ELAC Miracord TT -share all about 'em

[monkboughtlunch]

I used a Neiko digital caliper to measure three different 1960s Elac pulleys.

My objective with this post is to document how much of the pulley needs to be shaved for those interested in making their Elac 10H, 18H, 22H, 40H and 50H turntables rotate at more accurate speeds. These pulleys are a press on fit and can be pulled off the motor shaft after heating them briefly with a hair dryer.

As a next step, I'm going to take my unshaved 60Hz pulley and have it professionally shaved by a machine shop on a lathe using the diameters from my experiment. The shaving experiment I performed was done crudely with sandpaper only to get approximate dimensions for a professional lathe turning.

I didn't attempt to shave a 50Hz European pulley (as I live in the USA), but I'm including the dimensions of the unshaved 50Hz pulley here in case helpful to European AK members.

(Disclaimer: I'm not sure how accurate a Neiko digital caliper is.)

The pulleys measured:

• Elac 60Hz pulley (USA) -- unshaved
• Elac 60Hz pulley (USA) -- shaved for corrected speed
• Elac 50Hz pulley (Europe) -- unshaved

60Hz pulley: Original size running too fast (this pulley is for countries using 60Hz like the USA)

• 16 speed: 2.24 mm
• 33 speed: 4.51 mm
• 45 speed 6.09 mm
• 78 speed: 10.54 mm

60Hz pulley: Corrected speed (shaved) size for “H” Papst motor units

• 16 speed: 2.23 mm
• 33 speed: 4.47 mm
• 45 speed 6.05 mm
• 78 speed: 10.53 mm

50Hz pulley: Original size (this pulley is for European countries using 50Hz)

• 16 speed: 2.72 mm
• 33 speed: 5.42 mm
• 45 speed 7.30 mm
• 78 speed: 12.60 mm

 

[dksp]

Thanks.

But I still can't believe that Elac delivered their turntables like this, running too fast.
Something must have changed or aged over the years.

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Thanks.

But I still can't believe that Elac delivered their turntables like this, running too fast.
Something must have changed or aged over the years.

The mains frequency today is still the same in the USA (60Hz) and Europe (50Hz) as it was in the 1960s.

A Papst hysteresis motor (which locks to the mains frequency) will rotate at exactly the same speed today as it did in the 1960s.

All evidence suggests the pulley diameters that Elac used in the 1960s were not accurately sized.

 

[monkboughtlunch]

I took some photos of a Papst motor parted out from a 1960s Elac to aid in identifying a suitable motor grommet to quiet rumble.

The diameter of the two poles that hang the motor are 4mm at the widest part and 3.4 mm at the narrowest groove part. See below.

Anyone know of a suitable grommet replacement? Perhaps other turnable changer manufacturers (e.g. Garrard and BSR etc) of the day used a similar size grommet that might still be available in fresh new stock through Gary Stork at Voice of Music. Thoughts?

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Has anyone tried this motor mount from Voice of Music for an Elac Miracord?

http://www.thevoiceofmusic.com/catalog/part_detail.asp?PNumberBase=vm2773

The published 0.160" inner diameter translates to 4.064mm which would appear roughly consistent with the 4mm size of the Papst motor stud in an Elac.

VM 2773

Motor mount grommet for V-M and RCA record changers and turntables with General Industries (GI) motors.

Specifications:
ID (inches): 0.160
Height (inches): 0.340

 

[likebike23]

^^^^Why not pay the $6 with shipping to find out? Get a stylus or two while you are at it.

 

[monkboughtlunch]

My Miraphon 22H also runs too fast at 33.8 rpm on 50Hz (here in France). Other users in Germany also have their Elacs running too fast.

Hi dksp,

Have any of the Elac owners on the French and German language forums identified a suitable new replacement motor mount grommet brand/model # for Miracord?

 

[monkboughtlunch]

^^^^Why not pay the $6 with shipping to find out? Get a stylus or two while you are at it.

The cutout groove looks like it may be too short. No dimensions for that metric are listed.

As best as I can measure, it looks like the approximate dimensions of the Elac motor grommet are:

• Diameter at largest point 10.5mm
• Height of cutout groove 4mm (indentation that mates with the metal turnable)
• Height is roughly 6mm above the metal plinth
• Inner bore diameter 4mm

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Here are the approximate dimensions of an Elac motor mount. Anyone know of something comparable?

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Has anyone identified a replacement motor mount part for Elac Miracord turntables? If you listen to the lead in or between song silence, you will likely hear motor noise / rumble. I certainly hear it on both of my 10H units.

 

[JosephL]

I worked on a Miracord 10A for a friend. I was impressed by the build quality with a modern and retro look. I have also done an AR-XA, covered here on AK, and three early 1970s Thorens.
So now I'm interested in a Miracord for myself. I have a Shure M95 looking for a home. Of the various Miracords, which tonearms will and will not work with the Shure M95? Any and all advice appreciated.
Thanks,
Joseph

 

[monkboughtlunch]

I worked on a Miracord 10A for a friend. I was impressed by the build quality with a modern and retro look. I have also done an AR-XA, covered here on AK, and three early 1970s Thorens.
So now I'm interested in a Miracord for myself. I have a Shure M95 looking for a home. Of the various Miracords, which tonearms will and will not work with the Shure M95? Any and all advice appreciated.
Thanks,
Joseph

I'm running a Shure M447 on mine. M35X will probably be better.

 

[malden]

If you're going to use a M95 cartridge on a Miracord, I would suggest a N95EJ stylus. NOS Shure N95EJ's are available online.

If you can't find one for the M95 cartridge, then consider a M75 series cartridge with a NOS Shure N75EJ stylus which are also available online. JICO also makes an excellent N75EJ...(for some reason, they don't offer a N95EJ)

https://www.jico-stylus.com/product_info.php?cPath=18&products_id=1458

The "EJ" series styli are medium compliance and will work well on any Miracord tone-arm.

 

[JosephL]

Would a JICO 95HE work with any of the Miracord tonearms?
My daughter's AR-XA has a Shure V15 type iii with a JICO hyper elliptical. We've been very happy with that tonearm/cartridge/stylus combination.
Thanks,
Joseph

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Would a JICO 95HE work with any of the Miracord tonearms?
My daughter's AR-XA has a Shure V15 type iii with a JICO hyper elliptical. We've been very happy with that tonearm/cartridge/stylus combination.
Thanks,
Joseph

Did you mean a "10H" or "10"? I've never seen a 10A. Do you have a photo of the turntable?

I'm not familiar with the Shure M95. If the recommended tracking force is less than 2 grams, you may want to consider a less compliant cartridge to match the mass of the Elac Miracord tonearm. I've heard the Shure M35X would be very synergistic and deliver very high quality sound.

 

[malden]

Would a JICO 95HE work with any of the Miracord tonearms?
My daughter's AR-XA has a Shure V15 type iii with a JICO hyper elliptical. We've been very happy with that tonearm/cartridge/stylus combination.
Thanks,
Joseph

For the Miracord 10 or 10H, I would say no, the tonearm is just too heavy for any Shure "HE" stylus. The 40, 40A, 40H, 50H etc, are lighter than the 10 or 10H but they are still considered medium mass. Miracord tone-arms are shorter than the standard 9", they have a 8" effective length which means the stylus has to work a little harder to pull the tonearm. Then there is the automatic return that the stylus has to deal with.

For my Miracord 10, I use a Shure SC35C cartridge which tracks at about 4.5 grams. For the 40, etc., any medium compliance stylus that tracks between 2 and 4 grams would work well.

I have an AR XA and XB and they both can handle a high compliance stylus such as the "HE" series with no problem

 

[JosephL]

Monk, back when the Shure V15 type iii was TOTL, the M95 was number 2. Tracking 0.75 to 1.5 gms.
Joseph

 

[monkboughtlunch]

Monk, back when the Shure V15 type iii was TOTL, the M95 was number 2. Tracking 0.75 to 1.5 gms.
Joseph

I agree with Malden that the M95 wouldn't be an optimum compliance match for a 10H tonearm. My 10H seems very happy with a Shure M447 tracking around 2.5 grams. In fact, the combo tracks like a bloodhound. The M447 is fun but is definitely not an "audiophile" cart. It's a bit boomy and "sizzly".

I bet a Shure M35X tracking around 2.5 grams in the 10H would sound phenomenal. I tried a Shure M35X in a Rek O Kut arm and was blown away. The M35X has the sonic upside of a SC35C but can track sub 3 grams for longer record life.

 

[malden]

My Miracord 10 sounds a bit stiff, I think it's due to the tonearm bearings. I really need to overhaul it to get everything working smoothly again. It's a beauty, that's for sure...

 

[monkboughtlunch]

That's a beautifully preserved example Malden.