the surface to skin and wrinkle.

An acrylic topcoat, as you found out, is the obvious solution. Because the underlying paint is only soluble in petroleum or acetone, and you're using water. For a variety of reasons I don't use Rust-Oleum, mainly the long drying time and the lack of resilience to common cleaning solvents, such as those with terpenes, naptha, or kerosene. But I also do not like the finish. I used to paint using car enamels which are fast drying and can often be layered. I discovered this when I was building those die-cast metal car models and used metallic paints for my 1930s Packards and Rolls Royces. The closest I've ever come to owning one.

If you wanted you could also use a nice water-based acrylic for the bottom coat, as this quickly dries and consequently can be layered, and then a topcoat.

From the old days of painting models and regularly repainting my GM car (I can tell you how many GM cars I bought after that 1970s rust bucket), the deeper the paint the better the finish, particularly with some wet-sanding between coats.

 

[Retrovert]

love Dupli-Color engine enamel and use it all the time at home, and I'm a professional finisher. Why don't you use Dupli-Color, colors and then their clear coat on top of it? Not that you really need it because the gloss is very glossy.

A clear coat adds depth and scratch resistance.

 

[4-2-7]

A clear coat adds depth and scratch resistance.

And color change, yellowing over time, adds thickness and can get brittle.

 

[Retrovert]

And color change, yellowing over time, adds thickness and can get brittle.

Not always.

Cheap polyurethane will yellow, true. Yet I, like tens of millions of Americans, have a poly coat on my car which has been extensively exposed to UV and it is not yellow, has undergone no color changes, and is not brittle.

Not all clear coats are identical. Better products costs more and one is unlikely to find the quality product in the rattle-can aisle at the local big-box chain hardware store.

Not sayin', just sayin'.

 

[crispycircuit]

Yes, I will try Dupli-Color paint next time and maybe not need a clear coat. RustOleum has so many color choices and I think I can work with it now. My major complaint with RustOleum is it stays soft for too long, complete hardening takes weeks. I appreciate your replies and opinions. In your responses, you need to tell brand names used. This would go a long way to successful paint jobs

 

[sanford12]

I painted my Yamaha Majesty scooter with Dupli-Color. It's a modern automotive paint and is made to have a clear coat. It will fade without it. Ask me how I know. Six months later I cleared coated it. Wet sand it before you clear coat. It will be more durable and look great.

I've spray painted a lot with rattle cans. I don't use rustolem. I tried and thought it sucked. If you have a Ace Hardware try their house brand. Dries very fast and is easy to work with and is durable. I use it for barn quilts that spend their life outside and they last for years.

 

[N8Nagel]

Yes, I will try Dupli-Color paint next time and maybe not need a clear coat. RustOleum has so many color choices and I think I can work with it now. My major complaint with RustOleum is it stays soft for too long, complete hardening takes weeks. I appreciate your replies and opinions. In your responses, you need to tell brand names used. This would go a long way to successful paint jobs

My complaint is that it NEVER gets hard. Just try to color sand something painted with Rust-Oleum, you'll see what I mean, instead of dust you'll get the paint coming up in little "pills." It's great for stuff you don't care about appearance and just want to protect, but if I want a nice finish on something I much prefer Krylon.

 

[sanford12]

I know that property well. Biggest reason I don't use it.

 

[ConradH]

IMO, Rustoleum is one of the last enamels that really is. It's rugged and wonderful, but you have to give it enough time to fully dry/crosslink/cure or whatever it does. I don't like to disturb a painted surface for at least a week, and don't consider it really ready for prime time until a month or so. I've had no problem with their clear, but the base coat needs to be applied over a properly prepared surface, and given enough time to dry. If you're painting aluminum be sure to use an aluminum prep product. Check surfaces using the water test- if it beads and doesn't wet the surface, you've got more work to do before even thinking about paint.

 

[Retrovert]

Rust-Oleum is a slow-curing oil finish that faster hardens if baked. It was originally fish oil. My experience with the softness of the finish and long drying period mirrors that of N8Nagel and sanford12.

 

[Retrovert]

If you're painting aluminum be sure to use an aluminum prep product. Check surfaces using the water test- if it beads and doesn't wet the surface, you've got more work to do before even thinking about paint.

Yes. That paint will not properly wet the surface if the oxide layer is intact. I have found that painting aluminum works best if the surface has been roughened and acid etched. Some of the universal primers well adhere to aluminum and galvanized steel.

A strong base will leave oxide all over the surface (anodizing) but that finish is not as robust as one would like, and the paint bound to a weakly adhering surface is not going to be robust.

Also, any rust on the surface of steel will continue to fester. I well learned this lesson on my 1970s rust-bucket Pontiac LeMans. Down to bare metal and a wash with phosphoric acid to passivate any rust I couldn't see. Over and over. My mechanic was amazed that after a dozen years I had no major rotting of the body which was a common problem. Anyway, if one is painting any rusted surface, a common issue with steel chassis equipment, best to glass bead it and if that is not possible then remove and passivate the rust.

 

[rave0035]

Retrovert clearly knows what he's talking about... I'm a novice, but I've never looked back since discovering Duplicolor engine enamel a few years back.

Their 3/4 gloss black is my go-to for most stuff! And I rattle can a lot of stuff.

Mike

 

[Mike Sweeney]

for bare metal work, this stuff is awesome.. beats the hell out of the old days of wiping it down with a wet rag of acid then spraying. https://www.amazon.com/SEM-39683-Grey-Etching-Primer/dp/B000GTIRAU