C47 phono stage
- Thread starter GP Hill
- Start date
grillebilly
Empty Head
I have one and listen to a lot of records. I really dig it, it's the first pre I have owned that allows different loading. I do have to admit the old Onkyo receiver I was using for a pre was fantastic. I know most would scoff at the idea.
The Mac was an improvement. I tested a couple others using a A/B switch so I could hear the same song at the same volume at the same time using the switch. I got my wife and kids to listen so there was no psychological factor. Naturally the C47 won, pretty much in every way. I'm glad I got it, it's versatile and does everything well. From all accounts it's the same pre as their higher end model, the C52, but without external tone controls.
The Mac was an improvement. I tested a couple others using a A/B switch so I could hear the same song at the same volume at the same time using the switch. I got my wife and kids to listen so there was no psychological factor. Naturally the C47 won, pretty much in every way. I'm glad I got it, it's versatile and does everything well. From all accounts it's the same pre as their higher end model, the C52, but without external tone controls.
Fantastic phono stage. I think the feature I like most is the ability change the loading settings on-the-fly with the remote. McIntosh has always made a great phono stage, and that's the reason they never needed to make standalone phono preamps. They do now to accommodate users with preamps like the D100 and D150 that are digital only, that end up wanting to spin records.
TD 124 is a good turntable but I have found that you need a turntable that would be closer in age to the C47. while the table is good, it's 60's technology and a lot has improved since then. Any unhappiness you may be experiencing is due to the phono stage in the C47 revealing the limitations of the turntable.
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GP Hill
Super Member
My 124 has a newer SME tonearm and the table has been restored or in a lot of cases improved. I’m using an AT Art 9 cartridge that sells for a thousand dollars. I would be glad to put this combination up against any of your Technics tables. My question remains, how much difference would a higher end phono stage make?
Yeah I had a TD 124 that had been restored in my possesion once too. Most of the people who have TD 124's have no experience with the SP Series ( not just the 15) I met one guy whose table used to be a 124, He got an SP 10 and he couldn't say enough how it blew the 124 out of the water. Really, they arent bad, but the SP 10's will outrun that and the EPA 100 line of tonearms beat all the really old SME's. Not being mean. Iseeing how the 124 is built Compared to the SP series, big difference.
BUY I was not suggesting that the SP series is the only way to go by a long shot. I know how many people hold on to those old idlers, but really go beyond them with something newer, you won't go back.
BUY I was not suggesting that the SP series is the only way to go by a long shot. I know how many people hold on to those old idlers, but really go beyond them with something newer, you won't go back.
no pissing match here, trust me. I don't do that sort of thing. throughout my upgrades I have discovered newer gear is better than older gear. The C47 is very recent, so the fault most likely lies in the limitations of 1960s technology, you don't have to buy what I have. I am not saying what I have is the best and what you have sucks, I am saying overall Gear is Improving. That includes everything. if your amp is anywhere as recent as the C47 is, I suspect the weak link in the system is the old piece. C47 has a really nice phono stage in it, there is more room for improvement that will yeild bigger results, especially with the cartridge in question. Although I have not heard that particular cart, I'd love to. Big fan of AT's stuff here. TD 124 was amazing in its time, there probably was no better table back then when it was new, and it may sound pretty good now also, but from what I have experienced, more modern tables can do much more very well and run with less noise.
GP Hill
Super Member
I’ve got the same amp as you. A Mac mc452. My tone arm is a three year old SME. I’ve thought about a new turntable, even went on the Sota website the other day and looked around. Again I’m enjoying my analogue rig, just wondering how much if any would a higher end phono pre help.
kevzep
Its all about the Music
I have a Technics SL1200 MKI Limited Edition (Black with Gold hardware/tone arm), I slapped a Ortofon VMS20 on that and it blows my Thorens TD125 MKII with an SME into the weeds, it tracks better, less noise, better everything....
I was surprised, but I agree that in some cases new is better, and I have to say, the phono pre on my C48 is pretty damn good, you get the right gear on the end of it and it can hold its own against anything...
I was surprised, but I agree that in some cases new is better, and I have to say, the phono pre on my C48 is pretty damn good, you get the right gear on the end of it and it can hold its own against anything...
it's always possible that there COULD be a phono pre that you may like better, but I really do not think the one you have is going to be a great deal worse than the other stuff out there, but because of what you have there would be a lot more trial and error to get an improvement. So much of what you already have is quite good. if you had lesser gear it would be easier to improve upon it, but you are dangerously close to the point of diminishing returns, if your not already there.
this is pretty much what those who DID actually make the leap from many different Thorens ( yes even the 124) have said after actually trying it. No, this does not mean Technics is the only way to an improvement, But I have heard the new 1200G and it is NOT the same turntable as the old ones, and what I have read about the SP10R , seems like it's amazing. Even a Very well known Turntable lover who often champions the Boutiquey side of audio had one on his instagram page with a tonearm on it that used to be on his other table.......Don't count them out, don't believe all the people that have only read about them say. The new one doesn't cog, and even if the old ones do you can't hear it. But you can hear wow and flutter and a cartridge can pick up platter rotation noise and send it to your speakers.
Having owned a Rogue Ares and a Manley Chinook, I can tell you with confidence, that the C47 phono stage is excellent. The Manley is one of the best phono preamps, until you spend 2 or 3 times the price. When you are at this level, and higher, the performance becomes more about flavor and what sounds good to you. With that said, I would recommend putting any available funds into a turntable upgrade, the C47 will perform.
Luv my 47 but.....haven't used my phono section....not into vinyl.
Nothing wrong with that.....I gave up on vinyl. Made the switch to Tidal streaming and haven't looked back.
GP Hill
Super Member
Thanks. This is exactly what I was after. I’ve compared my turntable several times to streaming Tidal hifi and on the same music my turntable sounds better. I’m sure there are better tables and arms than I have , it comes down to how much I have to spend to get better sound. I’ve heard a higher end Sota with the vacuum plater and a Dynavector 17d3 cart and it was very nice. Black background and a ton of detail, but it was also hooked up to about 30k dollars worth of electronics and some big Magnaplanar speakers in a good room.
twiiii
Lunatic Member
If you have speakers that respond below 30Hz approaching 16 HZ you'll find your 124 to be a freight train. Its why I changed to a 125 as soon as they came out. I would be looking for something more current. Clear Audio, SME, The better VPI's. I'd love to try a Bergmann Magne. An Innovation with a TT-5. 15a or the new Synergy by SME. Or a SL1200 G for something more affordable,,, A preowned VPI Aries III D might be something to explore. I had a chance to pick-up a HRX cheap but I just didn't have the space for it.
