Disappointed with burned CDs...

Andrei

Active Member
Here's the story:
I got a good collection of original (pressed CDs). However, I can't buy quite everything I listen to (most of the albums are difficult to get on CD these days), so I also have a collection of burned audio CDs, made from FLAC files.
Recently I got a player with a good transport and I started to notice a somewhat disturbing fact, namely that the burned CDs don't sound quite as good as the original ones.
The burned ones have a somewhat glassy, processed sound and I feel that they lack some of the depth and tridimensionality the original ones have. It's not like a night and day difference, but it's there.
I started to do some research to find out why that is, but came up with nothing reliable.
My burned CDs are made with various burners and I only used flac files from reliable sources.
I only write at low speed. I used various blank CDs, from best quality to average quality, but they all have that same processed nuance.
I said to myself that I never had a really good professional burner and that that might be a reason so I managed to track down and get a Yamaha CRW 3200 with Audio Master Quality Recording.
Now, I must say that things seems to improve a little bit, that is the CDs I burned with the Yamaha sound better and more closely to the original ones than everything I did until now, but still there is a hint of processing.
Any advices?
 
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If I understand correctly, you have two variables.

1) Burned CDs (CD-R, I presume)
2) Data taken from FLAC (i.e., a conversion step for the data format).

Divide & conquer.
 
first off, what resolution are your flac files in, could be conversions to CD that
are the problem since they're burned all differently. if the flac is not `identical inres
then try an experiment, use Cd, rip to flac keep res (no up or downs), then
burn cd from flac. this last step includes some format conversion but not resolution
and will tell you whether its the flac to Cd or high-res (assumed) to CD-res.
 
Did you make an exact copy of one of your original CDs and compare them both? My ears can´t tell any differences, as far the few tests I performed. Writing a CD-R out from a flac file is a different process, as there is a sort of forgotten first half that presumably corresponds to ripping the original CD. Do you know what software was used for that and the parameters chosen? A similar universe of possibilities applies to the CD-R burning process.
 
Might try some music CDRs? Have to use these with my Philips CD recorder, data CDs don't work in that. Makes a superb CD though.
 
Should sound identical.

I think with the material dyes they use now in blank cd's you have to burn at fastest speed.
 
Just to answer some of the above questions and a little update:
I did myself a copy of a original CD. That means a straight copy without converting to flac. Just cloning. Well, there is no difference in sound whatsoever. Simply identical.
That means that the issue occurs somewhere in the wav to flac/flac to wav conversion. I know everybody says that there should be no difference, but somehow there is. That glassy processed tint annoys me as hell. It seems that I cannot get rid of it.
Also, after converting the wav to flac I already feel that there is a kind of loss of energy in sound, although as I said before it's not at all like a night and day difference.
There is a somewhat revealing difference only after reconverting to wav and burning it to a CD-R and comparing it with the original CD source. The player, having a good transport, seems to be quite revealing.
 
first off, what resolution are your flac files in, could be conversions to CD that
Most of them 16/44, but regardless of the resolution, that processed tinge is still there.

Might try some music CDRs? Have to use these with my Philips CD recorder, data CDs don't work in that. Makes a superb CD though.

I also tried Music CD-Rs, with the same results.

I think with the material dyes they use now in blank cd's you have to burn at fastest speed.

I tried faster speeds, but nothing changed.
 
Well technically any lossless copy should sound identical, leaving either the DAC or media as the culprit. Try another burner or brand of disc. I had a LOT of transciption errors when using matte finish discs or any with labels printed on them.

Something else to check is your hardware and software buffers and read ahead capabilities. Improperly matched settings can result in all sorts of artifacts and other digital weirdness.
 
further: my suspicions are (since the res is identical not up or down, it's media independent,
player independent, recording speed independent) then its in the cd-to-flac conversion.

as a hypothesis, if its been your only common factor then
1. try cd-to-flac from a trusted CD, then back from flac-to-cd and compare
2. obvious if its not the same then the flac conversion software is flawed.

you may wish to try different flac conversion looking for two different solutions
1. the one app that converts CD-to-FLAC that works - this is for your future RIPs
2. same or different app that converts your currently-not-so-good-FLACs back to say
GOOD-wav format. batch it to convert it all back. this assumes the wav result is good.
3. then if you really want to keep everything in flac format (for their metadata retention)
convert wav to flac

so, you'll have to experiment with apps, I suggest W10's media player, audacity,
and EAC. these are well known, somewhat free apps, and easily found.

BTW what software did the Cd-to-FLAC conversions. if its one of the above
then it's a different problem.
 
Would it not depend upon which software package one uses? I've read that some are better at converting than others.

I started out with the Windows Player (not the 10), then went to a Sony offering, "Media go", as I found it more convenient transferring into the Sony DAP. But, not without some procedure probs at times.

However, I just found out that there's a new replacement on the market now, "The Music Centre For PC" with newer managers for DLing. Some reviews have been fav on it. Anyway, just a suggestion.

Q
 
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my suspicions are (since the res is identical not up or down, it's media independent,
player independent, recording speed independent) then its in the cd-to-flac conversion.
That is my suspicion too.
BTW what software did the Cd-to-FLAC conversions. if its one of the above
then it's a different problem.

Almost all rips from CD were made using EAC (based on this: http://wiki.hydrogenaud.io/index.php?title=EAC_and_FLAC)

So a basic question I have is what format did you burn them to?

As I said, CD audio (wav).
 
FLAC is a flawed codec. Recording engineers would never use it for their original recordings.
 
FLAC is flawed?

tell sony, they converted their entire catalog to flac.

if you have programming and sound quality expertise, and can
produce business plans, engineering docs, goto marketing.
I can assist/advise/drive - Sand Hill road is my favorite street
in Palo Alto.

besides I have several thousand LPs I will be converting to FLAC 24/96
for storing on a DAP.

can you guys specify why FLAC (don't point me to a URL) isn't good
and what a better system would be - some wild PCM, or DSD512?

I smell billion dollar IPO. maybe my last chance to be a billionaire...
 
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