Another Electro Voice Interface D/Sentry VI thread.

Just to make sure that I didnt just soldered the vmr badly, I resoldered it and then again soldered it and it still keeps making a clicking noise and turning down volume when a bit of bass or deep mids are played. If anyone has any idea what it could be I would appreciate it.
 
I just read a bit about crossovers electronics and finally got to a sheme that i believe should actually work.View attachment 690178 I guess the previous ones were pretty unusable.
Hello! Was not here for few days to anwer. So the first drawing was actually the best one

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Effect of your last (third) version is basically the same as the first one. These upper 2x 40ohm resistors plus L5 coil are shorted=inactive anyway.
So basically 1/4 space setting should be working for you within this scheme.
But! As you will bypass meters of thin wires to/from switches with their own resistances (incl resistance of the old switches) and some other parameters, sound definitely will not be the same after rework.
As we would expect, it should be change to better and I'm convinced it will be.
But final overall balance between drivers need to be re adjusted in some cases.
For example in my case the sound became more clear, transparent but also little bit too bright in the highest registers.
I had comfort situation while I'm using 1/2 space setting where both, the VMRs and tweeters L-pads stays active anyway.
As I had no problem with VMR level I kept original VMR's L-pad parameters (5 and 40ohm resistors) untouched.
But tweeter became little bit brighter. Therefore I've slightly tweaked tweeter's L-pad resistors by adding extra 40ohm resistor parallel to the tweeter and original 18ohm resistor.
I have used one of these 40ohm resistors left unused from bypased tweeter's filters (these close to L5 in scheme).
I have also change also 2,7ohm serial resistor in tweeter's lpad using/buying the 3,3ohm top quality Duelund pure grafite 12W resistors.
This fine tuning brought down tweeter by some 1,5dB which returned sound balance to perfection for my ears and room.
You are not going to use L-pads because 1/4 setting. But if you would have similar issue, you can activate and calculate any of the lpad for driver where needed to make your own ideal balance.
 
Hello! Was not here for few days to anwer. So the first drawing was actually the best one

index.php


Effect of your last (third) version is basically the same as the first one. These upper 2x 40ohm resistors plus L5 coil are shorted=inactive anyway.
So basically 1/4 space setting should be working for you within this scheme.
But! As you will bypass meters of thin wires to/from switches with their own resistances (incl resistance of the old switches) and some other parameters, sound definitely will not be the same after rework.
As we would expect, it should be change to better and I'm convinced it will be.
But final overall balance between drivers need to be re adjusted in some cases.
For example in my case the sound became more clear, transparent but also little bit too bright in the highest registers.
I had comfort situation while I'm using 1/2 space setting where both, the VMRs and tweeters L-pads stays active anyway.
As I had no problem with VMR level I kept original VMR's L-pad parameters (5 and 40ohm resistors) untouched.
But tweeter became little bit brighter. Therefore I've slightly tweaked tweeter's L-pad resistors by adding extra 40ohm resistor parallel to the tweeter and original 18ohm resistor.
I have used one of these 40ohm resistors left unused from bypased tweeter's filters (these close to L5 in scheme).
I have also change also 2,7ohm serial resistor in tweeter's lpad using/buying the 3,3ohm top quality Duelund pure grafite 12W resistors.
This fine tuning brought down tweeter by some 1,5dB which returned sound balance to perfection for my ears and room.
You are not going to use L-pads because 1/4 setting. But if you would have similar issue, you can activate and calculate any of the lpad for driver where needed to make your own ideal balance.

Thanks for the tips with the adjustement.
Few days ago I shorted the lamp, the L-pad and the whole switch-section. It worked and sounded great until the scratching came back and the amplifier always reduced all the loudness instantly and making a clicking noise. I recognized that one wire that leads to the vmr wasnt soldered. So I soldered it and the problems still occured when a litttle vibration caused by loudness and bass appeared. I guess its caused by a badly soldered wire. To check if the bad soldering is made on the vmr or if its on the crossover, I am going to connect the other vmr with my "problem"crossover (stilll leaving it in the other speaker) and if it still scratches its caused by the crossover and if not, its the Vmr.
If you know a different cause of the problem, I am alwas thankful.:) (need to be able to listen to them back again);)
 
Thanks for the tips with the adjustement.
Few days ago I shorted the lamp, the L-pad and the whole switch-section. It worked and sounded great until the scratching came back and the amplifier always reduced all the loudness instantly and making a clicking noise. I recognized that one wire that leads to the vmr wasnt soldered. So I soldered it and the problems still occured when a litttle vibration caused by loudness and bass appeared. I guess its caused by a badly soldered wire. To check if the bad soldering is made on the vmr or if its on the crossover, I am going to connect the other vmr with my "problem"crossover (stilll leaving it in the other speaker) and if it still scratches its caused by the crossover and if not, its the Vmr.
If you know a different cause of the problem, I am alwas thankful.:) (need to be able to listen to them back again);)
If you are sure clicking is coming from VMR and not tweeter its strange. Maybe some of the VMR's capacitors is/are broken.
You will need to check everything, one element in time, one after another :(
 
I haven't read The whole thread but have you tested the speaker with multiple sources ?

The reason I ask is last week I thought I was losing a st350 in one of my interface D's and the problem ended up being in the preamp. I switch pre's and the problem went away.
 
If you are sure clicking is coming from VMR and not tweeter its strange. Maybe some of the VMR's capacitors is/are broken.
You will need to check everything, one element in time, one after another :(

Im pretty sure because the tweeter is working perfectly in the other speaker. And even the tweeter from the other speaker makes clicking noises when in the problem speaker. I guess the vmr is the problem because when I slightly touched one wire leading to the vmr(wasnt soldered there) it made the same scratching noises. I now soldered it and if i touch the cable it doesnt scratches but when playing loud it does. I think I'll have to check the vmr's parts.
 
I haven't read The whole thread but have you tested the speaker with multiple sources ?

The reason I ask is last week I thought I was losing a st350 in one of my interface D's and the problem ended up being in the preamp. I switch pre's and the problem went away.

Yes I have tested it. At the moment I am playing with the same amp(but only 1 speaker) and it works good. I also exchanged cables and the amplifiers output(from left speaker connected to left output to left speaker to right output and the other way round) and the same speaker continues scratching. But thanks alot for also giving me advices on solving my problem.
 
If you are sure clicking is coming from VMR and not tweeter its strange. Maybe some of the VMR's capacitors is/are broken.
You will need to check everything, one element in time, one after another :(
Hey elektroboy
Before testing all the parts of the vmr, i wanted to ask you if there are any parts in the vmr that could work sometimes good and sometimes be broken? Im asking that because sometimes after long "non listening" times the speaker works fine and then begins to scratch after an hour. In my opinion there has to be something that is sometimes ok and sometimes not. How would I have to test the vmr's parts? I guess I'll need a multimeter.
 
I think I have just found the problem. I wanted to check if there are any bad contacts or cables. So I played music on low volume and touched all the cables to generate vibration. after I touched the white cable that is leading to the unused input(for the amp). The scratching and clicking came back immediately. I soon realised that the nut wasn't proberly fastened. I fastened it and the scratching was away. I again unfastened it and it was there again. It is now proberly fastened and till now everythings working just perfect.
 

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Heloo Khaefeli! I have the feeling, soon you'll be the best expert in Delta's problems solving in here. Congratulation to your exercise.
Fortunately my Deltas are excellent, not causing any problem at this moment. Knock on wood...
One small news. I'm actually helping to refurbish another pair of Deltas, owned by my good friend.
And I found some surprises by his speakers again.
First of all, his VRM's are the first pair which seems to have original surround but..... WITHOUT ANY IMPREGNATION. Completely dry and soft upper suspension - surround.
I don't see any other reason for this, except they forgot to do it n the factory!
Hard to imagine it could completely evaporate, even after 35 years.
Especially once I've seen some 10-12 pcs VMRs on my own eyes yet. Plus checking all available pictures on the net. None of them had no impregnation, except pair of my friend :)
And also inside nothing new, chaotic assebly of the crossover. Each has has different 17,7uF capacitors. One is slightly smaller size in than the one in another box (although same producer, same type code). Hard to believe these speakers were assembled in Switzerland! By the way the front covers aren't interchangeable between his and my Deltas. The pins are in the same place but they are different size!
Swiss Clock should run much better! :)
 
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Heloo Khaefeli! I have the feeling, soon you'll be the best expert in Delta's problems solving in here. Congratulation to your exercise.
Fortunately my Deltas are excellent, not causing any problem at this moment. Knock on wood...
One small news. I'm actually helping to refurbish another pair of Deltas, owned by my good friend.
And I found some surprises by his speakers again.
First of all, his VRM's are the first pair which seems to have original surround but..... WITHOUT ANY IMPREGNATION. Completely dry and soft upper suspension - surround.
I don't see any other reason for this, except they forgot to do it n the factory!
Hard to imagine it could completely evaporate, even after 35 years.
Especially once I've seen some 10-12 pcs VMRs on my own eyes yet. Plus checking all available pictures on the net. None of them had no impregnation, except pair of my friend :)
And also inside nothing new, chaotic assebly of the crossover. Each has has different 17,7uF capacitors. One is slightly smaller size in than the one in another box (although same producer, same type code). Hard to believe these speakers were assembled in Switzerland! By the way the front covers aren't interchangeable between his and my Deltas. The pins are in the same place but they are different size!
Swiss Clock should run much better! :)
Thanks for the compliment :)
Since I have done so many things and in the end it was that simple, I felt a bit stupid. ;)
I just checked mine too and they also have a impregnation. Luckily. It surprised me that you cant change the front covers. The more we know about them the more shocked we are. ;)
But still one of the best speaker I've ever heart.
Since I shortened the signal path and possible problem causes on the crossover, I thougt that my vmr would now maybe play as loud as the other one. But it is still playing 3-4 db less loud. Also, if I play a sinus wave of 700hz the frequency sounds deeper and less sharp on the less louder vmr. But my handy app says loudest frequency is 700 hz. Do you have any idea what part of the crossover could cause that. I thought it may be a capacitor, but I am not sure.
 
Hi

Me again. ;)

I wanted to ask what parts would improve the sound if I would exchange them.
I think the capacitors and the resistors. But I am not sure.
Since some of you had some similar projects I thought maybe you would know more.

Cheers
 
Hi together,

I'm quite new here and not sure if this is still active but I'll give it a try, maybe some "D" fans still like to have a chat.
I just wanted to leave here that I also owe the D which have the first version of the VMR's. When I bought the speaker the guy also handed me some spare VMR's and this pair is much lighter than the build in VMR's. I assume they have Neodyme magnet or so but i'm not sure if that would affect the loundness of them.

Another question to you guys: How do I prepare the D's for Bi-Amp usage? What has to be done with the crossover?

Hope you're still active and best regards from Germany
 
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Another question to you guys: How do I prepare the D's for Bi-Amp usage? What has to be done with the crossover?

If your pair is like the pair I had, you don't have to do anything other than change this plug on the bottom. That will get the speaker prepared for biamping. You then need to use requisite electronics in front of the speaker to split your signal (around 350 Hz if I recall)

This is the biamp plug. Lay speaker on its back, pull out the existing plug, swap with one of these and pull speaker back up. You're ready to go.

EV plugs.jpg 16.jpg 15.jpg
 

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If your pair is like the pair I had, you don't have to do anything other than change this plug on the bottom. That will get the speaker prepared for biamping. You then need to use requisite electronics in front of the speaker to split your signal (around 350 Hz if I recall)

This is the biamp plug. Lay speaker on its back, pull out the existing plug, swap with one of these and pull speaker back up. You're ready to go.

View attachment 952291 View attachment 952293 View attachment 952294

Thanks so much. That's a really helpful and interesting manual though. I thought that I have a complete manual but never seen these pages :) And yes, I've seen the plug. So technically just pulling out and using the external equalizer... but it seems that my 19" version doesn't have low and high output. I assume it's essential to have or is there any other way ?

IMG_20170618_203941038.jpg
[/url][/IMG] [url=https://ibb.co/bQC955][/URL]

Thanks again!
 
Edit: Sry, got it now. I need an external crossover of course - Those who can read have clearly an advantage! :)
 
Here are all the pages just in case you're missing one/some.... and.... a direct scan of a glossy brochure I have/had. (may have given it to my nephew when I gave him the speakers...) ouch....did I say gave? :crazy:
 

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And the glossies along with a review that I saw 'back when'. I bought them sight/sound unseen based on the article.

Not so sure I'd be so blind (ignorant) today on reading a review.

BTW, also bought the Pioneer CTF-1000 because of the same article.
 

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