Little Dot LD1+ Circuit Modifications

There are many lousy Phillips screwdrivers in the market that do not fill in the screw head completely and that will make it easier to strip the screw head if you are not careful. thanks

I agree that finding a good fitting phillips screw drive is key. For some reason I notice that the one that works best looks much too large for the screw. You'd think that a small screw needs a small screw driver, but I find that a larger one seems to fit better. If there is any slop in the fit at all, find a different screw driver.

Terry
 
I agree that finding a good fitting phillips screw drive is key. For some reason I notice that the one that works best looks much too large for the screw. You'd think that a small screw needs a small screw driver, but I find that a larger one seems to fit better. If there is any slop in the fit at all, find a different screw driver.

Terry

I've had the same experiance with screwdrivers...seems you do more damage with smaller ones than you ever would with larger ones...and I agree that I haven't really seen many decent screwdrivers recently, or at least none that really make me admire it for anything.

Loving the stuff on the topic, although I really don't want to modify the unit I have, the Vbe cap seems like a small, easy thing that could improve results. If I get a adapter, I would add the op-amp decoupling caps as mentioned (boy, that was a fun topic:D).

Out of curiosity, since you seemed to have an idea about the circuit, what voltage are the tubes plates? Are they in "starved" mode, or something completely different?...doubt it would change anything, but i've always heard starved plate mode is not as good as full-operating voltage on the plate, but I bet not many headphone amps would do that, due to the transformer and power required.
 
I've had the same experiance with screwdrivers...seems you do more damage with smaller ones than you ever would with larger ones...and I agree that I haven't really seen many decent screwdrivers recently, or at least none that really make me admire it for anything.

Loving the stuff on the topic, although I really don't want to modify the unit I have, the Vbe cap seems like a small, easy thing that could improve results. If I get a adapter, I would add the op-amp decoupling caps as mentioned (boy, that was a fun topic:D).

Out of curiosity, since you seemed to have an idea about the circuit, what voltage are the tubes plates? Are they in "starved" mode, or something completely different?...doubt it would change anything, but i've always heard starved plate mode is not as good as full-operating voltage on the plate, but I bet not many headphone amps would do that, due to the transformer and power required.


I don't know much about tube biasing. The plate is at about 80V and seems to be well bypassed. Since it is running as a cathode follower with the grid grounded, the operating point is mostly set by the cathode resistor. I would think that playing with the operating point by changing the cathode resistor would have much more effect than tube rolling, but in my limited view of he universe, the best the circuit could do is nothing at all (no change to the waveform), so I just removed the tube from the circuit.

Terry
 
I don't know much about tube biasing. The plate is at about 80V and seems to be well bypassed. Since it is running as a cathode follower with the grid grounded, the operating point is mostly set by the cathode resistor. I would think that playing with the operating point by changing the cathode resistor would have much more effect than tube rolling, but in my limited view of he universe, the best the circuit could do is nothing at all (no change to the waveform), so I just removed the tube from the circuit.

Terry

Alright, that sounds about right. Another tube headphone amp, the "indeed" or "bravo", a simple one-tube design, runs at around 18volts...so it seems the little dot I+ runs about standard operating voltage for such a small tube. I will agree that in this case, the circuit does nothing but color the sound, i'm okay with that, since I really like the sound (or my ears are shot:D), but it would be interesting to see the same basic amplifier without the tubes, would probably cost less. Maybe thats the premise behind the little dot MK.1?. I kind of wish the 1+ circuit is available, though understand why its not...seems like a cool little design:yes:.
 
From what I am hearing here the Little Dot 1+ maybe with the bypassing the Vbe multiplier is as close to what they called "straight wire with gain" plus a bit of tube color and I am also fine with that. There been a whole discussion on another forum about what is natural and what is colored. Speakers and headphones also add a bit of color making some people to prefer some over others. Of course I do not too much distortion and the sound is burry. I want enough quality to hear the details in ones singing and many of the instruments in a orchestra playing. However some SS equipment just makes me feel cold and not musical even when they have great measurable electrical performance. It may be possible that the Creek amp had too much resolving power that I am hearing the defects somewhere in the reproduction chain that destroy the illusion or not of listening to the music. There may be of course other factors that are in play that we do not know off hand. My Stax headphone has great resolution of the signal that is feeding it but still sound musical. Why are some people are switching to Vinyl playback ? Bottom line I am enjoying the Little Dot 1+ with the headphones far better than using my old Creek amp from day one was not near as musical as compared to my Little Dot. :thmbsp:
 
. My Stax headphone has great resolution of the signal that is feeding it but still sound musical.

Those are very nice headphones, I really hope to get a pair someday, probably far in the future, due to the price some of them drag in...I've heard many great things about them:yes:.

And your assessment of "straight wire with gain" sounds right, and that seems to be a desirable thing, But as you mentioned, coloration plays a role, and its a fine line between what is perfect and too perfect.

To Mr.Lin, you mentioned needing a new screw for your little dot 1+, have you checked the bag that had the audio cable and jumpers in it? mine seems to have about three extra in there...If yours doesn't, I wouldn't mind supplying one, since i'd hate to have to deal with a stripped screw, from experiance, they are no fun:no:.
 
If it is just the top screws giving you trouble, you don't need to remove them to get the board out. I didn't. I just removed the bottom and the nut on the loudness pot, then pushed the wires to the AC connector back a bit and slid the board up and out (after removing the screws on the board posts and the heat sinks of course).

You could aslo add the Vbe multiplier bypass caps on the top of the board. The leads of the transistors you need to connect to are accessable on the top side of the board, although it gets to be some pretty tight soldering in a couple of places.

Terry

Wow, where to begin? I know - thank you so much for all this information Terry. Since you're knowledgeable about electronics (more than I am), you may not realize how enlightening and extremely useful all this information is to me and others participating in this thread. I have no problem getting the bottom screws out, I do it all the time to switch the jumpers or change op-amps. For some reason those top ones on my I+ just seem to have been tightened too much. Anyway, I have a really good soldering iron/station, plus smaller tips, and at this point I've been soldering for years and I'm pretty good at it, so it shouldn't be a huge problem.

I've done enough research and and experimenting with capacitors recently to have a decent idea about what to use and what not to use. Unfortunately, the vast majority of what I'd love to use here - V-Cap, Audio Note, etc - is WAY too big to fit inside the I+. :sigh: I do have some of the .1uf Mallory metal film caps that I've used on the op-amps, those should do the trick adequately. But by bringing this up, you have infected my mind with the idea, and I really want to do it now. :D Such a simple thing, such a good idea.

And your assessment of "straight wire with gain" sounds right, and that seems to be a desirable thing, But as you mentioned, coloration plays a role, and its a fine line between what is perfect and too perfect.

There's what I call "boring neutral." One would naturally think, neutral is neutral, either the sound is colored or it's true to the source. I think it's more complicated than that. We can't have a perfectly transparent headphone amp. In trying to getting as close to that ideal as possible, we could inadvertently sacrifice some of what gives the music life, and end up with a cold, analytical sound that theoretically is neutral, but perhaps missing small yet critical things that allow us to really enjoy the music. There's a lot more than tubes in this amp that will definitely color the sound; can you say, electrolytic capacitors? :scratch2: That said, I still take Terry's point about removing the tubes to reduce coloration as a true one. I wonder though, given what's left thereafter, what cannot be removed, maybe the tubes are playing a beneficial role because of those circumstances (like the inevitable capacitors, the transistors, resistors, the shunts, and so on).


To Mr.Lin, you mentioned needing a new screw for your little dot 1+, have you checked the bag that had the audio cable and jumpers in it? mine seems to have about three extra in there...If yours doesn't, I wouldn't mind supplying one, since i'd hate to have to deal with a stripped screw, from experiance, they are no fun:no:.

I didn't see one, but then again, it was only with the help of an Aker that I realized where the extra shunts were. :tears: I should be ok, but thank you for that offer, I do appreciate it.
 
Those are very nice headphones, I really hope to get a pair someday, probably far in the future, due to the price some of them drag in...I've heard many great things about them:yes:.

Many people are happy with the Stax but it is not a headphone that you can go drumming with. The Stax's are on my main rig with the Melos but it does not go through the tube circuit and the source is my Pioneer PD-65 which is one of the heaviest copper shielded production CD player ever made. You play the CD upside down. The Pioneer engineers carefully created a colorization circuit called the Legato Link Conversion which works very well with the Stax's The Pioneer PD-65 was one of the longest running model that Pioneer ever made too bad it is not made any more. :tears:
 
The LD1+ is still far from "wire with gain" even without removing the tube from the circuit. Like Mr. Lin said earlier, the quest for a truly transparent amp is expensive (and illusive). But that is my goal for audio equipment. I want the equipment to contribute nothing to the sound. I want only what was recorded. But I want everything that was recorded. Nothing missing either. That is the meaning of "Hi-Fidelity" to me. I know not everyone feels that way, and many prefer some character in their sound equipment. And like it or not, I know I'm going to get some character. Really transparent gear is not in my budget.
The LD1+ is a pretty good circuit. It is not the circuit I would design if I started with a clean sheet of paper and no budget constraints, but it is pretty close. The output stage is a class A-B push-pull bipolar. I think I would go with a class A output buffer biased from a constant current souce. And probably go with FETs instead of bipolar. But it would probably not sound much (if any) better than the LD1+.
Maybe someone with more tube knowledge could give us some tips on the tube stage. When I first looked at the circuitry in the LD1+, I thought the tube stage probably provided the voltage gain and the solid stage buffer stage would have only current gain. I would think that if the tube stage was providing the voltage gain, that you would get more of the "tube sound". But I'm only guessing here.

Terry
 
Hi TerryS,
I just became a member of these forums upon seeing this thread. I was wondering what you think of the Little dot mk2 design, whether one can bypass any of the tubes there
 
Hi TerryS,
I just became a member of these forums upon seeing this thread. I was wondering what you think of the Little dot mk2 design, whether one can bypass any of the tubes there

Isn't that one all-tube though? Meaning, not a hybrid like the I+.
 
Isn't that one all-tube though? Meaning, not a hybrid like the I+.

yah its all tube. but since I'm not really sure what goes on with electronics I figured it was worth a shot and maybe some diy guru here can help make the ld mk2 an even better amp than it is for the price. :music:
 
Hi TerryS,
I just became a member of these forums upon seeing this thread. I was wondering what you think of the Little dot mk2 design, whether one can bypass any of the tubes there

Sorry, I don't know anything about the mk2. I don't own one, and Little Dot does not make schematics available. I had to trace out the schematic for the 1+ myself. Very time consuming.....

Terry
 
Is there any way you can provide some step by step instructions on what to buy and were to solder for the Vbe mod? I wasn't born with surgeon like hand coordination and I've never modded anything except my arcade gaming joystick.
 
Look at the pictures at the end of message #1 the caps are the red ones you see in the pictues and read message #20 as provided by Terry. You need some soldering skills a bit for this Little Dot 1+ vbe mod. For myself I am going to hold off from making any circuit changes at this point.
 
Look at the pictures at the end of message #1 the caps are the red ones you see in the pictues and read message #20 as provided by Terry. You need some soldering skills a bit for this Little Dot 1+ vbe mod. For myself I am going to hold off from making any circuit changes at this point.

Thanks, John.
That's about what I was going to say. If you've taken the bottom cover off to swap op-amps, then you have a good start. Take the other screws off the two end plates. I also removed the nut for the volume pot. The knob pulls straight off (mine was pretty snug). Then I used a small crescent wrench to remove the nut. There are some screws that hold the PCB in the housing (four if I remember right) and then there are four screws that hold the heat sinks to the top of the housing. Look at the pictures and you should see what needs to come apart.
Once you get your amp apart, then it should be pretty easy to identify the points to connect the bypass caps to from the picture. I bent a little hook at the end of the leads on the caps , tinned the hooks, flowed a little new solder on the transistor lead coming through the board and just flowed it together. It seemed really easy to me, but then I've done a lot of soldering. As I mentioned, I also slid a short length of heat shrink over the leads so they could not touch anything they weren't supposed to. You could just use insulation stripped of some small wire.
As far as the caps, I would use anything between 0.1uF and 1.0uF. The voltage is really low, (about 2 volts), so any voltage rating you find is going to work fine. I used a mylar cap (metalized polyester film). Something like the Digi-Key EF1104-ND. Capacitor choice in audio is a heated topic, and this is certainly an application that calls for a high quality cap. The only limitation on the choice is going to be the size. It has to be small enough that you can fit it in the space between the PCB and the housing. I think polyester film is a good choice for this application. The only type I would definitely avoid is ceramic. The capacitance of a ceramic cap varies with the voltage across it. Not a good thing for audio.
When you put it together, take time to make sure the heat sinks get positioned back properly. It is a tight fit. Make sure the holes line up before trying to screw in any of the screws. If they don't line up properly, find out why before you mess up a screw. Make sure the LED gets back through the hole on the fromt panel.
Good luck with the mod. I think you will hear an appreciable improvement.

Terry
 
Thanks, John.
That's about what I was going to say. If you've taken the bottom cover off to swap op-amps, then you have a good start. Take the other screws off the two end plates. I also removed the nut for the volume pot. The knob pulls straight off (mine was pretty snug). Then I used a small crescent wrench to remove the nut. There are some screws that hold the PCB in the housing (four if I remember right) and then there are four screws that hold the heat sinks to the top of the housing. Look at the pictures and you should see what needs to come apart.
Once you get your amp apart, then it should be pretty easy to identify the points to connect the bypass caps to from the picture. I bent a little hook at the end of the leads on the caps , tinned the hooks, flowed a little new solder on the transistor lead coming through the board and just flowed it together. It seemed really easy to me, but then I've done a lot of soldering. As I mentioned, I also slid a short length of heat shrink over the leads so they could not touch anything they weren't supposed to. You could just use insulation stripped of some small wire.
As far as the caps, I would use anything between 0.1uF and 1.0uF. The voltage is really low, (about 2 volts), so any voltage rating you find is going to work fine. I used a mylar cap (metalized polyester film). Something like the Digi-Key EF1104-ND. Capacitor choice in audio is a heated topic, and this is certainly an application that calls for a high quality cap. The only limitation on the choice is going to be the size. It has to be small enough that you can fit it in the space between the PCB and the housing. I think polyester film is a good choice for this application. The only type I would definitely avoid is ceramic. The capacitance of a ceramic cap varies with the voltage across it. Not a good thing for audio.
When you put it together, take time to make sure the heat sinks get positioned back properly. It is a tight fit. Make sure the holes line up before trying to screw in any of the screws. If they don't line up properly, find out why before you mess up a screw. Make sure the LED gets back through the hole on the fromt panel.
Good luck with the mod. I think you will hear an appreciable improvement.

Terry

I'm going to give this a shot in a week or so. It sounds kind of tough for the beginner like me, but we all have to start someplace.
 
Terry,

I have made a copy of everything including your pictures on to my hard drive for future reference. I also have in the past built many electronic projects and have a engineering degree.

Right now I am just finishing finding the right, meaning the most clear sounding 12AX7 tube for my California Audio Lab Sigma ll DAC. Then I will compare the sound using the M-audio Audiophile 2496 audio card SDIF output on my Giastudio PC driving the CAL Sigma ll DAC to the Little Dot and then compare with the M-audio Audiophile 2496 line out that is using the NJR JRC 5532 op-amp driving the Little Dot.

I have already improved my Little Dot 1+ with using the 408A tubes and finally found a good op-amp to replace the stock op-amp in the Little Dot.:D
 
yah its all tube. but since I'm not really sure what goes on with electronics I figured it was worth a shot and maybe some diy guru here can help make the ld mk2 an even better amp than it is for the price. :music:

If it's all tube you're not going to be able to bypass the tubes, there would be nothing left. And that would also defeat the whole purpose of that amp. In the case of the I+ as Terry has noted, the tubes aren't actually necessary, and removing them theoretically removes one more thing that can "color" the signal.

I too am definitely going to do the bypass modification, but leave the tubes be. Adding those bypass caps seems like a no-brainer and I'm surprised it wasn't part of the original circuit design.
 
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