Looking at a Few Tube Amps

Fusion

Fusion

Active Member
Hi everyone...I've been looking at buying what hopefully will be my last amp for a long while and have narrowed it down as follows. It will be a tube integrated. Can't make up my mind so all comments are welcome!

Primaluna Prologue Premium
Icon Audio Stereo 40 mkIII
Cary SLI80 (used)
Line Magnetic 211ia
Icon Audio Stereo 30 SE

The first two are somewhat similar, push pull amps that take many different power tubes (a definite plus as it would be cool to try different types). Autobias on the Primaluna, manual bias on the Icon. With the Icon I prefer the use of 6SN7 and 6SL7 input tubes as I already own these and like them. I don't own any 12AU7 (Primaluna) that I can roll but it's not like it's an expensive tube.

The Cary is similar I suppose, but higher power (80 watts) and runs in Class A (40 watts) when in triode mode. I wonder if it runs the tubes hard by comparison to hit those numbers. Either way, the reviews are very positive and it's been in production a long time so it must be a quality product.

The 211ia, needless to say LM has earned a great rep over the past few years. The sound of my old Audio Space Galaxy 34 was fantastic with my ProAcs and I imagine I could expect about the same here. I have some nice RFT EL34 tubes and I have a bunch of 12AX7 as well. Doesn't look like other power tubes are an option though, which sucks but I do love the EL34 sound so I can live with that. The LM also is likely to ring in at less money than the other amps and seems like a real bargain in comparison.

Finally, the Icon 30 SE is a single ended, class A amp that runs 2 KT150 tubes. This tube seems to get high praise overall and I like the 6SN7 input tube as well. Wouldn't be able to use my EL34 tubes, which is a bummer, but I get single ended class A sound with a useful 18/28 watts of power (triode and ultralinear modes). A better match for my speakers than most other single ended amps.

I am a little bit hesitant about amps like the Icon 40, Cary, and Primaluna, as I've read that amps are optimized to run one kind of power tube, not multiple kinds, and so you are better off running the tube the amp was designed for. Makes me wonder if getting an amp so that one can roll all sorts of different power tubes is looking at it the wrong way. Might be better to just get the amp that'll sound the best with the tubes it was made for.
 
All of em have their pros and cons likely - power - tube types makers etc. All the technobabble doesn't really tell you much. Lots of good buzz about Raven Audio so you may want to check them out. If you are patient - Audio Note is coming out with a new affordable range of PP amplifiers that are also autobias, have remotes, and on board DACs (this may be optional). They sent me the price list of their complete product range when I reviewed the AN E. The new amps start at $2k and will be using C-Core transformers as opposed to EI transformers used by most everyone else - 20-65 watts depending on the tube type. The I zero is awesome but it only has 9 watts and looks boring. I will be interested to see the new ones. I've only seen the sketch so far

But the 211IA is one of the best values around for an EL34 amp - I'd have no problem recommending that amplifier - it's really nice sounding.

But you know my preference always leans to Single Ended in general - so to me that gives the Ikon Audio the edge overall. But I still want to hear what Andy Grove magic he can pull out of these PP amps. The I Zero stunned me - it's just that it looks so plain and has no tubes showing and is 9 watts and the price is high enough where people just look at it and say - nah I need flashy for that price. The 211ia I think you will like better than your Audio Space - but it probably won't be better "enough" to trump an SE amp. The only caveat I have with Icon is where they are made - they look suspiciously like MeiXing amplifiers (formerly Ming-Da) amplifiers which were notorious for using fake parts. I admit I could be totally wrong but I didn't read anything like hand made in England just "designed" based on a quick browse of their site - it may not matter to you but if it does you may want to double check. It may just be both companies use similar meter displays - tough to tell since miexing and mingda use a variety of them. Anyway - made in China isn't a problem to me or to you mostly likely being an Audio Space ex owner but as you know not all Chinese companies are made equal. Prima Luna looks good on this front as well.
 
Wasatch, thanks for the recommendation. Forgot about Manley, I'll take a look.

RGA, thanks for mentioning the new amp from AN. I remember you talking about it on another forum. The AN Cobra I believe they are calling it. I have no use for a DAC but I suppose in the future it might come in handy (assuming it's not an option). Do you have a release timeline? I notice there are a few YouTube videos where the amp is being demoed at shows and I'll watch those all the way through to see if they cover this. If it is not far off I might wait for this amp to become available.

And thanks for the info on Icon as well. Yes, from reading up on this it looks like you are correct. I have no problems buying Chinese made components, or even Chinese made components from a Chinese company (when the company is proven, like Audio Space or LM). But if that company is notorious for using fake parts, uhh, I dunno. That's not what I want to hear, let's just put it that way. There is a Greek company called Lab 12 that has the Suono, also a Class A single ended KT150 design. It looks very nice but what turned me off is the bias method involves opening up the amp. I would rather have a more user friendly way to bias.
 
Last edited:
I hate to be that guy who brings up something that wasn't listed as an option in the original posting, but you haven't mentioned anything from Rogue Audio. They have several options that you should really consider.
 
The Rogue Cronus II is definitely possible, but what has me shying away from Rogue is that I had the Tempest II for a bit in my system and it just sounded way too soft. I attribute that to the passive preamp and I don't think Rogue has this in the Cronus (at least it's not discussed in the manual like it was for the Tempest) so it's likely not an issue.

McAlister I am aware of and it would definitely interest me. Unfortunately, there are enough negative customer service issues (more like horror stories) discussed online that I would not be comfortable.

I think I'll at least wait for the new AN to see how that is received. 25 watts of Class A EL34 sound from AN has me very interested.
 
Fusion - they have ANKits too - while they are no longer associated with Audio Note - the designs and some of the parts (not the transformers) are still AN. And the transformers are built in Canada and also C-Core - 35 watts per channel monoblocks. They will build them for you for 10% charge or something. Might also be worth a consideration - I suspect they'd be higher level than the Cobra - but that's just a guess.
 
FWIW, I like my PrimaLuna. It's the Dialogue Premium power amp. I am running KT-120s in it, and like having all the tube, tap, and circuit options, and the worry-free auto-bias. I am using a magnetic passive preamp with it.
 
Last edited:
I actually might get the chance to listen to the Rogue and Primaluna options. A dealer nearby carries both and will get them in store. No LM dealers nearby unfortunately. The nearest is 5 hours away. :(

The Manley Stingray II looks cool but I'd have to go used (same likely with ARC and CJ, Canary and VTL).

I find myself really intrigued by the AN Cobra though, so I have emailed Audio Note (evidently, it's Peter Q. directly) to ask if they can comment on an expected release date and also if they can tell me which small signal tubes are used. Looks like the two outer tubes are thicker in diameter than the two in the middle based off of the pictures online. I'll understand if they aren't yet ready to discuss details though.
 
+1 for Rogue Audio

I've had the Cronus Magnum in my system powering a pair of Totem Hawks for a couple of years now and couldn't be happier. No issues whatsoever.
 
it's coming Fusion.
prototypes.jpg


http://www.monoandstereo.com/2016/09/audio-note-uk-factory-tour.html

It's a big f-er from the looks of it. The trannies look like monsters compared to the 211 IA or the Audio Space I had. And for only a little bit more money. This should be interesting. I hope they offer it in more than just black. But time will tell. You really can't get away from transformers - it's 90% of the sound especially if bass matters so I really can't wait to hear them when they roll out. They don't seem to be screwing around. I'll see what the price is when I get home. I may have to place an order at least for a review sample.
 
Last edited:
Cool. Yes, anything you can share when you get it is appreciated. I must admit I wasn't crazy about the pictures that we've seen until now, though I understood that they were just sketches. But seeing a pic of the real casework (not sure if it's final or not), I think it looks good...clean and sleek.
 
Well I forgot to look up the price. Whether these stay the price I can't say but it is what is listed

$2,124 for the Cobra
$2,317 for your choice of either a Remote or the USB DAC
$2,510 with both the USB DAC and the Remote.

The colour choice seems to be that you can have it in any colour you desire so long as what you desire is black.
 
Thanks. That's really competitive given the quality of what we are likely to get. Haven't received a reply yet from AN (not surprising I guess) so I may inquire with the local AN dealer if they have any news on a release date.
 
honorable mention for the Raven Audio Nighthawk. ~ 2600.00, no features, all sound. good thread on hoffman forums about it.
 
I see your short list has the Primaluna Prologue Premium on it. I know it's a step down from the Prologue Premium, but I have the Primaluna Prologue Classic and I really like it. Build quality is great too. I would have picked up the Prologue Premium, but I got a smoking good deal on the Classic. I have never seen nor heard the Raven, but It has a great rep as an awesome amp. I may have to pony up for one of those in the future if I ever can get a chance for an audition. All of those amps you listed are pretty nice and I can't see you going wrong with any of them. Keep us posted!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

L
Mystere tube integrated amp
2
Replies
23
Views
5K
johnda
johnda
Tom Bombadil
Dennis Had Inspire SE Amps
2 3
Replies
57
Views
14K
Jefffeith
Jefffeith
Cylontymany
Would like to try a Tube pre Amp for Solid State Amps
2
Replies
33
Views
772
ceylon
ceylon
ejman
Same tube different amp different power output
Replies
9
Views
389
Trio
Trio
F
Tube Amp
Replies
13
Views
9K
dgwojo
dgwojo
Back
Top Bottom