ELAC Miracord TT -share all about 'em

[Amcrebelfan]

Sorry you're not local -- I'd fix your Duals for ya. Just refurbed a 1229 that had been sitting in a shed for ages. Had to jury rig a speed selector knob because someone snapped the old one off. Works great now. Also recently rebuilt a 1219 where the plastic stepped speed control had been cracked apart. Managed to get it back together with epoxy. It's a great feeling seeing them play records again.

Two years ago, there's no way I could've tackled either of those. That's what experience and perseverance will do. With Duals, so long as nothing plastic breaks on them, it's really just lube and learning the mechanism. And even when the plastic stuff breaks, they can still be jury-rigged to work.

That said, now that I've gotten my 50H hum free , I've been listening to it all day. Mounted a Stanton 681 on it and it has some slammin' bass response! Sweet table. It's going to replace my trusty old 1229 as the idler drive of choice in my system.

I bet that 50h sounds great. I wish I were local too, hate having these sit idol.

 

[illinoisteve]

Orthophonic, perhaps you or someone else with more awareness of a range of Miracord turtables could post a rough list or chart that would put some of the Miracord model numbers vinylengine lists into relationship. About when were various models made, and what models were higher, mid, or lower level in the scheme of Miracords? Hardly any of that information seems to be contained in the vinylengine listings (page linked earlier in this thread). The user manuals I downloaded show no dates, and figuring out what model is more advanced than another or better in build can't be easily drawn from them either.

A little bit of perspective can be given from some print ads for Miracords I found online.

First is a 1969 ad for a Miracord 50H:

Second is a 1971 ad for a Miracord 50HII, around the time of its debut:

I have learned of 50HII ads continuing through at least 1974, but in 1974 the next two models were also getting advertised...the Miracord 625:

...and the Miracord 760:

Naively judging by the numbers the 760 would be better or higher level than the 625, and the 625 would be better than the few year old 50HII model -- but does anyone actually know how these three models, all available in 1974, stacked up against one another???

Sorry that the images are rather small and the finer text can't be read. These are borrowed from postings on ebay. I have no affiliation with the vendors. I would expect if anyone has a copyright on the images it is ELAC, but they appear to only make speakers now.

* * * Lastly, look at that 50H ad again. Do you think they are saying, without naming the other brand, for about $20 more than you would pay for a Dual your could have a Miracord?

 

[pmsummer]

This isn't an uncommon thing with a number of TTs including Duals from my experiences on the bench in the 70s. The main issue was the mating of the cartridge carrier into the tonearm. Metal contacts were easily corroded and oxidized and the mating of the contacts could easily be mis-aligned.

Add to this, many of the upper end TTs used a muting mechanism to short out the cart leads while the tone arm is being positioned and placed on the LP.

Both of these facilities needed to be cleaned and the wiring well-dressed in order to ensure no hum is induced. Lastly, most of these TTs terminated the connections under the plinth and then used regular RCA patch cables. These, if original, will likely have increased capacitance due to the breakdown of the insulation between the coaxial cable. Should be replaced and the RCA contacts cleaned.

So, all the above implies that a good going over of both the mechanical and electrical touchpoints on these nice TTs be done. Once that's done, then re-evaluate reports you get today from folks who have used them.

Frankly, when well lubed and cleaned, both the Dual, Elac, Miracord, and PE TTs are graceful in automatic mode, are reliable as reported here, and remain a joy of excellent German engineering (yes, I've owned Benz and BMWs, too!).

Cheers,

David

Bingo!

(Owner of 10, 40, 45, 50 and the very odd 60... with is a belt/idler hybrid).

 

[illinoisteve]

Perhaps because far fewer Miracords were sold in the US compared to Duals, for example, there doesn't seem to be a great deal of information about them online. The materials on vinylengine are a major resource, but leave a number of questions unanswered. If you seach Ak, using the Google option for "Miracord" you get 9 or 10 pages of listings from archived threads. Sampling those you find posts by some Miracord owners not active in this thread...going back several years.

I did find a few discussion threads from other forums, which I will link below. These show a variety of impressions of the Miracord, from it being among the best turntables ever made, to it being particularly poor. The debating between such extremes is interesting, and revealing:
http://www.antiqueradios.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=84710&view=next
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?eanlg&1020094390&openfrom&1&4#1
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=87129

Here's a blog posting by a fellow reviving a Miracord, with some help from AK:
http://amusementdevice.posterous.com/elac-miracord-50-new-cartridge-new-life

Since this thread links to a large proportion of what seems to be on the the internet about the Miracord (aside from repeated references to ebay listings), it might be worthwhile for participants in the thread to remember it is here.

Thanks to all who have contributed. If more persons with first-hand knowlege of Miracord turntables would add to this thread, it could be improved substantially beyond this point.

 

[Nat]

My very strong impression is that the reason Duals are more common and more highly sought after nowadays than Miracords has a very great deal to do with looks. It seemsto me that Dual and Miracord were both very popular up to the rise of high compliance cartridges, and it was when arm mass started to become an issue that Duals started to dominate.
Dual arms just look less massy -- it probably doesn't matter if they actually are (and the fact that the ULM range, which really does have low mass arms, looks so different from regular Duals might suggest that the regular ones are not particularly unmassy). Duals look sleeker than Miracords, and looks matter a lot. And the lever on/off switch on the Duals looks like it jostles the table less than the push buttons of the Miracord -- even though the vibration is minimal by the time the arm actually touches down, and simple vertical motion may be more easily damped than horizontal, the impression is less confidence inducing.
Audio purchases, like many other decisions are very emotionally driven, and looks and feel, and specs and pseudo technical mumbo jumbo matter, and I think Dual did a better job of paying attention to those things than Miracord did. Both products were good, reliable machines, but Dual created more sizzle.

 

[Sam Cogley]

Can some of you shed more light on the cartridge holders Miracord turntables use? Which models use the same cartridge holder?

This is something I've been wondering about, too.

 

[illinoisteve]

Not long after we were having this discussion, I put a Wanted ad on my local Craigslist to see if anybody in my area had an old Miracord they didn't want. I gave up hope of getting a response after a few weeks, but now I discover an email from a guy in Charleston, South Carolina, who has a 50H (or Miraphon 22H as both names may appear on the manual he also has for it). I couldn't afford the shipping on a heavy turntable right at the moment, let alone what he might want for a price. If anybody on AK is in his neck of the woods, and wants to go look at this Miracord, send me a private message and I'll give you the guy's contact info. I don't know him, could be a spammer, but sounded legit. If you get this TT, though, post some pictures and tell us about it. Also, check the manual to see if it sheds light on some of the yet-unanswered questions posed in this thread.

 

[sssmokin99]

Miracord model 50H Mark II ...ca1976

I have a Miracord 50H MkII from 1976. I also have the dealer literature, stamped with our local high end guy of the era- David Beatty Stereo on Westport Road in Kansas City, MO. There were three models at that point: my 50H MkII, a middle 760, and the 825. The catalog was quite fancy, with tissue separating the photographs of the staged turntables and their detailed descriptions! I dont know what the cost of this unit was.

As to motor type, the 50H/MkII used a "Hysteresis-synchronous" motor, while the other two models used a "4-pole asynchronous motor". The lit makes claims of extreme stability of the former during variations in voltage, calling it "broadcast-quality". :thmbsp:

I am using the turntable with an Ortofon 2M Bronze. The sound is simply stunning: the tracking force is set very carefully using a digital gauge. I have also used it with an Empire 2000/T {NOT the 2000/E} before buying the 2M. It worked well with that cart also. I have an extra headshell, so switching back is easy. Otherwise, the 2M is in there to stay. Even though this model has the strobe for fine tuning the speed, I almost never have to adjust it. That is impressive to me for a turntable that is now 35 years old! The idler wheel looks like new.

Does anyone know if there were any hinges that were available for the plastic cover? The beautiful walnut base has several small holes near the rear, on the horizontal deck that look as though they are there for that purpose, but I have never seen such hinges, and the catalog makes no mention of them It would certainly be convenient to hinge that cover!

*I have previously written about what I know of David Beatty and his shop in the Kansas City Mo and Ks areas. Search for it on this site if you are interested! Also on the site catering to Altec enthusiasts. Some interesting tales...*

 

[sssmokin99]

BTW, regarding cartridge holders, the 50H MkII and the 760 within the '76 line will use the same part. The 825 and earlier 820 use a different one. That is the only info I have about Miracord cart holders.

 

[Brian]

We sold the line and the company offered a number of different bases. None had hinges, even as an option. At least for the cover offered in the US. In other locales, there may have been a hinged cover. The covers were pretty large and somewhat flimsey. I suspect that if they were hinged, they soon break.

 

[Fasterdamnit]

Can some of you shed more light on the cartridge holders Miracord turntables use? Which models use the same cartridge holder? How hard is it to find spare Miracord cartridge holders? Do they need regular anti-corrosion maintenance like Dual cartridge holders sometimes need? If more Duals than Miracords (in any of their brandings) were sold in the USA, are dependable sources for Miracord parts (like cartridge holders) correspondingly fewer?

Also, someone mentioned something about cartridge overhang/alignment being easier on the 50 models than lower number Miracords. Could someone explain that feature more fully?

Love my 770H.

To answer your question-

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=365022

 

[sssmokin99]

We sold the line and the company offered a number of different bases. None had hinges, even as an option. At least for the cover offered in the US. In other locales, there may have been a hinged cover. The covers were pretty large and somewhat flimsey. I suspect that if they were hinged, they soon break.

Thanks, Brian. I agree; that cover is heavy and would be an accident waiting to happen if hinged. maybe the predrilled holes are for something entirely different. I have one base that has them, and another that doesn't. Both have been in the family since new, and I am certain that none of us drilled them. A mystery...... :scratch2:

 

[Fasterdamnit]

My 770H after a day at the spa-

I also have a 50 that gave up parts for the refurb of the 770H. It was in a nice wood case with hinged wood and smoked plexi cover. That case is now the base for BigBill's RCM.

 

[KentTeffeteller]

Looks has nothing to do with it, marketing did. And how the importer treated their dealers on discounting and spiffs for salespeople. Miracord was the equal of Dual when new on performance and beat Dual on build quality then. The manual customer at the typical dealer would likely go for something like an Empire or a Thorens in the USA then. P.S., I need a changer when severely gimpy, PM me if someone knows of a reasonably priced one they know of. Remember, Dual ULM came at the tail end of the changer line and most ULM Duals were single play only and after changers fell out of fashion.

 

[illinoisteve]

My 770H after a day at the spa-

I also have a 50 that gave up parts for the refurb of the 770H. It was in a nice wood case with hinged wood and smoked plexi cover. That case is now the base for BigBill's RCM.

That's a pretty machine!

 

[Angler]

My 770H

I just recently got this Benjamin Miracord 770H that looks pretty much like Fasterdamnit's Elac. Of course the wood isn't as nice yet but it's in really nice shape and just needs to be sanded and finished. I also have to fix the strobe light. I think it's just blown but I haven't taken it out of the case since I put it in to check it. I would like to get another cartridge for it also even though this one, a Shure M44-7, sounds pretty good. I like the way Fasterdamnit changed the headshell and got rid of the adjustable one. I'm hesitant to do the work on this table because I don't want to stop playing it. I am going to have to refinish the table though, soon, not because it's in bad shape but it's just dry and I want to get some type of oil finish on it.
Although this is a Benjamin Miracord, according to the nameplate on the front, the Operating Insructions Manual has the serial number sticker on it and says Elac Miracord Model PW 770 h Serial No. 11452. It also says: US. Distributor BENJAMIN Electronic Sound Corp. Farmingdale, N.Y. Better yet, I will post some pictures of the booklet simply because it's interesting, at least to me, and it also has a template for making your own base for this unit. I get to those shortly.
Thanks for all the info folks.
Al

 

[Angler]

Booklet/Template

Here are some pics of the Operating Instructions and the mounting board template. I found the template to be interesting. I've never heard of a turntable that came with a template to make the base. Of course, I'm rather ignorant when it comes to turntables to begin with so no surprise there.
Al

 

[sempai]

Here are some pics of the Operating Instructions and the mounting board template. I found the template to be interesting. I've never heard of a turntable that came with a template to make the base. Of course, I'm rather ignorant when it comes to turntables to begin with so no surprise there.
Al

That brochure is great! especially the template.
if you have a scanner it would be nice if you could scan and post it.

i have a 50H II and have been thinking for some time about building a large heavy plinth for it.

The tonearms, despite their clunky looks are not actually massive, and others with more knowledge then I class them as medium compliance.

I have a M97xe on the 50h and it sounds terrific.

Idler drives, with heavy platters are notable for providing full, rich sound.

After finding the 50H II my beloved Thorens td166 (modified) was side lined and is not likely to get any use anytime soon.

Dual turntables, to my ears, are not as nice as the ELAC/Miracords.
This is a very broad statement and I am sure that there are many Dual enthusiasts who would disagree.

 

[pac-rat]

Hum

I like the 50H. Very solid machines, a lot like the Dual 1219/1229, but a touch heavier duty it seems. Nice motors! The one downside that I've notice with it is hum. It's not a grounding thing because messing with the grounding seems to make no difference. It seems to be a shielding thing. Anyone have any experience like that with theirs?

A dear friend gave me one about 35 years ago. It is underappreciated because the arm looks so massive. It tracks superbly. The headshell contacts need to be cleaned on the arm and the headshell. A tiny bit of BRASSO on a Q-tip works well. Then GENTLY bend the contacts on the headshell, out. This will give you a positive contact and eliminate the hum. The only other hum I've had was when I miss-wired an ADC cartridge. Good luck.

 

[jimtone]

I had a Dual 1009F that I bought new probably in the late 60's and also bought a new Realistic branded Elac Lab 60 about 10 years later. As far as performance, I found them to be just about equal. The changing mechanism on both worked very well except for the occasional overly thick or thin album that would cause either to either drop 2 records or not drop at all. The motor on the Dual finally burned up but the Elac is still running. Except for periodic lubrication, it has needed no maintenance. The only thing I liked better on the Dual was the cuing. The Dual was viscous dampened and the Elac is not. The Elac has a built in strobe for speed adjustment.

I'd like to see the TT with the plater removed, or a description of what is under it? I'm looking at one now that has no mechanism under the plater other than the idler wheel and a nylon cam next to it and below is a bushing and a brass pinrod and another bushing below right of it? I'm thinking there should be anodized mechanism attached to the 2 bushings for changing speeds, or possibly this mechanism is under the TT veiwed from underside of plinth??