Leather / Deer hide Mat ADDS static?!?!

DLudington

Active Member
All,

I just received one of the Deer hide mats from Jake's Mats on Amazon yesterday. I removed the rubber mat from my Lenco and put on the new deer hide. It sounds nicer than the OEM, with a nice addition to the lower registers.

But while the OEM mat kept static to a minimum, this new deer hide mat creates so much static it is lifting off of the platter and sticking to the record when I take a disc off!

What the heck is going on? Could it have something to do with the zinc that the Lenco platters are made of? Or do I need to somehow adhere the mat to the platter?
 
That I doubt. Deer/leather is as much if not more less static than rubber. Could it not be that your record do pick up more static from the platter spin with only the thiner Deer mat ?

Can you try to play with the rubber mat onto the original OEM rubber one on the platter without challenging too much the SRA/VTA settings if you can't adjust that on your tonearm ?
 
I have a beautiful leather mat in the basement that I stopped using last winter because of the static and cling. My best bets have been plain old thick rubber and acrylic for killing static and cling dead.
 
Leather as 'material' is not at fault here. It's thinness/thickness can be at stake is it doesn't dampens nor isolate the record from the platter's statics build-up and/or the cartridge from magnetism if ever. But as a contact surface for records, it is good enough and doesn't build nor keep static. Plus it has such a soft surface for the record to land on. So for all those reasons it's my favorite top mat. Other mats underneath will each serve their own purpose on my "mat lasagna" :D
 
My leather mat does not have static issues at all. Hmmmm

Mine does. I replaced a wool mat with it, only ‘cause the wool was old and dirty. The wool seemed to remove static.
The leather seems to add to it, though it sounds fine and looks nice.
Think I may buy a new wool mat.
 
Mine does. I replaced a wool mat with it, only ‘cause the wool was old and dirty. The wool seemed to remove static.
The leather seems to add to it, though it sounds fine and looks nice.
Think I may buy a new wool mat.

Kumquat or what ? Have you ever rubbed plastic on wool... That is straight static build up ! As I said, leather doesn't keep static nor build it up. It just does not.

Wool or I guess you imply felt mat can build it up and keep it if transmitted. Maybe like for the OP if your record have static, the thin leather mat will indeed stick to the record.

I have a leather mat on top of my mat lasagna and indeed when I pull out an LP that has static it can happen. But I also remember having that with felt mat in the past.

Evidently with a thick and heavy rubber mat this shan't happen. Understandingly one can have it's preference for any kind of mat but let's keep it real. I want my kumquats ! :rant:
 
Putting the OEM rubber Lenco mat flipped upside down under the deer hide mat has helped a lot more, but there's still noticeably more static than before. Maybe something to do with the idler-drive generating static that the leather picks up better than rubber?
 
I -DO- WANT MY KUMQUATS !
And I do notice more static with the soft leather mat than the wool. And that’s the way it is.

Get those kids away from my records!
 
Weird. I run a deerhide mat on my Ariston RD11s and it has never shown any sing of static build-up. Zip. I run rubber, cork and a few of Herbie's mats and the leather mat had the least static issues, as in none. 107-year-old-house-in-Candian-winter situation and still no static. Wonder what is going on there?
 
Weird. I run a deerhide mat on my Ariston RD11s and it has never shown any sing of static build-up. Zip. I run rubber, cork and a few of Herbie's mats and the leather mat had the least static issues, as in none. 107-year-old-house-in-Candian-winter situation and still no static. Wonder what is going on there?

Relax and have a smoke. :smoke:

My leather mat tends to cling from static. It doesn't weigh much so it's more obvious than with anything else too. Perhaps the others might if they were as light and flexible.
 
Relax and have a smoke. :smoke:

My leather mat tends to cling from static. It doesn't weigh much so it's more obvious than with anything else too. Perhaps the others might if they were as light and flexible.
Maybe all hide mats are not so similar as one might imagine? Mine is rather thick and quite heavy, suede on one side and smooth on the other. The only heavier mat I've owned is the rubber one on my Denon DP-80 and it is very thick. It also draws more static than the leather does. The worst static issues I've had over the years were with cork mats. One of them would lift right up glued to the record when I changed sides. That one wasn't around long.
 
To the OP, Its not the matt its the record. I ahve the same matt and tried it with either side facing up. Some records have the matt stick to it and others dont.
And I never noticed it before because the rubber matt was heavier and didnt stick .

I wonder if certain recordings cause static to build up? Next time I find one that sticks
i'll separate it from the matt and play some other records then put it back on the matt, not play it and see if it sticks after some time on it, then play it and see what happens ?
Nah thats just Crazy talk !!!

nashou
 
Here's some basic science for you:
https://www.school-for-champions.com/science/static_materials.htm

The Triboelectric Series matters. As you can see from the linked table, placing a PVC-based record on leather, then separating it is a great way (one of the best!) to CREATE static. Anyone who tells you otherwise has no knowledge of basic physics.
the vinyl becomes very - charged, while deer hide can become quite + charged. One would have to know what is causing the deerhide to lose electrons. Betting the spindle on this particular table has a very high resistance to ground, or is an open ground preventing the album from dropping from a high static charge to a low static charge, thus + charging the deerhide.
 
dudes, ask wife for dryer sheet, punch hole (engineers: .25 inch),
insert between mat and platter.

old trick: tube without markings: rub tube on hair.

when you rub any two different materials you will get static.

unless you rub two nickels...
 
One would have to know what is causing the deerhide to lose electrons. .

You don't need a "cause". It's a simple property of the insulator materials: the leather has a tendency to give up electrons to a material that will accept them. PVC polymers want to accept them, it's that simple. Records pick up a negative charge quite easily when put in contact then separated from any material that has a tendency to give up electrons. This is the basis for introducing quats, for example, to neutralize excess negative charge (or hold water molecules, which make the record more conductive).

when you rub any two different materials you will get static.

Not if they are in the same place in the Triboelectric table (have equal electron affinities) or if they are conductors. Also, rubbing helps, but brief contact and separation is enough to transfer charge among insulating materials at opposite ends of the spectrum.

The best mat would be conductive. There are non-abrasive conductors like a mat made with Thunderon material (copper sulfide infused fibers).
 
Last edited:
This table insist on the fact that it's about RUBBING materials not merely making contact between materials like we do when dropping a record on a mat.

Vinyl is very attractive of electrons and air is very giving. So a revolving record will gather a lot if static on the vinyl surface. Friction of air and vinyl. Right ?

At rest, different materials tend to keep more or less static and there vinyl tends to do that a lot even in it's paper sleeve (low + in the 'turboelectric chart) !
 
This table insist on the fact that it's about RUBBING materials not merely making contact between materials like we do when dropping a record on a mat.

Vinyl is very attractive of electrons and air is very giving. So a revolving record will gather a lot if static on the vinyl surface. Friction of air and vinyl. Right ?

At rest, different materials tend to keep more or less static and there vinyl tends to do that a lot even in it's paper sleeve (low + in the 'turboelectric chart) !

Rubbing is not needed. That linked page was from a class experiment to create lots of static. I just chose it because it included leather and explained the concept in simple terms. Rubbing is a way to contact and separate multiple times very quickly. Contact and removal is all that is needed, the more, the higher the likelihood (and level) of charge imbalance. Just peel a vinyl label off a glass container and you're left with static charge. Similarly, static discharge is instantaneous and does not require rubbing. Those living in dry environments painfully know this from touching a doorknob after walking across a wool rug.

Air contains water, which is a great conductor. This is why higher humidity decreases issues with static.

Paper sleeves are notorious for creating static on records. This is one reason why audiophile sleeves are lined with or made of materials similar in series rank to PVC (like polypropylene, for example).

While developing cleaning solutions, I routinely generated static on records through contact with a variety of materials and made measurements. The results followed the Tribo series quite well. In terms of static generation, leather is a terrible material to bring in contact with your records. I don't know why it is used for mats (maybe because it is soft and sound deadening?) . This isn't from simple classroom experiments: we make our measurements in a controlled environment with a very accurate (and rather expensive) instrument designed for this purpose:
IMG_7233.JPG
 
Last edited:
Rubbing is not needed. That linked page was from a class experiment to create lots of static. I just chose it because it included leather and explained the concept in simple terms. Rubbing is a way to contact and separate multiple times very quickly. Contact and removal is all that is needed, the more, the higher the likelihood (and level) of charge imbalance. Just peel a vinyl label off a glass container and you're left with static charge. Similarly, static discharge is instantaneous and does not require rubbing. Those living in dry environments painfully know this from touching a doorknob after walking across a wool rug.

Air contains water, which is a great conductor. This is why higher humidity decreases issues with static.

Paper sleeves are notorious for creating static on records. This is one reason why audiophile sleeves are lined with or made of materials similar in series rank to PVC (like polypropylene, for example).

While developing cleaning solutions, I routinely generated static on records through contact with a variety of materials and made measurements. The results followed the Tribo series quite well. In terms of static generation, leather is a terrible material to bring in contact with your records. I don't know why it is used for mats (maybe because it is soft and sound deadening?) . This isn't from simple classroom experiments: we make our measurements in a controlled environment with a very accurate (and rather expensive) instrument designed for this purpose:
View attachment 1308342
in your testing, what did you find in change of static charge from album in free state to album mounted to table? Did you test continuity to ground of the spindle? My spindle to table ground measures 140 ohms.
 
Back
Top Bottom