Is it valid to use 'Audio' caps on Power Rails

Trevor White

Classic not Plastic
Hi All,

Just wondering if is possible to get away with using 'Audio' style caps such as Nichicon UFG in an amplifier Power Supply. The cap values in question are 470uF/100V and 2200uF/50V.

Is it completely invalid to use caps like UFG's in a power supply, or is it just a case of pointless, and you are better off with UPW or UHE class caps?

Thanks

PS: Forgive the silly typo in the Post Title. It obviously should read "Is it valid to use 'Audio' caps on Power Rails"
 
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I feel Audio caps like FG for coupling and audio circuits. I put general purpose or ones like PW or HE in power supplies.
 
If it's what I had on hand to repair an amp, I'd use the. Otherwise, I'd use ones more suited for power supply operations.
 
Is it completely invalid to use caps like UFG's in a power supply, or is it just a case of pointless, and you are better off with UPW or UHE class caps

I normally always use Nichicon UPW/UPM then followed by Panasonic FC, FM or FR. l have also used Nichicon UFG's and UKZ's with good results even though they aren't low esr/high ripple specific as you have already alluded to.



("Paower Rails" I can read Australian.. :D)

Don't you mean "Ostralian" Binkman :biggrin:. Just in keeping with the Amercian pronunciation.
 
I normally always use Nichicon UPW/UPM then followed by Panasonic FC, FM or FR. l have also used Nichicon UFG's and UKZ's with good results even though they aren't low esr/high ripple specific as you have already alluded to.


Don't you mean "Ostralian" Binkman :biggrin:. Just in keeping with the Amercian pronunciation.

Excellent mate, thanks.

By the way, have you attempted to access the Mouser Electronics web site today? I'll be damned if I can get a connection, and it's been down all day???
 
No worries :thumbsup:. Yeah l had a quick look at some parts on Mouser earlier this afternoon and again just now and it all seems to be running properly for me.
 
No worries :thumbsup:. Yeah l had a quick look at some parts on Mouser earlier this afternoon and again just now and it all seems to be running properly for me.

Wow, that's strange. I can't get a connection at all???? It just times out. Time to try a different browser or something.

Cheers.

**EDIT** Well none of my browsers can get to mouser.com at all??? I can get to element14 and digi-key etc. Something very odd going on. I wonder if there is a DNS problem, although the errors seem to be that the site is just not reachable???
 
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Well, I have flushed the DNS cache on my machine but when I try and ping au.mouser.com the DNS resolves e3405.g.akamaiedge.net [23.53.138.110]

Could I ask if you could look to see what your system resolves for the au.mouser.com address???

**EDIT** Something very weird going on with name resolution in my area. After flushing my DNS cache the name "au.mouser.com" resolves as e3405.g.akamaiedge.net [23.53.138.110]. The address [23.53.138.110] is unreachable.

However, when using IPAddress.com the address returned for "au.mouser.com" is [23.79.196.16], still associated with the host name e3405.g.akamaiedge.net.

So I 'temporarily' added a Hosts table entry for both e3405.g.akamaiedge.net and au.mouser.com to resolve [23.79.196.16] and viola I can get in to the Mouser web site.

Something cock eyed going on with the DNS lookup here in South Oz.
 
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Mouser seems ok
upload_2018-11-22_19-55-55.png

l have also used Nichicon UFG's and UKZ's with good results even though they aren't low esr/high ripple specific as you have already alluded to.
In the past I would use Nichicon UPW in power supplies however recently I changed out C705,6,7,8 in the CA-1000 regulated supply
(220uf/100v) with Nichicon KZ (220uf/100V). Certainly sounds different. I will change out C709, 710 (UPW, 100uf/63V) also with KZ.
Motive is that I'm trying to copy a Japanese refurbished unit that sounds superior to my 3 refurbished units.

I am somewhat concerned that the KZ's and FG's don't have the same ripple rating, I'm tempted to increase the uf/V to compensate
for this.
 
In the past I would use Nichicon UPW in power supplies however recently I changed out C705,6,7,8 in the CA-1000 regulated supply
(220uf/100v) with Nichicon KZ (220uf/100V). Certainly sounds different. I will change out C709, 710 (UPW, 100uf/63V) also with KZ.
Motive is that I'm trying to copy a Japanese refurbished unit that sounds superior to my 3 refurbished units.

Will be interesting to hear the full outcome here. All l know is that about 3 years ago l replaced all of the caps in two of my own units with KZ and FG (including power supply) and they both sound terrific. Now l cannot say that the "audio" grade caps made any difference over any other cap in these instances but they both sound so good i'm not about to pull the power supply caps out and replace with UPW. I also used Elna Silmic's completely in an Akai and it came out great as well.

One day l would like recap two identical units with different caps and note any differences to put this argument to rest once and for all but l don't really have the time or money just for experiments.

I am somewhat concerned that the KZ's and FG's don't have the same ripple rating, I'm tempted to increase the uf/V to compensate
for this

Yes a small part of me questions this also but in reality they will be completely fine. Remember the standard sort of caps these old girls originally had in the power supplies (grey Elna's, blue Nichicon's + black nippon chemicon's etc) and most have lasted 40-45 years. Those violet Matsushita caps that Yamaha used are horrible things.

I'm certain the Nichicon FG's and KZ's will be at least as good if not better than what was originally fitted, l also like the larger can size.
 
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Did you have UPW's in there before on this unit? What changes did you experience?
I need to be careful not to hijack the thread.
I had UPW's at C705,6,7,8. There was a noticeable improvement when switching to KZ, I was very sceptical before hand.
Inline with the OP, I would not consider it a waste of time/money to try KZ, FG's in the power supply. I like KW's where
larger values are needed.
 
Yes sorry, good point but l thought it relevant information to the OP's original question. Very interesting info, thanks for sharing. I think KZ's are my fav audio cap just a pity they are too big to fit in some positions.

To the OP Trevor White, please let me know if these questions of mine are out of line in your thread.
 
Hi there Guys,

No problem with the questions re the UFG's and UKZ's etc, etc. It is all good learning from my perspective.

I was asking specifically about the Power Caps in relation to my Luxman L430. As it happens I used UHE's in the Power Rail positions but I'm trying to work out why the amp seemed to have gained a lot more bottom end (bass) than it used to have. Sounds great, but it's tonal balance seemed to have changed.

As for changing the thread topic, I was the first culprit with my questions about Mouser.Com. Which by the way, it's damned interesting that mbz gets a completely different resolved IP address than either of the ones I see. Something very odd going on down here.

Cheers,
Trevor
 
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Thanks in regard in the questions.

I was asking specifically about the Power Caps in relation to my Luxman L430. As it happens I used UHE's in the Power Rail positions but I'm trying to work out why the amp seemed to have gained a lot more bottom end (bass) than it used to have. Sounds great, but it's tonal balance seemed to have changed.

Did you do any other part replacements besides the main filter caps? Were the old ones well below spec by any chance? I didn't realise UHE's came in the larger sizes.
 
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