Technics SL-1200 MKII skipping problem

pcorbin

Active Member
I recently acquired a MKII from that auction site, just because I always wanted one. I'm having an issue that I can't seem to figure out.

I took an AT95e that was already installed on a technics headshell and used on another table and working fine, verified setup/overhang using the little plastic technics tool and put it on the "new" table. Using a old, but known playable record, testing produces repeated skipping at all points on the record side. It skips on the lead-in, as well as any point through the side to the lead-out grooves. There are no visible issues with the record, and I also tried with another similar record with the same results.

- the table is level, rack is stable, platter is level
- set the arm height at @ 2.2, as cartridge height is 17.2mm (following technics' chart)
- set tonearm to null, zeroed out floating perfectly level
- tracking force and anti-skate set as per AT (range is 1.5 to 2.5)
- have tried all across that range, even a tad over 2.5, no effect
- the tonearm lift is not contacting the tonearm at all when not engaged, is adjusted properly
- the tonearm itself has no perceptible play or give at all (checking bearings)
- the tonearm moves freely all across the range of motion it is intended to have

The two things I have reservations about:
- azimuth IS a tad off visually, headshell/cartridge lean very slightly outward, and I have not attempted the unofficial tweak with the collar mount screws as yet
- the anti-skate knob moves "too" freely based on observations with another technics I have

So, before I tear this thing apart, any thoughts or suggestions? If the anti-skate spring is missing/broken/unhooked, could that cause this issue? Is the "feel test" good enough to determine tonearm bearing condition?

I just have that feeling that I am missing something obvious, so any help would be appreciated :)
 
To do a nice sensitive test of the bearings: set the tonearm to zero (floating), turn off the antiskate. Put a cover on your stylus (or remove it if need be) and very gently blow on the tonearm, in a nice long breath. It should glide across the platter unimpeded. For my bad bearings this was more revealing than just a feel test.

KAB has some test instructions for tonearm/antiskate https://www.kabusa.com/frameset.htm?/sl1200tonearm.htm
 
Thank you both!

I tried the KAB tests linked above, and found that it passes the test up until I reset the AS to 1.5 or indeed "anything" other than zero. It just has no effect whatsoever. The tonearm stays wherever I put it over the record surface.

I tried the gentle blowing test, and it does not move at all, which seems to indicate something not freely moving. Maybe. I tried puffing like hell at it, and it still didn't move much horizontally.

I'm guessing from the advice above, and the testing results, that I need a new tonearm so I'll order one. However, should I be ordering something/anything for the AS, or anything else while I'm at it? Any more likely suspects to get at the same time?
 
I wouldn't jump the gun so quickly. I certainly believe that the tonearm pivots are more the likely over-tightened. If the arm moves but is sluggish, is the sure sign and the fact that it skips certainly can be from over-tightened pivot points. You will need a spanner head screw driver to loosen the outer "locking collar" of the set screw. Once that is loosened, the set-screw can be adjusted to a less tense position. The object is to have the tonearm in complete control, yet it can move as "free as a bird" with any kind of movement, even Kevin's breath test should move the arm with ease (AS set to zero, arm zero balanced). Please, do this before you go and buy a new arm.

Wayner
 
Here is an example of the spanner screw driver: https://www.amazon.com/Screwdriver-...75185494&sr=1-7&keywords=spanner+screw+driver

You can also make one from a regular screw driver and a file if you have the skill, talent and patients. You will also need a micro screw-driver to adjust the inner set screw that is the actual pivot of the tonearm. You need to concentrate on the pivot on the top of the arm. If you get that to work then you can adjust the one on the side (you only need to adjust one) to get the arms up and down motion free as possible, while still in control.

I actually believe that perhaps a huge portion of tonearm pivots are not set correctly (either to tight or too loose) and interfere with better vinyl playback
 
Regarding the blow test that I mentioned last night- for me at least it just indicated an arm with bearings that were smooth in some parts, but bad in others (it glided nicely and then suddenly stopped half way). If it's not blowing at all, I'm gonna third the suggestion to try Wayner's advice.
 
The cure for anything is the correct diagnosis, so until the true answer is known, all of the possibilities must be explored. Maybe someone before you was messing with it.....we just don't know. Maybe the tonearm wires have their undies in a bunch and are restricting the movement. Maybe number13 is spot on and the arm is shot. but it needs to have possible suspects systematically eliminated before any foregone conclusions can be made.
 
@WAYNER - I found a set of spanner heads at Harbor Freight last night, but it appears either the #10 size is just off from the tool size/fit required, or the tool I bought is not as precision as would be ideal. Go figure. :)

I'll try filing it down to fit, and go from there.

@jetstream - it does the same thing on all records tested.

Thanks to all for the help, I'll post results this weekend.
 
I had to file down the one I have as it was too big to fit into the slot width. You just need to loosen the outer collar a wee bit, then head for the set screw.

Its a place to start anyway....
Fingers crossed that this fixes the problem.
 
I had to file down the one I have as it was too big to fit into the slot width. You just need to loosen the outer collar a wee bit, then head for the set screw.

Its a place to start anyway....
Fingers crossed that this fixes the problem.
If the bearing screws are too tight, isn't it possible they are tight enough to have damaged the bearings and even loosening them a scooch won't help much?
 
I have an SL1200MK2 (2007 model) and an SL1210MK5 (2010 model) and an irrelevant SL-Q2 at the moment. I bought the 1210 as return this last winter because the guy said it did not track right. Well, someone had been "Fing" around with the pivots. After a couple of attempts to get the arm right, it is now my best sounding deck.

We will not know your answer until the OP does his thing. I don't think things are bad, just not set right, but I'm not at his place. You have to start at the beginning, not in the middle or the end to come up with "replace all" as the finale conclusion. As an engineer, I start at the beginning and let the evidence point me into the right direction.

A small investment in a tool is a great way to start eliminating the possibilities here.
 
Chances are the tonearm was changed and during the change the antiskate wasn't properly set back and now doesn't work. If the tonearm is fine and you play the screws - say hello to a new tonearm.
 
Results were not as good as hoped, but here it is:

- I talked with Kevin at KAB, who was very generous with his time and offered some additional thoughts on how to test, and on the AS as a possible issue (not likely)
- before doing anything else, I simply repeated the prior tests to check for play and/or stiffness
- while doing this, the tonearm got noticeably less smooth in movement
- I backed off the top lock screw just a tad, and when I did that a tiny piece of metal fell out, bounced away, and with my eyesight is gone forever - so I am guessing what it was, it looks like it was part of the pivot point or the underside of the adjustment area
- the lock screw was extremely tight, and my feeling is that a prior adjustment had been made and had it way too tight
- now there is quite a lot of play - it is broken:)
- I will order a new arm from Kevin

Thank you all for your help!
 
Is it possible to order a new arm with upgraded wiring? The stock tonearm wiring on the SL-1200MK2's is a known weak point.
 
Too late now but should always clean and lubricate tonearm bearings FIRST before start turning screws and foul up bearing pre-load
ALWAYS
99.999% of turntable owner also do not have correct screw driver for this either you will be able to see when bearing has been messed with by owners
If a tonearm bearing too tight one of 3 things factory mistake someone mess with it OR most common with SL-1200 and DJ someone spill something or just years in dirty environment
Then more rare physical damage like soemthing hit but ususally see some other sign too!
Tonearm bearings do NOT just get tight on own
Sorry for problems : - (
JJ
 
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