Does your graphic EQ attenuate volume?

Sam08861

Super Member
I've been using a Kenwood GE-7030 equalizer and it seems to be working great. There's just one thing that' bothering me. It drops the volume about 8db, and so the sliders have to be set +8db to match the volume, if the EQ was not in the audio path.

See my thread here in the Kenwood section to see if I could find something wrong with the unit.. http://audiokarma.org/forums/index....rt-dropping-volume-all-functions-work.844806/

Can anyone with a solid state EQ from that era (80s-90s) tell me if your EQ attenuates the volume? (i.e. disconnect or bypass the EQ to see if the volume is louder with it out of the chain)

What's bothering me is I don't know if it's supposed to be like that, or it's part of my audio tinkering OCD, lol.

Any help appreciated.
 
A good EQ set flat should have no disernable difference between EQ in or EQ out.

With the EQ in, it should boost or subtract the db according to where the sliders are either above or below the equator. :D
 
If the EQ is in the "out" position, turning it off will (should) have no effect because when it is in the "out" position, it is not connected in the loop.

If the EQ is in the "in" position when turning it off, then yeah, its going to fade out or go out completely.
 
An EQ is usually zero gain (x1) when all the sliders are in the centre.

Some EQs have separate gain sliders for each channel to re balance the levels after adjustment. Some have rotary level adjustments.

I've just checked your user manual and there does not appear to be an overall gain adjustment. It's rated gain at flat is 0dB (x1). It may be faulty.
 
Thanks restorer-john,

I suspected as much. I've checked all the voltages against the service manual and also tried disabling the muting switch, but haven't been able to isolate the culprit, as apart from the volume, everything seems to be working. Any suggestions where to start looking? Was thinking to make a diy signal tracer and search for where the volume drops.
 
Yup - depending on how you look at it, all EQs have unity gain control, depending on how you set the +/- sliders.

Just set all the controls to where you get the sound you want, then slide ALL of them either up or down the same amount to get the same output with the EQ engaged or bypassed. If you don't have enough room due to some big bumps, you'll just have to live with it or fudge the big excursions that are giving you problems.
 
Thanks sKiZo,

That's just how I'm using it now. Since it's digital and has memory, I created a setting that has all the sliders at +8db. This serves as my 'flat' reference and is just very slightly louder than when the unit is bypassed, allowing a good starting point.

When bypassing the unit using the preamps 'rec out' button that bypasses the 'processor loop', I can a/b the EQ in and out while playing at the touch of a button. This is a compromise from the EQ on/off feature of the EQ, but aside from the very slight volume difference, there are no differences in the sound, detail or tonality that I can discern. (+6db, the next lower setting is slightly lower in volume than if the unit were not in the loop, +8db just happens to be very, very close to the unit bypassed)

Couple of lessons learned here from using this electronic EQ.

1. The 'sliders' adjust in 2db increments, since it's electronic, so old fashioned sliders have much finer control. (however, have the drawback of having to deal with oxidation of the slider contacts)

2. The 'parametric' setting on this EQ isn't exactly that, but allows 3 frequencies at either narrow or wide, and being digital discrete adjustments. Again, a manual setup would offer more control. Per the schematic, 2 sets of chips hold 14 bands of settings with variable resistance, so unless the parametric EQ is a different setup, or uses settings not manually selectable to make a smooth curve, I don't see how it's comparable to a 'real' manual parametric EQ. However, this function is very handy and quick to use.

3. Despite the above, and the 8db drop that effectively makes this a +4/-20db EQ in effect, it's definitely worth it for me still in dealing with a number of room issues that cannot be altered beyond compromising the living space. In my particular case since the amp produces 160 watts and the speakers are rated for 70, it's no problem.

4. The better units introduce no audible noise and this one is no exception, despite the volume drop.

5. A manual EQ would offer a MUCH faster way to make adjustments. This one, I have to first select the band using the knob, then adjust the up and down buttons. On a manual you, could do this A LOT faster.

6. The memory settings are great! Really allows trying different things out and there's enough of them that I've got settings I like for for phono, low volume (simulates a loudness button), etc. This might be the one big advantage versus a manual unit.

7. This unit, does not have discrete left/right controls. I personally like this, not having to balance left right, but for others, the lost level of control might be a negative, depending on their needs/circumstances.

I''ll be keeping this unit as I am really happy with the results. However, if I had to do it again, I'd go for a manual parametric EQ or perhaps a digital one with the room correction feature and output that matches the input levels. Definitely would want a unit with the spectrum analyzer though as I found it quite helpful.

As an aside, I did room correction myself manually injecting discrete sine waves for each of the 14 bands into the amp; Then took readings using an Audessy microphone set at the listening position, fed into the EQ (via preamp) to set each of the 14 bands on the spectrum analyzer and adjusted the 'sliders' until this read flat. Found a great freeware app for generating sine waves for generating and playing each of the discrete bands all at once for iPad that does this, but OMG, what a headache inducing noise! The results of this painful exercise, however turned out great. I suppose one could do one tone at a time for less of a headache, but I liked that the entire spectrum of the analyzer was lit up & I could verify that it was equivalent at all frequencies and perfectly flat. This, of course, is one of my settings in memory.
 
Last edited:
I seem to remember that some EQs have a small buffer amp in circuit to correct natural losses in the EQ circuits. If this is the case there may something wrong with a PSU or something giving a low gain.
 
I would check rail voltages. It may have a low rail that has dropped out of regulation, causing op amps to curtail gain.
 
Thanks Powertech and TomB19,

Unfortunately, I'm not well enough versed in electronics to know how to translate those suggestions into diagnosing the unit, so would greatly appreciate any guidance as to what/how to check these items out.

I do have the full schematics and service manuals however and would be glad to post anything that's helpful.

Not sure if this is helpful either, but I have tested the voltage at all the test points labeled on the board and the schematic, and all check out with the exception of 1 pin that's listed as NC on two pairs of ICs, as detailed at the link in the 1st post.
 
Back
Top Bottom