Grado Statement Sonata 1 LO vs Grado Statement Reference 1 LO

JFRACE

AK Subscriber
Subscriber
Looking for a little help.

I have a chance to get either one of these cartridges for dealer cost due to being a low output cartridge. I spoke to John over at Grado and as per his recommendation, 56db gain at 47k is the preferred range and I can use a SUT to help make up that gain. Besides the obvious on pricing, how much better is the Reference over the Sonata? Is it going to come down to basically tracking, or is there going to be a very pronounced noticeable difference. To make things even more difficult, I can also get a Statement Master high output for dealer cost.

I have someone making me SUT with a 1:6 ratio and Partridge transformers if I give them the go ahead.

The cartridge is most likely going to be used on my XA table.
 
I have the sme tube on the modded xa. On the stock one I have an extra headshell, but is there that much of a difference?
 
When you get up to that level of cart the the law of diminishing returns certainly starts to apply. Does the one version really sound $500 better than the other? Only your ears (and wallet) can decide. If I was in a position to get either cart for dealer cost I would go for the TOTL model for a bit more. Otherwise the question of "is it better" would always be on my mind, might as well cut to the chase IMO!
 
What sonically are the differences, that's what I'm looking for. Is it worth spending the extra money for it? I know the cantilever is thinner and tracking is better, but how much sound quality will be gained? Price wise, I can get the Sonata 1 for $350.00, the Reference for $900.00 and the Master $600.00. Is it worth spending the $550.00 for the Reference, or would it best be served on other upgrades to say maybe a phono pre amp?
 
You'll need an excellent phono preamp for any of them.
Weight-wise, can your arm support the cartridge? On my HK T65C, the counterweight is way to the rear. I looked at the arm's specs and it can't handle a heavier cartridge.
Any of the cartridges would be excellent but be prepared for the possibility that you may have to upgrade other parts of your system.
My Statement Sonata1 is very sensitive with regard to alignment. VTA was a real issue.
Fortunately I was able to adjust the VTA on my table. Then you need a phono pre with lot's of clean gain.
I love my Sonata1 now, but it was a bit of a money pit.
But that's how it goes when it comes to audio.
Get whatever you can afford and keep it as an investment for the future. Maybe you'll come across a better table and arm in the future.
Sonic differences will of course depend on the rest of your system's abilities to resolve.

I'd love to know what phono pre the guys at Grado use with their LO Statements.
Do they actually use a SUT or just say it's an option?
 
I was told by John over there that a SUT with a good 16-17db minimum on a typical 39/40db MM phono pre would be what to look for. I may call over again and ask what they use, but he said as well the carts should be fine on my XA's. One is stock right now with the original arm, and one is custom with the SME tube and Technics type head shell. The custom one was also upgraded with the suspension, arm bearings, and extra weight for heavier carts. So I should be good to go on that.

On another note, I am contemplating having Kevin at KAB build me one of his phono pre amps, or Terrance over at Paradox Pulse build me one of his. Or I may go with one that's loadable with resistors being switched in and out.

I've already found out they will be OK with the arm, it's just do I spend the extra money on a cartridge that may only give minimal returns, or is it that much better than the Sonata. I'm also in the process of having Andy redo one of my Denon DL-103's with the sapphire or boron cantilever and the micro ridge tip. So I don't know if the Grado will be on the same level or still be much better than the Denon. The Denon however,will need a little help with weight issues if I do decide to use it on the table.

heyraz, I'd love to hear your set up with your Sonata.
 
I have the sme tube on the modded xa. On the stock one I have an extra headshell, but is there that much of a difference?

The difference will be in the ability to align the cart. If the AR headshell is just drilled through at the current mounting location, the armtube will not go far enough back to get a decent overhang. cutting slots into the AR headshell will help with this. You will still need 0.100" stand off from headshell.
 
The Sonata1's that I have are taller than my Sig 8 or Prestige Gold. I had to raise my tonearm nearly to the top and lower the platter to just above the plinth to get the proper VTA while allowing my dustcover to close and my cue lift to work.
VTA and overhang adjustment is a "back and forth" thing till it's right. You know..changing one affects the other. It was a bitch to get it right on my table. In the end, I used a Schiit Valhalla 2 headphone amp and my Sennheiser 580's to finally dial it in.
Like I said....I think the LO Sonata1 is very sensitive to proper setup. You can't just "slap it on". I don't think the HO Sonata is quite as revealing.
From what I've been reading, I'm not sure if any of the wood body Grado's will work properly on the stock XA arm. I think shims are a less than ideal solution for the VTA issues.
 
From what a read and own experience the sonata seems to have more meat on its bones. I had a old reference/reference 5 mv and also a 1.5 MV sonata with a 1 to 5 sut the sonata just sounded more like real music.

I also have the .5 mv sonata with 1 to 16 step up which is very close in sound to 1.5. Never heard the .5 MV reference.

Enjoy the ride
Tom
 
Besides the obvious on pricing, how much better is the Reference over the Sonata?

I've owned the Reference Platinum, and I now own the Statement Master1. I've not owned the Sonata.

The difference between the Platinum and Master is very significant. More detail, more extension, better bass, more air around the instruments. My only regret was that I didn't upgrade to the Reference - said to pull out more high-frequency information; even more detail. If I was on the fence, and could make the stretch, I would get the Reference. I've read by one dealer that the difference between the Platinum and Sonata is not as significant as when you move between the Sonata and Master/Reference.

I was told by JohnG a while back that you really need to load these cartridges at 47k ohms to get the best - otherwise it may not be worth it.

I'd love to know what phono pre the guys at Grado use with their LO Statements.

I'm using the Rogue Audio Triton, with 60db of gain (and 0pf capacitance and 47k ohm load).
 
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