Marantz 18 vs marantz 19 Receiver HELP PLZ!!

It doesn't matter whether the caps are Sprague or Philips, they need replacement now

this is what was replaced in my 18, it made a noticeable improvement especially in the bass. like i said earlier it was a WOW moment when i first got it back. and it sounded great before and i was just wanting to extend its life and not worry about cap failure and wasnt expecting much improvement.


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it was a WOW moment when i first got it back

Me too, and a valuable lesson learned...

The 18 was my first vintage receiver. Mint condition and sounded great on my easy to drive speakers. Then I got a 19. Sounded great also. The lesson came when I bought a higher quality second set of speakers. Now, the 19 sounded a lot better than the 18. Almost sold the 18, even offered it to a friend but he passed on it (lucky me). Shortly after, a gifted tech/friend took a look at the 18, found the caps weak, put in some new ones and Viola, new receiver.

Turned out, the new HQ speaker was not such an easy load. The 19 didn't care as it was in spec. The 18 struggled with it's old caps. Now, the 18 is as good as the 19, maybe better depending on what day of the week it is. :)

That was over 10 years ago and they still run neck and neck and neither has had a hiccup functionally. I'm so glad I didn't sell my 18 back then, especially for the wrong reason.
 
I'm so glad I didn't sell my 18 back then, especially for the wrong reason.
One of the BIGGEST audio mistakes I ever made was when I sold my MINT!!!!!!! 18 with the EXTRA eye tube. This stereo looked like it just came out of the box. Except for the dust it was perfect. I think who ever had it didn't use it very much.
 
The model 18 was the last true Marantz. The 20 was the fleshed out tuner part of the model 18 with some modifications and the 19 and 20B were ''improved'' version. The 19 came with a price increase of 40% with less reliable passive part, Sprague --> Holland capacitors for example. The 16 amplifier, who reprise the chassis of the model 15, is another example. In some way, these products were the last heritage of the time when Saul was there. The 20B/tuner section fo the 19 are great and are recognized has one of the best FM tuner ever made.

The 18 was not desired by Saul Marantz, who would have preferred to make a Solid State tuner and high mono power amplifier before (to replace the Model 10B and the 9). Instead, Superscope want to make a receiver to keep with the growing demand for that market segment. The 18 was rushed with time constraint since Superscope has already decided to move the factory to California and no one in the staff want to leave NY. Marantz quit first in December 1967, Sequerra in February and Smith in march 1968. The Model 18 was commercialized around this time.

So today? It doesn't matter, since after 50 years you must change nearly every electrolytic cap in both. The price ? The 19 is pricier for sure. Quality ? In the same range with new components. After that it is more a question of taste and speaker association than superiority.

Today, if you are enough fortunate (or lucky) to have one, restore it with the best component you can put in it and enjoy it with good speakers. They are some of the best vintage integrated amp made by Marantz, and embody one of the best tuner ever made. After all, it is like you have a 7T/15/20 or a 33/16/20B (with less power and flexibilty) in one package ! A pretty good deal to me !

A note on the SLT-12/12U : Rumours stated that Saul Marantz was well aware of the problems of the table, as they designed it for playback with perfect records. When you put a slightly warped records or if the table was not levelled properly , the arm have a hard time to keep up with the groove. What a huge mistake indeed ! No review of the time mention that, but it is a well known between users. When Superscope take over Marantz by summer 1964, they decided nonetheless to release it. As I write, Saul Marantz never discussed this in any interview, so it is pure speculation.
 
The Model Eighteen was REVOLUTIONARY.

The Model Nineteen was only EVOLUTIONARY.

The Model Eighteen is the more significant receiver and is currently undervalued in the market. Pick up a mint Eighteen for half what a Nineteen sells for.

The Eighteen has the Pedigree: created by same the classic Marantz design team that made the legendary 7c, 10b and 8b. Not so with the Nineteen.

Saul, Sid and Dick were involved with the Eighteen— but not the Nineteen. The Model Eighteen was released circa December 1967 and Saul and his design team left Marantz in early 1968.

Production of the Eighteen ceased in 1970, the same year the Nineteen was introduced.

Aesthetically, the Eighteen’s faceplate is cleaner and more elegant. The goofy “Custom Calibrated” glued-on plastic badge or “50 rms 50” silkscreening on the Nineteen clutters the faceplate with marketing fluff, and Saul never would have allowed that had he still been President in 1970.
 
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The Model Eighteen was REVOLUTIONARY.

The Model Nineteen was only EVOLUTIONARY.

The Model Eighteen is the more significant receiver and is currently undervalued in the market. Pick up a mint Eighteen for half what a Nineteen sells for.

The Eighteen has the Pedigree: created by same the classic Marantz design team that made the legendary 7c, 10b and 8b. Not so with the Nineteen.

Saul, Sid and Dick were involved with the Eighteen— but not the Nineteen. The Model Eighteen was released circa December 1967 and Saul and his design team left Marantz in early 1968.

Production of the Eighteen ceased in 1970, the same year the Nineteen was introduced.

Aesthetically, the Eighteen’s faceplate is cleaner and more elegant. The goofy “Custom Calibrated” glued-on plastic badge or “50 rms 50” silkscreening on the Nineteen clutters the faceplate with marketing fluff, and Saul never would have allowed that had he still been President in 1970.

Thanks to all who have replied! I'm loving this history and difference of opinion. You're basically going somewhat against all the folks who are more on the 19 side. I like the difference in perspective!
You all are great!
Keep em coming !!
 
Thanks to all who have replied! I'm loving this history and difference of opinion. You're basically going somewhat against all the folks who are more on the 19 side. I like the difference in perspective!
You all are great!
Keep em coming !!

Really, you can't go wrong with either.

Do you want a Leica M3 or a Leica M4? The M3 will always reign supreme as it is the revolutionary innovator. But the M4 came later, has refinements and is evolutionary.

Not an exact analogy with the Marantz 18 and 19, but you get the idea.

One receiver has the pedigree and was revolutionary, while the later receiver has iterative evolutionary updates/refinements made by a different design team using the original 18 design as a foundation.

For me, the 18 is more significant, has the pedigree from a legendary design team and has a cleaner design / layout. Plus, the Eighteen was exclusively produced in USA (New York) in the old Marantz tradition. Not so with the Nineteen (production shifted to Japan during the run).
 
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The 18 was rushed with time constraint since Superscope has already decided to move the factory to California and no one in the staff want to leave NY. Marantz quit first in December 1967, Sequerra in February and Smith in march 1968. The Model 18 was commercialized around this time.

I thought Marantz moved production to California in 1970. If so, how was the Model Eighteen "rushed" if it went into production in Q4 1967, more than two years earlier?
 
The model 18 was the last true Marantz. The 20 was the fleshed out tuner part of the model 18 with some modifications and the 19 and 20B were ''improved'' version. The 19 came with a price increase of 40% with less reliable passive part, Sprague --> Holland capacitors for example. The 16 amplifier, who reprise the chassis of the model 15, is another example. In some way, these products were the last heritage of the time when Saul was there. The 20B/tuner section fo the 19 are great and are recognized has one of the best FM tuner ever made.

The 18 was not desired by Saul Marantz, who would have preferred to make a Solid State tuner and high mono power amplifier before (to replace the Model 10B and the 9). Instead, Superscope want to make a receiver to keep with the growing demand for that market segment. The 18 was rushed with time constraint since Superscope has already decided to move the factory to California and no one in the staff want to leave NY. Marantz quit first in December 1967, Sequerra in February and Smith in march 1968. The Model 18 was commercialized around this time.

So today? It doesn't matter, since after 50 years you must change nearly every electrolytic cap in both. The price ? The 19 is pricier for sure. Quality ? In the same range with new components. After that it is more a question of taste and speaker association than superiority.

Today, if you are enough fortunate (or lucky) to have one, restore it with the best component you can put in it and enjoy it with good speakers. They are some of the best vintage integrated amp made by Marantz, and embody one of the best tuner ever made. After all, it is like you have a 7T/15/20 or a 33/16/20B (with less power and flexibilty) in one package ! A pretty good deal to me !

A note on the SLT-12/12U : Rumours stated that Saul Marantz was well aware of the problems of the table, as they designed it for playback with perfect records. When you put a slightly warped records or if the table was not levelled properly , the arm have a hard time to keep up with the groove. What a huge mistake indeed ! No review of the time mention that, but it is a well known between users. When Superscope take over Marantz by summer 1964, they decided nonetheless to release it. As I write, Saul Marantz never discussed this in any interview, so it is pure speculation.

Question about a couple items:

1- does the tuner scope work as it should with a proper antenna line and tuner lighting up stereo in red? Does the scope work of the tuner wasnt working 100%. Basically, when you turn on the scope does it automatically do its thing or it has to be a strong signal for it to fully work? Because I've seen it where it's only a dot when adjusting left to right and up and down when the tuner was weak, it wasn't doing what the scope usually does.

2- does the tuner needle light up like in the marantz 22xx series or just the radio stations numbers light up? Because the one I saw, the needle didnt loght up just the background lot up. It looks like it should be lit up?

Thanks very much!
 
I thought Marantz moved production to California in 1970. If so, how was the Model Eighteen "rushed" if it went into production in Q4 1967, more than two years earlier?


The engineering team was about to be transferred to California to start planning the new factory. The original staff decided not to go but they surely wanted to end the project they were working on at the time : the model 18. Rumours said that a lot of people were involve, directed by Smith, Sequerra, Saul Marantz, but others employee like James Bongiorno, Dawson Hadley (https://www.psaudio.com/article/hadley-labs/) and contract employee like Julius Futterman (http://audioclassica.de/files/Dokumente/Die-Futterman-Story-2.pdf) seems to were evolve on the design.

Uncharacteristic of others Marantz.co product, save the SLT-12, the model 18 suffer from some reliability problem, mostly an occasionnal open winding of the 500V filament on the oscilloscope circuit and a broken on/off switch. This is uncharacteristic of Sid Smith, who always strived to design thnings that would last. Hopefully, these problems are easy to fix.

Even if you are not planning of using the tuner, the Marantz model 18 are a great integrated amplifier, many audiophiles said that the timbres it reproduce were as good has as anything else on the market today.

Like every system, choose your speaker carefully. Do always remember when it was designed and on what speakers it was intended to power.
 
Question about a couple items:

1- does the tuner scope work as it should with a proper antenna line and tuner lighting up stereo in red? Does the scope work of the tuner wasnt working 100%. Basically, when you turn on the scope does it automatically do its thing or it has to be a strong signal for it to fully work? Because I've seen it where it's only a dot when adjusting left to right and up and down when the tuner was weak, it wasn't doing what the scope usually does.

2- does the tuner needle light up like in the marantz 22xx series or just the radio stations numbers light up? Because the one I saw, the needle didnt loght up just the background lot up. It looks like it should be lit up?

Thanks very much!

1. The Scope work for the tuner and for the others sources too. Look up in the manual for details.
2. No light on the tuner needle.
 
Sid Smith, and to the entire thread. I started this thread to really know the history of the 18 and mostly 19 and I got more info from you all which is awesome. Now, I hope that everyone gets a notification of my reply here. I finally bought the Marantz 19!!! I couldn't be happier. It has been serviced, FM tuner aligned , scope works like a charm, has a golden/bronze/champagne faceplate with the Custom Calibrated logo on it. Best part still has sticker stating its MADE IN USA!

I did not open it yet and I dont have pictures yet. I will pot soon. To answer the question of the 19 not having good caps in it or build quality is poor, well it does have sprague caps. Also has Holland caps.

I started this thread because I was planning on buying one and I finally did! It took over a month and a half but got her done lol.

I also bought in the mean time some early close serial numbers recapped Dahlquist DQ-10 and a DQ-1W subwoofer in great condition. The Saul Marantz 19 design and the Saul Marantz Co Speakers design system. WOW! I am only missing the DQ- MX1 Passive Crossover to make the sub work well with the speakers!

That's my latest update. Will post pics of the 19 soon!

Please provide more info as it comes.

Thank you all!

The model 18 was the last true Marantz. The 20 was the fleshed out tuner part of the model 18 with some modifications and the 19 and 20B were ''improved'' version. The 19 came with a price increase of 40% with less reliable passive part, Sprague --> Holland capacitors for example. The 16 amplifier, who reprise the chassis of the model 15, is another example. In some way, these products were the last heritage of the time when Saul was there. The 20B/tuner section fo the 19 are great and are recognized has one of the best FM tuner ever made.

The 18 was not desired by Saul Marantz, who would have preferred to make a Solid State tuner and high mono power amplifier before (to replace the Model 10B and the 9). Instead, Superscope want to make a receiver to keep with the growing demand for that market segment. The 18 was rushed with time constraint since Superscope has already decided to move the factory to California and no one in the staff want to leave NY. Marantz quit first in December 1967, Sequerra in February and Smith in march 1968. The Model 18 was commercialized around this time.

So today? It doesn't matter, since after 50 years you must change nearly every electrolytic cap in both. The price ? The 19 is pricier for sure. Quality ? In the same range with new components. After that it is more a question of taste and speaker association than superiority.

Today, if you are enough fortunate (or lucky) to have one, restore it with the best component you can put in it and enjoy it with good speakers. They are some of the best vintage integrated amp made by Marantz, and embody one of the best tuner ever made. After all, it is like you have a 7T/15/20 or a 33/16/20B (with less power and flexibilty) in one package ! A pretty good deal to me !

A note on the SLT-12/12U : Rumours stated that Saul Marantz was well aware of the problems of the table, as they designed it for playback with perfect records. When you put a slightly warped records or if the table was not levelled properly , the arm have a hard time to keep up with the groove. What a huge mistake indeed ! No review of the time mention that, but it is a well known between users. When Superscope take over Marantz by summer 1964, they decided nonetheless to release it. As I write, Saul Marantz never discussed this in any interview, so it is pure speculation.
 
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