12BY7A-Brand Opinions-Citation Amp

MRL_Audio

RIP 2022
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I have a number of different brand 12BY7A's I can use in my Cit II amp. RCA, GE, Sylvania and just picked up some Philps (Holland) tubes. I have not rolled anything in or out since I received the amp. Was looking for opinions on what folks think might be the best fit. Currently have GE's in V2, V3, V5 and V6 Have RCA's in V1 & V4 based on some reading. Wanted to get thoughts on the other brands especially the Philips tubes. Thanks.
 
I've had the exact same lineup as you in my CII since I rebuilt it, so I can't offer any suggestions. I've always enjoyed the sound from the amp, so I haven't thought about rolling tubes.

I'd like to hear your impressions after you've tried those Phillips.

Sorry I wasn't more help.
 
I can't help either, except to say the one Deuce I re-built liked Sylvanias quite well. They seemed to put some "snap" in the amp, and I like snappy amps.
 
I am running Sylvanias, and they sound pretty good to me.

Don Sachs, who is Jim McShane's recommended rebuild guy, says the best are CBS branded ones.

They are quite rare and I've never seen or heard them.
 
I always wondered why they chose a TV tube way back then. It obviously worked out well for them, I just always found it odd.
 
The front end of the Cit 2 goes out to the MHz range. They needed to use TV pentodes to get that kind of response in 1960. I dunno why Hageman decided he wanted that kind of response, but I guess the results speak for themselves.
 
I have tried many brands and types (rca smoked glass, black or grey plates;sylvanias, GE,
Tung sol...) some time ago I was lucky enough to find a bunch of nib Tektronix selected matched pairs (most probably GE black plates), they come in double boxes and in my Deuce are by far the best sounding.
 
Does not Citation guru Jim McShane recommend Sylvania? Is it early black plate Sylvania?

Went to Jim's site. His reco is below. No one has commented on the tubes I was asking about. The Philips tubes. Any one ever try those?

"12BY7A NOS JAN GE pentodes. In my experience, the sturdy construction of these tubes make them the best tubes for Citation II and V (RCAs/Sylvanias in V1 and V4 are also very good)"
 
The front end of the Cit 2 goes out to the MHz range. They needed to use TV pentodes to get that kind of response in 1960. I dunno why Hageman decided he wanted that kind of response, but I guess the results speak for themselves.

I suspect the 12BY7 produces a linear curve as viewed on the plate curves and likely better than a 'puny' 6AU6 pentode. The 12BY7 certainly is loafing along in this application.
 
I own two Citation II’s that I use to bi amp Martin Logan SL3 electrostats. One was completely restored by Jim McShane about 12 years ago when he was still doing the rebuilds himself. He outfitted the main power tubes with EI-KT 90’s, which I now have in both units. They are now difficult to find. I’ve rolled most tube brands through the smaller 12by7a tubes on both units including Phillips, GE, Sylvania, RCA, the original HK supplied tubes, and JAN tubes. I’ve never laid hands on the CBS tubes, they sound interesting. The differences are more than subtle in my opinion, certainly different, your personal taste for the sound signature will define your favorite. I like the JAN tubes because they are so rugged and balanced. In my opinion, the use of high end audio caps and the choice of the larger tubes made a bigger difference. I had Jim install Musicaps, they were expensive but worth it. They were designed by the Engineer Robert Hovland, who no longer is associated with Musicaps. He now is associated with a nearly identical featured brand called Supercaps (Robert Hovland series). Jim also endorses V-caps, also a high end audio capacitor. They are crazy expensive. Jim also installed some unique photo flash caps in the power section, which he no longer is able to get. He indicated they were the best he had found at the time. I luckily purchased a second set as backups and will eventually install them in the other amp. I also purchased two extra sets of the EI KT 90’s for posterity and eventual replacement. There remains hope that the factory will start back up. The rumors were that NATO blew up the factory during the war. Others say the war simply caused the shutdown and demise of the factory. The soundstage from the Citation II’s when rebuilt is astonishing.
 
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