Cable - audible differences?

Discussion in 'The Cutting Edge' started by soundmig, Dec 18, 2017.

  1. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Smart Ass Sponsor Subscriber

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    Quoted for truth^^^

    I have inaudible cable whenever I forget to plug one end in, I assure you my detection meter in my brain goes off immediately. ;)
     
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  2. FileFixer

    FileFixer Well-Known Member

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    I have network cable CAT7 for speaker cable and its sound good. Capacitance is not big problem for my amplifier but soon I can doing measurements how much is capacitance have.
     
  3. UncleBingo

    UncleBingo AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    My inaudible cables get louder with very limited bandwidth when I forget to plug them in.
     
  4. Snow

    Snow AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    No need IMHO for all the measurements and scientific jargon along with a healthy dose of BS by the speaker cable makers as to why there cable is better then someone elses. Keep it simple either you like how they change the sound or you don't. We could spend the rest of our time on earth demanding double blind testing, measurements of all sorts etc and fighting amongst our selves trying to prove one point or the other. Who cares who has the biggest dick?

    If they sound good to you keep your cables if they don't sell them to someone else on the same journey.


    Regards Snow
     
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  5. UncleBingo

    UncleBingo AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    ^ Never seen an objective standard for raising goosebumps outside of temperature : ) Excepting perhaps Ella Fitzgerald or Howling Wolf ...
     
  6. unfairlane

    unfairlane AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Yup Snow, strands of very stiff wire is the only way to do speakerwires. Anything else will reduce bass-dynamic and soundstage++ as you correctly observed. The (separately isolated) strands needs to have an area of at least 9awg each to get clear of any bass-compression. Thinner strands like 12awg will still compress the bassdynamics even if they clearly outperforms all kinds of "high-end" factory-cables.

    About soundstage, any multistrand wires will have a high amount of cross-over distortion that ruins the 3D while a (thick) solid wire will deliver a clean undistorted signal.

    Moorebeer; Yeah I guess some sarcasm is what every cable-thread needs
     
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  7. restorer-john

    restorer-john Addicted Member

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    mib.jpg

    :)
     
  8. Homer4beer

    Homer4beer AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Na.....they are just happy to pay the price (or too embarrassed to say they can't really tell any difference) because they have more money than they know what to do with.

    The audio shop/pro tells them to get such and such a cable to match their 250k system so they do it. Could they honestly tell the difference between the 10k cable or even a 1k cable? Do they possess amazing golden ears that can discern such finitely small differences in sound reproduction (if any at all)?

    I doubt it.

    I'm not suffering from envy wank factor either although if money was flooding in faster than I could possibly spend it then sure, I'd go nuts on whatever I wanted.

    Discussing gear that is astronomically priced and very hard to quantity when it comes to performance is a bit like comparing the taste of salts from around the world. They all contain the same basic chemical make up and do the same thing (season food, reproduce music) but can you really tell the difference? (salt from the Himalayas compared to normal table salt) (an excellent $150 cable to a 10k cable). Top chief's argue over whether where the salt comes from makes any difference to the taste all the time. Same with audio cables. If you are spending 10 times on salt compared to another restaurant then of course you are going to tell your customers it tastes better.

    Can your customers really really tell though?

    Same with audio cables. They know they are getting "a premium product" as it's reflected in the amount of money lifted out of the wallet but does that mean it sounds that much better to them?

    At least things like supercars, mega yachts etc can actually be measured to differentiate the purchases unlike hifi cables.

    Sorry to go on a bit, I just find the type of gear you are talking about extremely hard to differentiate. If looks are the main difference then you could argue they are more pieces of artwork (still generally a liability not an assest) that also reproduce music extremely well. I get that, I really do, but to say the 10k-20k cable sounds measurably and audibly different to a quality cable us mere mortals would consider buying is simply confirmation bias or somebody justifying to themselves spending the money (cause it looks bad ass).
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2018
  9. Homer4beer

    Homer4beer AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Sorry. Tired and got passionate. Post edited to be more civil :)
     
  10. 4-2-7

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  11. Homer4beer

    Homer4beer AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    I'm not "crapping on the thread". I do think good quality cables can make a difference. Do 10k cables sound measurably different to $150 cables? :dunno:

    I don't have 250k spare to spend on audio gear so I can have a voice in here so no more from me in this thread.
     

     

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  12. Hyfi

    Hyfi Addicted Member

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    The Cutting Edge is for those who are passionate about actually trying things for themselves with systems that are revealing enough to show differences. Then we discuss them without dissing others who do have revealing systems and who can hear differences.
     
  13. Homer4beer

    Homer4beer AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Understood......

    I've got a 20k system but not in the same league as you guys so I'll spectate from the sidelines :thumbsup:
     
  14. botrytis

    botrytis Trying not to be a Small Speaker Hoarder Subscriber

    I don't either but that doesn't mean I can't have a constructive dialogue about this topic. You can still discuss as long as you are constructive. Saying that you don't have the coin is besides the point. You are limiting YOURSELF then.
     
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  15. Hyfi

    Hyfi Addicted Member

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    Sound and Measurable are two different things in this hobby. And again, the higher cost cable probably will sound "Different" than than the cheaper one but the question is what %. And for the people with the money to spend, they are more than happy to get a .5% increase in performance.
     
  16. botrytis

    botrytis Trying not to be a Small Speaker Hoarder Subscriber

    Exactly. Does that mean you have to do that, no. You do what you think is best and sounds best in YOUR system.

    I did hear a demo of 2 generations of Transparent Speaker Cables, their TOTL ones. I actually felt the previous gen was better than the latest gen. I could hear a difference and I did not like what I heard in the new gen. Would I buy Transparent Cables, No. But it was a good experience for me and a positive one at that.
     

     

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  17. Hyfi

    Hyfi Addicted Member

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    ^^^^

    That's what I am talking about....Real World Experience

    Sounding Different does not always mean Sounding Better.
     
  18. House de Kris

    House de Kris Loud-n-Deep

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    Could you share a bit more about your theory of 9AWG cables being clear of any bass-compression, while 12AWG is masked by a cloudy veil of compressed bass? To my limited way of thinking, the only way to get compression in a cable is if it has a non-linear resistance due to current flowing through it. In all my years, I have never met a cable that can change its resistance. In fact, every resistance guide I've read has never stated values based on current flow. It is what it is at all currents.

    I guess through dumb luck I wire my woofers with 5AWG cables (with 8AWG inside the cabinets).
     
  19. Hyfi

    Hyfi Addicted Member

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    I'm confused, you have $20K worth of gear but it's not revealing enough to let you hear the difference between a pair of Kimber PBJs and TOTL Synergistic Cables (if you could try them both)?

    Except for my CDP, my main system is from the early 90's, and for original owner, did cost $20K. My room is not really treated but I can hear those types of differences as well as when I just replaced all the stock 16 and 18 gauge power cords.

    Maybe you would like to share what all your gear is and we can discuss why it's not revealing enough for these simple real world tests?
     
  20. botrytis

    botrytis Trying not to be a Small Speaker Hoarder Subscriber

    My system is not EXPENSIVE AT ALL, I mean I am using ELAC Uni Fi UB5's. currently rebuilt Kenwood L-07M amps and an Audio Research SP-16 I bought used. It is a surprisingly very revealing system, although I have treated the room it is in and I think that is the key. I did get a NEW DAC (a TEAC UD-501) on closeout and that really helped my front end a huge amount.
     
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