Counterfeit cartridges - how common?

[eb2jim]

What is often too good to be true is the benefits of doing business with Chinese factories. On many levels they are fine, and can deliver containers full of finished goods to ports in California for less than just the cost of tooling up in the US. On the other hand, as many companies have found, the delivery of cad cam plans for making tools, car parts, guitar amps and phono cartridges leads to lots of gray market goods reaching the US. Its a notorious problem with the way they do business. And they have a history of gearing up to make things that are easy to copy, so if your company is making MG 29 Red Ed Goldring Elan type carts, and your factory can get ahold of a CD with the plans for another higher end cart, there you go.

Buy em by the sack!
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-.../680689148.html?spm=2114.40010208.4.88.rgXdEI

 

[reydelaplaya]

Buy em by the sack!
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-.../680689148.html?spm=2114.40010208.4.88.rgXdEI

Or buy em by the pound!

http://www.vinylguru.co.uk/products...onal-turntable-headshell-cartridge-stylus-m7g

Pound sterling that is. £34.99 for just one to be exact. Which works out to be about $51.00 in real money.

But I don't get it though. Is it a fake? Or is it just a generic cartridge from China with a healthy markup?

 

[eb2jim]

Or buy em by the pound!

http://www.vinylguru.co.uk/products...onal-turntable-headshell-cartridge-stylus-m7g

Pound sterling that is. £34.99 for just one to be exact. Which works out to be about $51.00 in real money.

But I don't get it though. Is it a fake? Or is it just a generic cartridge from China with a healthy markup?

Well, I only recommend buying by the sack at White Castle, and you'll put on the pounds, imperial measure. But it is hard to say. My guess, based on what I know about the shadowy world of RED Chinese manufacturing, is they are probably close tolerance unauthorized copies. In short, they're fake. But a lot of times even the companies who find out about this stuff are amazed at how identical they are to the real thing. There was a GM car that the Chinese bought in South Korea, shipped to the mainland, and they had manufactured and put up for sale an entire car that was so close that the doors and motor parts interchanged. They do this on all scales, including clones of the old Technics SL-1200. They make really bad ones, like Gemini level, and frighteningly good ones.

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-...50&btsid=d0c3ff3e-05c0-4c4d-8c32-a4c79ad2874e

http://www.cracked.com/article_19742_the-5-most-insane-examples-chinese-counterfeiting.html

 

[majick47]

If the Ebay seller has a good feedback and deals in decent quality audio related equipment he has probably already verified the DL-110 is the real deal, probably gray market from Japan that was overstock, out of business etc. If it's a Ebay seller from China I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole, almost a 100% guarantee of a counterfit cartridge of very poor quality and is out to rip off the clueless buyer.

 

[Decibel_116]

If the Ebay seller has a good feedback and deals in decent quality audio related equipment he has probably already verified the DL-110 is the real deal, probably gray market from Japan that was overstock, out of business etc. If it's a Ebay seller from China I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole, almost a 100% guarantee of a counterfit cartridge of very poor quality and is out to rip off the clueless buyer.

I ordered my AT150MLX from Japan for a great price. Can't read the owner's manual because it's in Japanese. But then again, who really needs to read the owner's manual?

 

[Mister Pig]

If the Ebay seller has a good feedback and deals in decent quality audio related equipment he has probably already verified the DL-110 is the real deal, probably gray market from Japan that was overstock, out of business etc. If it's a Ebay seller from China I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole, almost a 100% guarantee of a counterfit cartridge of very poor quality and is out to rip off the clueless buyer.

Apparently you do not know who 2Juki is, nor his reputation as an honest seller. And he is Chinese.

Regards
Mister Pig

 

[Montycat]

If the Ebay seller has a good feedback and deals in decent quality audio related equipment he has probably already verified the DL-110 is the real deal, probably gray market from Japan that was overstock, out of business etc. If it's a Ebay seller from China I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole, almost a 100% guarantee of a counterfit cartridge of very poor quality and is out to rip off the clueless buyer.

Where is the Dislike button?

 

[reydelaplaya]

Apparently you do not know who 2Juki is, nor his reputation as an honest seller. And he is Chinese.

Regards
Mister Pig

Yep! 2juki is exactly who I was referring to in my other post about who I got my DL-110 from. Wasn't sure if I should mention him by name here or I would have.

I agree, geat seller!

 

[tri_pod]

IMO the purveyors of fakes are just as guilty of fraud than the makers of these things. Watches appear to be top of the pops when it comes to fakes. At a celebration of someone's birthday, I was given a Lange & Sohne Glashuette automatic wristwatch which I still have here somewhere.

A long time ago, I was a watch importer and distributor of (genuine) Swiss made watches so I had a professional interest at looking at this Lange watch.

Here is what I saw:
High quality leather strap
Lange logo embossed on the strap buckle
Lange logo on the winding crown
Domed mineral watch glass
Correct Lange & Sohne logo on the dial
Gasketed screwed caseback embossed with all correct details
Automatic, jewelled mechanical movement

I don't wear it and I was flabbergasted at the ends these fakers go to to fake things.

tri_pod

 

[Meloski]

Apparently you do not know who 2Juki is, nor his reputation as an honest seller. And he is Chinese.

I just ordered an AT33PTG II from 2Juki. Im feeling pretty confident with this seller. I certainly did my homework before dropping $500.00 on a cart. His reputation spanned a few different audio forums.

 

[alanp123]

This thread is kind of old, but I was looking around a while back and I think I actually managed to find some fake Audio Technica cartridges. It's not as interesting as the alleged fakes of Koetsu carts, but it seems that they do exist. It seems that several sellers are selling them, but this one has no logo in the seller pics, but the reviewer pics show that it has the Audio Technica logo on it.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PhonographCartridge/32773441113.html

 

[bangsezmax]

This thread is kind of old, but I was looking around a while back and I think I actually managed to find some fake Audio Technica cartridges. It's not as interesting as the alleged fakes of Koetsu carts, but it seems that they do exist. It seems that several sellers are selling them, but this one has no logo in the seller pics, but the reviewer pics show that it has the Audio Technica logo on it.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PhonographCartridge/32773441113.html

Those are ATs. They're just not labeled. Heck, the CN5625AL (same cart with a better cantilever/stylus) regularly drops below $20 retail. AT makes jillions of those and sells them to all sorts of turntable companies.

 

[vwestlife]

This may be a counterfeit stylus -- it's stamped D6800SL, Stanton's part number for a stereohedron stylus, but the quality looks poor, and it's priced far below what a real stereohedron stylus would sell for:

http://r.ebay.com/lbItBV

 

[vwestlife]

IMHO, if you take hamburger and call it "replacement for steak", it doesn't matter if it's really good hamburger at a really good price -- it's still not steak.

 

[alanp123]

Those are ATs. They're just not labeled. Heck, the CN5625AL (same cart with a better cantilever/stylus) regularly drops below $20 retail. AT makes jillions of those and sells them to all sorts of turntable companies.

I wasn't aware of that. I just figured that since they were unlabeled in the seller pictures that they were trying to avoid getting the listing removed. I didn't take into consideration that they probably get random stock of labeled and unlabeled carts.

 

[Bolan13]

Just bought an audio-technica at92ecd on ebay. The packing it arrived in looks different than the packaging on all the ads that I could find with images of packaging.

The thing that really makes me suspicious is the diagram on the instructions located on the packaging showing how to correctly wire it is reversed than what is indicated on the cartridge (right + g/ left + g)

Not sure what to make of this.

 

[cgutz]

In the camera world, there is a difference between gray market an counterfeit:
1) counterfeit is a product produced to imitate a genuine product
2) gray market is an OEM product, identical to the ones purchased in USA, but that is priced for overseas market by dealers not authorized by the manufacturer for retail sales in US. The item is identical and original manufacturer, but the serial number indicates it is to only be sold overseas at a reduced price. Authorized US dealers can't sell the same product for the overseas price. Likewise, the camera manufacturer will not provide warranty service (or possibly no repair service) if it is bought in the USA.

Gray market is a way to save money, until you have a problem.

 

[vwestlife]

Just bought an audio-technica at92ecd on ebay. The packing it arrived in looks different than the packaging on all the ads that I could find with images of packaging.

Different how? When I bought a new Audio-Technica P-Mount cartridge in Circuit City in 2002 or so, it came in a blister pack. But maybe you got one meant for OEM use. That's the case with the cheap AT3600s on eBay -- they're meant to be installed into new turntables, but companies in China are selling them directly to consumers.

 

[DustyOldPile]

Bottom line is if something seems to good to be true it generally is.

Grumpy, I'd amend this to 'usually is', just to be a bit clearer. Once in a while, something drops out of the sky at a ridiculous price. Case in point...I walked into a pawn shop not too long ago and saw a very nice DBX 3BX III on the shelf. There was a printer label on the top with the store's inventory bar code and a title, "Crossover - $40.00". Obviously they didn't know what they had. I bought it and it works flawlessly. They sell for hundreds on Ebay all day long. Had whomever inventoried it taken a couple minutes to just look on Ebay with the make and model to see what this gizmo was, they would have priced it accordingly.

Another example might be the Denon carts available at one time through Comet Supply at about 50% of everyone else's price. That was probably a gray market situation.

But overall, your words ring true. I've found that out the hard way more than once.

 

[DustyOldPile]

Because the wishing well people were complaining that profits were down. The banks rejected their counterfeit pennies.

Regards
Mister Pig

I thought it was a large thought-purchasing conglomerate who had a number of suppliers return the counterfeit pennies.