Epay's feedback system and NPB's?

bookasan

Appassionato circa audio
Ok, I know many here are tired of hearing complaints about Epay, but I need to vent.
I recently had a guy that was a complete clown. He was up to no good and got booted shortly after a transaction with me. Before they gave him the ax, he was able to sneak in a negative feedback. Ok, he did pay for the item so fair enough, even though he was a crook. I figure it is my annual "loser" and just accept that about once a year I am going to get a negative from someone like this.

Now, here's the problem I have. I had another guy win a pair of JBL tweeters for around 30 bucks. 2 weeks and several emails later, no reply & no payment. I file a NPB with Ebay, which starts as a reminder to the buyer to pay up. He responds to the Ebay notce the same day it was filed saying he would pay that day. a few days later and still no response to my emails or no payment, I offered the second chance offer to the next bidder and he took it. I leave a negative feedback and he just gave me a negative in retaliation.
What I don't understand is, why does Epay allow someone who doesn't pay for an item to leave feedback, when in reality, they are not the buyer?
Oh one more thing about this guy. He is also a seller. After over a dozen unanswered emails, I tried a little test. I had my wife send him a question about a pair of speakers he had for sale. He responded the same day.
 
The feedback 'mechanism' is faulty. Since he was not 'the buyer', neither he nor you should be able to 'feedback'. His delinquency should be revealed under another heading, his recourse only to eBay administration.

EBay makes it too easy for scumbags to operate. How can they do better?

Bob
 
I have long had a problem with how eBay's system works. I have bought and sold there for years. Long enough to create an "About Me" page on there were I explain in detail my feeling about feedback. So far, I have 100% positive feedback in around 250 transactions but I keep expecting to run across one of those "jerks" that everyone talks about. I hate the sellers who claim that they won't know that you have the item unless you leave them feedback first. If I am the seller, I leave feedback upon receipt of payment and if I am the buyer I leave it upon receipt of the goods AND provided that the seller has already left me feedback for what I did in the deal. I think it is an ethics question. If you are the buyer your obligation is to pay within the specified time frame and if you are the seller your obligation is to provide the advertised product as it was advertised and ship as soon as payment is received. This is my first post on here and it had to be one that I am very passionate about...LOL Look up my feedback. My username is Marknewbie325 on eBay.
 
The "leaving feedback as soon as buyer pays" issue has been disscused many times here before as well as on the Ebay forums. I know people here have mixed feelings about it but, my opinion is the sale is not over once the buyer has paid. It is over once he has paid, received the item, and doesn't try something stupid like swap parts out and ask for a refund. That is why I wait. Feedback isn't the best weapon to fight against crooks, but at least it warns others. If I were to leave feedback as soon as someone pays, he then tries to scam me and use feedback as a threat, I would be SOL and would have nothing to fight back with. I wish it was as easy as pay, receive, all is good.
Out of over 250 transactions I have 3 negatives. Two are from non payers who retaliate after they get negatives, and the other is from some guy who in 1 months time bought 8 items, tried to demand a refund for 5 of them and claimed he didn't even receive another. 2 of the buyers were booted days after they left me negs and I have a feeling the last one will be out the door soon too.
 
bookasan said:
The "leaving feedback as soon as buyer pays" issue has been disscused many times here before as well as on the Ebay forums. I know people here have mixed feelings about it but, my opinion is the sale is not over once the buyer has paid. It is over once he has paid, received the item, and doesn't try something stupid like swap parts out and ask for a refund. That is why I wait. Feedback isn't the best weapon to fight against crooks, but at least it warns others. If I were to leave feedback as soon as someone pays, he then tries to scam me and use feedback as a threat, I would be SOL and would have nothing to fight back with. I wish it was as easy as pay, receive, all is good.
Out of over 250 transactions I have 3 negatives. Two are from non payers who retaliate after they get negatives, and the other is from some guy who in 1 months time bought 8 items, tried to demand a refund for 5 of them and claimed he didn't even receive another. 2 of the buyers were booted days after they left me negs and I have a feeling the last one will be out the door soon too.

Finally another educated eBayer. . . :banana:
 
Some one above said " How could ebay do it better" ?
Here is a good start;
The minute they boot a scumbag off ebay, they should erase all feedback the scumbag has left for any one. If they ever allow the idiot back, all feed back left for him should follow him 4 EVER.
Apparently Ebay realizes they have allowed a scumbag in and they handle the problem but not before he/she has the chance to trash otherwise excellent sellers.
"When I flush the toilet, I expect all the crap to go away" Ebay should follow suit.
Gary
 
Now we come to ETHICS

bookasan said:
The "leaving feedback as soon as buyer pays" issue has been disscused many times here before as well as on the Ebay forums. I know people here have mixed feelings about it but, my opinion is the sale is not over once the buyer has paid. It is over once he has paid, received the item, and doesn't try something stupid like swap parts out and ask for a refund. That is why I wait.
You have just made my point. It "IS" an ETHICS thing. Breaking it down, the sale is over for the "ethical" buyer once payment has transferred to the seller. The buyer has at that point, lived up to their end of the deal. A buyer of good ethics will leave the appropriate feedback once the item is received. Now that you have been burnt three times by unethical people, your almost (note I said almost) expecting the unethical practise to be the norm. I have no doubt that you are an ethical seller and unfortunately you are being tainted by the actions of a few. It is a shame but it is the world in which we live. I so far, have refused to let these unscrupulous people cause me to deviate from what I consider to be a personal ethics position or stand that I have taken. I was brought up by a father who hammered the words "Don't ever let someone cause you to compromise your ethics". I would be a fool if I expected others in this world to operate as I do but just because they don't doesn't mean that I should act as they do. It is unfortunate and I am sure that one day in the future, one of them will cause me to incur my first negative feedback. I do understand your opinion and am not in any way trying to change your thinking, rather I am trying to explain my own. Thanks for letting me participate in this debate. :)
 
Too good

gamalot said:
Some one above said " How could ebay do it better" ?
Here is a good start;
The minute they boot a scumbag off ebay, they should erase all feedback the scumbag has left for any one. If they ever allow the idiot back, all feed back left for him should follow him 4 EVER.
Apparently Ebay realizes they have allowed a scumbag in and they handle the problem but not before he/she has the chance to trash otherwise excellent sellers.
"When I flush the toilet, I expect all the crap to go away" Ebay should follow suit.
Gary

That is an excellent idea! Why do you think eBay refuses to incorporate such great ideas? Could it result in a potential loss of revenue? I laughed when I read the above post. Thanks and well done! :thmbsp:
 
Marknewbie said:
That is an excellent idea! Why do you think eBay refuses to incorporate such great ideas? Could it result in a potential loss of revenue? I laughed when I read the above post. Thanks and well done! :thmbsp:

All ePay cares about is their $30 stinkin' bucks they collect if someone leaves you a negative and you go to mediation.

I had a nutjob leave me a neg, so I emailed them and said if they'd agree to arbitration, I would not leave them any feedback (they had 100% feedback at the time). They agreed but then never responded to the mediator. So I was out my $30 to ePay. So I left them negative feedback and merely noted they agreed to mediate our differences and then never responded to the mediator.

THEN, they initiated mediation with ePay, paid ePay another $30 over the same $4.00 transaction to get their negative removed. I responded to the ePay mediator, sure, I'd agree to a mutual removal of feedback, no strings.

Guess what? The other bozo never responded back to the ePay mediator even after he initiated and paid for mediation. Then he sent me an email asking why wouldn't I work with the mediator???? I sent him copies of all the emails from the mediator to me stating he was not responding to the ePay mediator and never heard back, of course.

Nothing ever happened and ePay collected $59.90 in mediation fees over a $4.00 deal.

ePay is scum, but they're the only game in town right now. :cry: :dammit:
 
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