AT120E vs AT130E Needle

Jack: Well, the AT7V body just happens to be gold coloured like the ones of the TK7Ea and TK7LCa - but that also goes for the AT9V body and doesn't mean a lot, 'cause afaik the generator data differs. So I go by the most similar needle configuration, and that would be the one of the TK5Ea. Whereas generator-wise the AT7V would be closer to the TK1Ea and TK3Ea, iirc. But it's probably best to rather not consider the AT-7V a resurrected Signet TKxya at all and instead look at the AT-xVs as yet another spin-off of the AT120 family...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

P.S.: Btw, anyone happen to have a spec sheet (should be included in the manual) for the TK5Ea, TK7Ea and TK7LCa? I thought I had a pic of one - but if I actually did, it's gone...
 
lini said:
Jack: Well, the AT7V body just happens to be gold coloured like the ones of the TK7Ea and TK7LCa - but that also goes for the AT9V body and doesn't mean a lot, 'cause afaik the generator data differs. So I go by the most similar needle configuration, and that would be the one of the TK5Ea. Whereas generator-wise the AT7V would be closer to the TK1Ea and TK3Ea, iirc. But it's probably best to rather not consider the AT-7V a resurrected Signet TKxya at all and instead look at the AT-xVs as yet another spin-off of the AT120 family...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

P.S.: Btw, anyone happen to have a spec sheet (should be included in the manual) for the TK5Ea, TK7Ea and TK7LCa? I thought I had a pic of one - but if I actually did, it's gone...
Click to expand...

Couldn't find any specs on the TK7Ea or TK7LCa but did find the inductance and resistance specs for the TK5Ea (1000 mH and 1200 Ohms respectively).

Here is a table of available info:

Cartridge/Inductance/DC Resistance
Signet TK5Ea/1000 mH/1200 Ohms
Signet TK3E/1000 mH/1200 Ohms
Signet TK5E/1000 mH/1200 Ohms
Signet TK7E/450 mH/500 Ohms
Signet TK7SU/450 mH/500 Ohms
Audio Technica TK7V/500 mH/650 Ohms

Perhaps my logic is flawed but if the inductance/resistance specs for the TK7Ea are comparable to that of the TK7E (and TK7SU), it would appear that the generator in the AT7V would be closer to the TK7 series than the TK5 series (or the TK1 or TK3 series as you suggest).

Jack
 
jackmowbray said:
Here is a table of available info:

Cartridge/Inductance/DC Resistance
Signet TK5Ea/1000 mH/1200 Ohm
Signet TK3E/1000 mH/1200 Ohm
Signet TK5E/1000 mH/1200 Ohm
Signet TK7E/450 mH/500 Ohm
Signet TK7SU/450 mH/500 Ohm
Signet TK1Ea/490 mH/780 Ohm
Signet TK3Ea/490 mH/780 Ohm
Audio Technica AT7V/500 mH/650 Ohm
Click to expand...

Added a bit more info and made a minor correction - hope that's ok with you...

Anyway, as already mentioned above, the AT7V generator so far would seem to be most similar to the generators of the TK1Ea and TK3Ea.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
Celt said:
Last year, after a mishap with my AT120E, I decided to experiment and ordered the bonded eliptical AT100 stylus. I immediately heard a difference between the two. The 100 is slightly veiled on the top end. Not as revealing as one might say. I wonder what other stylis will fit the 120 body. I know the AT440 will...what others are there?
Click to expand...

Any of these:

ATN100E - bonded .3 X .7 elliptical tip, straight aluminium cantilever
ATN103 - bonded .6 conical tip, straight aluminium cantilever
ATN120E(i) - bonded .4 X .7 elliptical tip, straight aluminium cantilever
ATN120E(ii) - nude .3 X .7 elliptical tip, straight aluminium cantilever
ATN120E/II - bonded .3 X .7 elliptical tip, straight aluminium cantilever

ATN125LC - Tianium-bonded LinearContact, tapered aluminium cantilever
ATN130E - nude .2 X .7 elliptical tip, tapered aluminium cantilever
ATN135E - nude .2 X .7 elliptical tip, tapered aluminium cantilever
ATN140LC - nude LinearContact, tapered aluminium cantilever
ATN140ML - nude MicroLine, tapered aluminium cantilever

ATN150E - nude .2 X .7 elliptical tip, beryllium cantilever
ATN150ANV - nude MicroLine, sapphire cantilever
ATN150Ti - nude MicroLine (?), tapered titanium cantilever
ATN150MLX - nude MicroLine, gold coated boron cantilever
ATN155LC - nude LinearContact, beryllium cantilever

ATN160ML - nude MicroLine, gold coated beryllium cantilever
ATN430E(/OCC) - nude .3 X .7 elliptical tip, straight aluminium cantilever
ATN440ML(/OCC) - nude MicroLine, tapered aluminium cantilever
ATN440MLa - nude MicroLine, tapered aluminium cantilever
ATN450E(/OCC) - bonded .4 X .7 elliptical tip, straight aluminium cantilever

:D :smoke: :music:


And you can also use the p-mount variations! I have an ATN112EP .4 X .7 elliptical, and a JICO-branded
ATN102EP which is a .3 X .7 elliptical. It's my first stylus for this cartridge that isn't a genuine
AT and it sounds surprisingly good. Got it from: http://www.turntableneedles.com/

Oh, and there's stylii from the Signet range of MM cartridges as well that can be used.


So, quite a few options available...



James H
 
Last edited:
James: Oh, and btw, the ATN160ML isn't really black, but rather a dark brown with tiny metallic sprinkles. ;)

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

P.S.: Darn, now I have the Stranglers' "Golden Brown" in my head. Well, there could be worse... :)
 
gusten said:
What is the diff between ATN130 and ATN135? Or isn´t there any?
gusten
Click to expand...

Good question as the specs are very similar. Of the two the 135E is rarer of the two. I was lucky to get one about 6 years ago for a great price. I haven't seen one listed on ebay in a very long time.
 
S681E³S: Do you still have that thingy? Maybe a comparison of needle close-ups could reveal possible differences in shank size...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
lini said:
James: Oh, and btw, the ATN160ML isn't really black, but rather a dark brown with tiny metallic sprinkles. ;)

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini

P.S.: Darn, now I have the Stranglers' "Golden Brown" in my head. Well, there could be worse... :)
Click to expand...

Yes, a bit like the old stlye Technics hi-fi components. They weren't really black either. :D


James H
 
James: Yup, a bit like that. I call that "Technics NATO olive green metallic", btw. :)

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
BTW lini, that's at least 20 stylii in the AT120 family. How many cartridges
were available in p-mount form? :scratch2:


James H
 
James: Well, basically there were nine needle quality steps (102P, 102EP, 112EP, 122EP, 122LP, 132EP, 142LP, 152LP and 152MLP) - while the needles of the AT422EP/OCC and AT432EP/OCC just were ATN102EPs and ATN112EPs with differently coloured plastic carriers, so that I wouldn't count these extra. And there were a couple of renamed variants of the 102P family (e.g. VS215EP, SS315E/U, SLT96E, TC350EP...), but as far as I'm aware most, if not all, of these stick to the original AT102P family needle colour scheme, and I'm not aware that any of these would have brought a new needle configuration that wouldn't have existed in the original AT102P family.

Oh, and in case you'd wonder about the difference between the ATN102EP and the ATN112EP: These sport almost the same configuration, but the former has got the cheaper, glossy kind of straight alu cantilever we also find on the current ATN100E and ATN120E/II, while the ATN112EP sports the more sophisticated, matte kind of straight alu cantilever we can also find on the still current ATN120E. That matte surface comes from anodising, which practically forms a kind of artificial sapphire coating for improved stiffness. An often overlooked feature, imo. And btw, AT isn't the only manufacturer who has used or is using different types of alu alloys in different quality ranges - for example, in their MPx0 family Nagaoka used A5052 for the MP10, A2017 for the MP11 and UT58 for the MP15. Unfortunately very few manufacturers publish such exact specs, though...

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
Joseph: Would you be looking for ATN130E/132EPs in particular or rather just any AT needle type with that cantilever/stone combo? Because I think Hifi-Phono-House(.de) over here should still offer the ATS13 for a bit less than 70 Euro (incl. VAT (currently 19 %) - which shouldn't apply in case of export sales to non-EU countries, though...).

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
Was fortunate to find a number of ATS13 for a very good price. I really like this needle; it´s a bit different from a Shibata of the same quality, but I find it nearly equally good.
 
I have the styli from both the AT120E and AT130E. Here is a comparison.
AT120-1.jpg
AT120E on the left, AT130E on the right. Same magnification. Left is thinner, stylus tip is smaller.

AT120-2.jpg
AT120E on the left, AT130E on the right. Tip on the right cantilever is tapered.

AT120-3.jpg
AT120E on the left. AT130E on the right. The stylus on the right is cut from a square shank.
 
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