LMAO "special" cables!

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>>>maybe they're just boring to you...because you have nothing in common with them.<<<
Quite right. I come from a different background(Molecular Biology), where things tend to be more fluid.
I'm sure someone somewhere finds them not boring.

>>>This thread did start out with some good discussion...<<<

Actually no, this thread started out like so many other "my zipchord-is-good-enough" cable threads.
Like I said,
to each his own.
Jack
 
I see my work is already done on this subject.

I've enjoyed following this mostly due to the fact that any and all facts for opinions I have on this subject have already been covered well by some of the intellegent members of this forum.

Well done

Lefty
 
"Actually no, this thread started out like so many other "my zipchord-is-good-enough" cable threads".

Somewhere, someone said to me that I wan't reading what was being posted previously. Actually this tread started out with the hype and story telling that cable manufactures can do with respect to product that is way over priced.
 
Originally posted by Morden2004
What about a religious fanatic Engineer?

Paul



You aren't likely to find too many in that category since one occupation requires an analytical mind, the other quite the opposite.
 
Originally posted by WildWest
"Actually no, this thread started out like so many other "my zipchord-is-good-enough" cable threads".

Somewhere, someone said to me that I wan't reading what was being posted previously. Actually this tread started out with the hype and story telling that cable manufactures can do with respect to product that is way over priced.

That was mobile.
OK. Do you buy the hype of other products advertising? If not, why would you bother with the marketing for cables?
More importantly, what cables do you use?
I'm just curious.
Jack
 
Originally posted by Rob
You aren't likely to find too many in that category since one occupation requires an analytical mind, the other quite the opposite.


yet one has driven the other...and, when you look back, it is unable to explain it.

there have been no shortage of scientists that were religious...tho the description of religious was not always the same....and not easily defined.


'course...that's another discussion ;)
 
"That was mobile" :D

Hype of other products? Sure, depends on the product. Some of the advertising I see is good advertising and honest. Call it "hype" if you will but one has to adverstise. I do for my company.

What cables do I use? Geeee ya know to be honest, I can't name brands. I bought some various things from Parts Express, good shielding, proper gauge for the use and more importantly..Realistic price. Some of the other things I have are cables that my brother brought back from the recording studio a few years ago.
 
After living in many countries I have found that the "engineer" mentality is more prevalent here in USA, and some russian engineers..

I have met many engineers from civil, mechanical and aerospace that feel that some of the best solutions from problems involve having a more abstract and artistic mind...maybe its not the outcome, but how was the issue approached...

My dad was one of the best civil engineers around (wrote articles, worked with some of the most complex engineering projects worldwide) but was a soul kind of guy....a musician as well, and soccer fanatic..he was born in Argentina. Some engineering can be done with "inspiration"...

Now, with the cables issue, I dont know, as I havent had any expensive cables,,,but I am of the position that just because it makes sense, it doesnt mean that the difference is audible..but we do know that its easy to hear what we want..
 
Gone,

I was answering the question regarding "Religious Fanatic". How many scientists like you mention were of that ilk? Nowadays Religious Fanatic is increasingly one who has a newfound interest in "Explosives 101" and wants to blow more than half of the human population to smithereens in order that they themselves can get to what they have been brainwashed into believing is heaven.
 
Originally posted by Lefty
I see my work is already done on this subject.

BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH intellegent members of this forum.

Well done

Lefty

Obviously a reference about me ;) :p:
 
Screw most all of yall. This was not about cables but about mentality. There are those to be screwed and those that will screw them. Typically those that will be screwed are done so by advertisers that use engineering terms. Others are screwed by engineers that have turned advertiser and promote their product because of proven facts by other engineers. Since these facts have been proven by engineers you can not even consider that the facts might be wrong.
Or you can't consider that the facts might be correct. It doesn't really matter in such a division in this.
As far as I know there is no meter to measure audio quality. Untill you show me FACTS generated from this meter to show who is wrong and who is right, everyone is wrong( except me ), and everyone is right ( includes me ).
This is like a dog chasing it's tail as far as discussion or debate goes. The thing to realise is that the ICs, Cables, etc of yesterday have been put aside for what is in the most part better.
I do not except anything learned by rote or things expanded off of the rote knowledge as the ultimate truth.
All Yall!
:butt1:
 
I thought this hobby was supposed to be fun? Lighten up guys! Spin some tunes, kick back, and relax. Stop being so damned analytical about everything. SHEESH! :dammit: :beerchug: :lurk: :rockon: :hdphones:
 
How Ironic

I got to spend sometime alone this evening and was able to continue my sampling of the interconnects Sasaki and Ward were kind enough to send me. And while I'll be posting my review shortly, let me say that I was quite surprized by the effect the cables had. I think I've finally found one to replace my Silverline's which have been long overdue for replacement.

MikE
 
Originally posted by Thatch_Ear
Screw most all of yall. This was not about cables but about mentality. There are those to be screwed and those that will screw them. Typically those that will be screwed are done so by advertisers that use engineering terms.........
All Yall!
:butt1:

I just went back and looked at the post that started this thread. By golly Thatch has nailed it! :p:
 
Why is it that cable debates almost always degenerate to this level? :(

Even though I'm sure that a number of fellow AKers are now weary of this thread, I'd like to add a few more comments of my own. As an audio dealer, I am well aware of the amount of pseudo-science and manipulative advertising that is spewed forth by a number of high-end audio cable manufacturers. And as a trained research psychologist, I am continually impressed by just how much our expectations can affect our perception - we often see just what we want to see, hear just what we want to hear, etc.

That being said, I still believe that a number of the "exotic" audio cables to be found nowadays do indeed live up to their promises. So, to all those folks who would like to argue that every claim made by the high-end cable industry is an exaggeration at best, and more often than not an outright lie, let me ask the following questions:

1) Do you really believe that we know everything there is to be known about the behavior of electrons in different conductive environments?

If so, then there are a number of very active researchers in various physics departments that need to be told to halt their research programs immediately, as there is nothing left to be learned in this area.

2) Do you really believe that the perceptual systems of humans and other animals are inherently less sensitive than - and therefore inferior to - today's most sophisticated measuring devices?

It is sometimes claimed that if two audio components measure identically on the test bench, then they must sound identical as well. In other words, if a machine cannot detect a difference, then no biological being should be able to, either. But consider this by way of analogy: Several oncologists have recently documented that certain canines can reliably "sniff out" cancer cells in humans. Nevertheless, scientists are unable to describe what olfactory cues the dogs are detecting. Here is a case in which a biological "measuring device" seems to be far more sensive than any artificial "perceptual system" that we have been able to construct.

3) Do you really believe that if you yourself cannot hear a difference between two audio components, then anybody who claims that they can is simply deluding themselves?

Researchers in the area of psychometrics have documented significant variability among individuals in terms of "just noticeable differences" (or JNDs) along a number of perceptual dimensions, including auditory ones. Much of this variability can be attributed to genetics, age, and damage to receptor cells (which will happen if you attend too many loud rock concerts without hearing protection). But experience also plays a role here - the more expertise you have in a given perceptual domain, the more fine-grained your JNDs will be.

To give an example, I have a friend who is a wine enthusiast, and who regularly attends various wine-tasting events - something that I have never done. And while both he and I like wine, his ability to distinguish among and appreciate various types, brands, and vintages of wine are VASTLY superior to my own. He can detect differences in taste that I cannot - and I don't consider him to be the least bit delusional in this regard! It's simply a matter of experience...

And while we're considering this particular example, let me say one more thing. If my friend decided to spend $150 on a bottle of fine wine, I would be loath to criticize him for doing so. Granted, I would not be able to appreciate the purchase in the same manner as he would - and for this reason I would NEVER spend $150 on a bottle of wine for myself - but I could understand his desire to purchase this bottle of wine.

By the same token, if a seasoned audiophile decides to spend a few hundred dollars on an audio cable that truly sounds better to his or her ears, then why take offense?

Happy listening!
Brian
 
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Brian:

I think that you have concluded this "debate" quite nicely.

It's all in the head. ...... meaning an individual's perception of the differences between audio components is just that - their perception. What we often fail to do is allow others their right to exercise "their" perception.

Period.

Thanks for a great wrap-up!

Paul
 
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