MCS 6502 weak/poor sound quality
- Thread starter gotitforfree
- Start date
If my information is correct, a quarter weighs 5.67 grams. Five quarters would weigh 28 grams. That's some tracking force
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
The arm rest on a TT is usually loaded with a special viscous liquid that damps the motion so it slowly lowers the arm onto the record rather than dropping it. Maybe that mechanism is gummed up and that's why the rest isn't lowering down enough.
If the arm isn't going all the way down and is binding up regardless of the arm rest, that's definitely a problem to.
If it is hard to move the arm sideways when it's lowered, maybe there is something binding up in the arm bearings or the antiskate?
The earlier post about 'extreme measures' is spot on. This is a delicate mechanism that has to be just right and when it is, it will be smooth as silk. Bricks will not fix it, in fact that kind of rough treatment will do more damage.
If the arm isn't going all the way down and is binding up regardless of the arm rest, that's definitely a problem to.
If it is hard to move the arm sideways when it's lowered, maybe there is something binding up in the arm bearings or the antiskate?
The earlier post about 'extreme measures' is spot on. This is a delicate mechanism that has to be just right and when it is, it will be smooth as silk. Bricks will not fix it, in fact that kind of rough treatment will do more damage.
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
A guy in my office bought a new cheapie TT a couple years back, said it would jump out of the groove on loud passages. He put nickels on it and it sorta worked. I looked at it and the cartridge was mounted on the arm tube with a single screw that landed in a dimple on the arm tube - very cheap design. The tube was rotated so far off center at the factory that the dimple was not at the top, the whole cart was rotated, and the stylus was hitting the record at 5 degrees off of vertical. Must have sounded awful. I was able to fix the crappy mechanism but he'd ruined the stylus suspension with the nickels. Even under normal tracking force, the stylus would collapse and the back of the cart was scraping the record. He had to get a new stylus. Yours is probably trashed too.
MCM_Fan
AK Subscriber
There should be an equivalent of the Hippocratic oath for working on turntables: First, do no harm.
polypetalous
Super Member
Talk about an opinion based on nothing, but here it is...
Not to rule out possibility of a mechanical issue, but I have a sneaking suspicion that the OP is encountering a "setup issue," i.e. Cartridge alignment / tonearm balancing / tracking force setting etc.
Not trying to put the OP down or to say "you're doing it wrong" but just get that "feeling."
Ben
Not to rule out possibility of a mechanical issue, but I have a sneaking suspicion that the OP is encountering a "setup issue," i.e. Cartridge alignment / tonearm balancing / tracking force setting etc.
Not trying to put the OP down or to say "you're doing it wrong" but just get that "feeling."
Ben
toxcrusadr
Omelette au Fromage
One thing I wanted to mention in case no one has, is how to get the counterweight calibrated: most of them can be moved independently from the 'scale' that's printed next to it. Adjust it until the stylus is just floating weightless, and that's zero. Adjust the scale to line up 0 g with that spot. Then the scale should work pretty well.
It sounds like you were measuring reasonable stylus force settings of plus or minus 2 grams at some point as posted earlier, which of course is the correct ballpark. Just thought you might want to get the counterweight calibrated. Sometimes they get completely whacked by a previous owner so you have no idea where you're at.
Also if you are playing the same record you were playing with all those quarters on it, it may be damaged and may not sound right even with a new and properly adjusted stylus.
It sounds like you were measuring reasonable stylus force settings of plus or minus 2 grams at some point as posted earlier, which of course is the correct ballpark. Just thought you might want to get the counterweight calibrated. Sometimes they get completely whacked by a previous owner so you have no idea where you're at.
Also if you are playing the same record you were playing with all those quarters on it, it may be damaged and may not sound right even with a new and properly adjusted stylus.
gotitforfree
Active Member
Both arms look identical, both arms lift up the same amount, but the one doesn't go as far downward.
The stylus is new, I've got three here to choose from, and a used cartridge off another brand TT that worked but ran slow.
The bottom line is that when the tone arm is low enough to contact the record, it can't move freely side to side for some reason. It seems to be bottomed out physically where it pivots.
The records I'm testing with are junk, nothing I care much about. It has dug ruts in a few, and scraped a few up pretty bad.
I tried something else today, with the TT mat removed and one record on the platter, and a gram scale under the arm, even with four quarters stacked on the tone arm head the weight don't increase beyond 3 grams. The arm is bottomed out at the pivot, not against the stylus. I'd have to force the arm to the point of damage to get push the arm down any further.
I removed the mat because the scale is nearly the thickness of the mat, so I wanted to be as close to the height of a playing record as I could get. With the mat in place, the stylus still is not compressed much and the gram weight is only 3.7 gr. Without weight on the stylus, it rides about 1/4" off the record, but makes no sound and won't track that way. With three records stacked, the tone arm moves freely at that height and it sort of tracks but still needs weight to make audible sound.
Just for test purposes I removed the spare tone arm, installed the tone arm, the new cartridge, and the original used stylus, and wired up the wires to a pair of RCA plugs.
If I float the arm over a spinning record, it plays fine with just the weight of the tone arm, it tracks and plays clearly. But to make it play, the tone arm is level with the record, about an inch lower at the pivot then when its mounted on the TT. As I lift the back of the tone arm the sound gets garbled and distorted. The stylus at that point is pointed more rearward then down at the record when that happens. I know that's not a scientific test but it does show that the cartridge, stylus, and wires are capable of playing.
The stylus is new, I've got three here to choose from, and a used cartridge off another brand TT that worked but ran slow.
The bottom line is that when the tone arm is low enough to contact the record, it can't move freely side to side for some reason. It seems to be bottomed out physically where it pivots.
The records I'm testing with are junk, nothing I care much about. It has dug ruts in a few, and scraped a few up pretty bad.
I tried something else today, with the TT mat removed and one record on the platter, and a gram scale under the arm, even with four quarters stacked on the tone arm head the weight don't increase beyond 3 grams. The arm is bottomed out at the pivot, not against the stylus. I'd have to force the arm to the point of damage to get push the arm down any further.
I removed the mat because the scale is nearly the thickness of the mat, so I wanted to be as close to the height of a playing record as I could get. With the mat in place, the stylus still is not compressed much and the gram weight is only 3.7 gr. Without weight on the stylus, it rides about 1/4" off the record, but makes no sound and won't track that way. With three records stacked, the tone arm moves freely at that height and it sort of tracks but still needs weight to make audible sound.
Just for test purposes I removed the spare tone arm, installed the tone arm, the new cartridge, and the original used stylus, and wired up the wires to a pair of RCA plugs.
If I float the arm over a spinning record, it plays fine with just the weight of the tone arm, it tracks and plays clearly. But to make it play, the tone arm is level with the record, about an inch lower at the pivot then when its mounted on the TT. As I lift the back of the tone arm the sound gets garbled and distorted. The stylus at that point is pointed more rearward then down at the record when that happens. I know that's not a scientific test but it does show that the cartridge, stylus, and wires are capable of playing.
JohnnyBrit
New Member
Hello. Did you ever resolve this issue? Followed the thread since I just picked up a 6502. Nervous it isn't going to be any good after reading issues people have with it.
Cheers
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