AR3a HELP!!
- Thread starter VINTAGEO
- Start date
onplane
What! No Wake???
No "fair fight" unless you play old vinyl. No matter what amp you use (and I don't care if it's 10,000 wpc) you cannot do better than the attached frequency response curve published by AR with both controls full ON.
The only way to overcome this with the original drivers is to:
1. Bi-amp
2. Cut back on the mid driver to bring it in line with the tweeter (now, this puts the mid way, way behind the woofer and makes a base heavy speaker even more bass heavy)
3. Apply more power to the mid/tweeter amp to bring everything back into balance
2. Cut back on the mid driver to bring it in line with the tweeter (now, this puts the mid way, way behind the woofer and makes a base heavy speaker even more bass heavy)
3. Apply more power to the mid/tweeter amp to bring everything back into balance
Now, I bi-amp my 3a's with just the original three terminals. The better way to do this however is to bring out two new terminals. There is no sonic improvement over what I'm doing, but you gain a lot of flexibility. For example with 4 independent terminals you can easily use a tube amp on the mids/tweeters.
Hope this helps...
Regards,
Jerry
Attachments
4. EQ
VINTAGEO
Newbie in New B.
The reason I say "fair fight" is that it's hard to compare when the mids and or highs cut out on AR's when bass hits due to pitted pots and nearly 50 year old caps..I'm in no way saying that one of my speakers is better than the other. they, they are obviously quite different. The Dahlquists image like crazy and are very detailed, also I must have gotten a special pair because I don't find bass to be lacking at all. A friend of mine just redid his as well and he doesn't get the bass that I do. (maybe due to my replacement woofers from Reginar?)
The AR's are special in the way that they produce full detailed sound while maintaining a somewhat laid back easy to listen to sound, all while keeping a rather polite footprint..
The AR's are special in the way that they produce full detailed sound while maintaining a somewhat laid back easy to listen to sound, all while keeping a rather polite footprint..
Rex81
Well-Known Member
There’s certainly no “fair fight” if one or both speakers aren’t fully restored to their original specs... That’s like sending a guy with a broken arm into a boxing match and calling the other guy a better fighter when he wins.
onplane
What! No Wake???
Look, those AR's were designed in an era when vinyl was the main source for sound reproduction. During the late 50's and early 60's record companies enhanced high frequencies on their records to compensate for the poor play back systems (record players with ceramic cartridges) prevalent in the marketplace.
AR designed their speakers to work perfectly with those records. Just look at the response curve from AR which I posted. Fast forward to modern digital playback without that high frequency enhancement and AR speakers sound dull and lifeless. That was what I meant by the shootout isn't really fair.
You can "fix" the problem, but only with two amps. Some say EQ's can help, but EQ's by nature introduce additional problems and distortions.
VINTAGEO, does this make sense now?
Regards,
Jerry
VINTAGEO
Newbie in New B.
Thanks for the clarification onplane, I was just unclear as to what you were trying to say.
I feel that the ARs have a wonderful FULL detailed sound that I enjoy very much, and likewise the DQ-10s have superior soundstage and imaging while maintaining great listenability.
If you asked me to choose a favorite it would be easy! but chances are it would be different the next day
I have owned and heard many different speakers, and I must say the newer digital friendly speakers, while they do sound great, are lacking in substance, class, warmth, if you will. (Too Perfect)
I would rather listen to my vintage AR's than most newer speakers produced today. I guess it's just the feeling I get when listening to them. Like us they aren't PERFECT and I think that's the most satisfying part, they don't have to be. As long as we enjoy our music, that's what counts.
Don't judge speakers by their performance numbers, but by the way they actually make you FEEL..
onplane
What! No Wake???
Thanks for the clarification onplane, I was just unclear as to what you were trying to say.
I would rather listen to my vintage AR's than most newer speakers produced today. I guess it's just the feeling I get when listening to them. Like us they aren't PERFECT and I think that'stt the most satisfying part, they don't have to be. As long as we enjoy our music, that's what counts.
Don't judge speakers by their performance numbers, but by the way they actually make you FEEL..
VINTAGEO, as you know, I also have a set of 3a's and I am the original owner. In the early 90's I bought a set of AR TSW-610's (3 ways with 12 inch acoustic suspension woofer). For years after I bought the TSW's I stopped listening to the 3a's as they just sounded way to "dull" compared to the "over bright" TSW's.
Today I listen to both systems. Both are bi-amped, but for different reasons. The 3a's required more voltage applied to the mids/tweeters and the TSW's required less voltage.
Beauty of bi-amping is we move voice control from the back of the speakers to volume controls on the independent amps so with ease we can return to the original configuration. With that same ease we can turn East Coast speakers into West coast. On my TSW's it's just a matter of remote clicks.
Regards,
Jerry
Wooow! What's the value of those oil cans?
VINTAGEO
Newbie in New B.
So I have a question, I picked up a BEAUTIFUL Sansui model Eight last night and was wondering if it would pair well with the AR's ? I hear they are quite the receiver.. This one has an issue though, bad left channel, I will try to sort that out before I get the AR's all redone.
At 60 wpc, it will be ok. Your JVC 1010 will be much better driving the AR's. They like power.
VINTAGEO
Newbie in New B.
I wish I only had TWO! lol
