Music hall or Pro-ject.....

Discussion in 'Turntables' started by 7.62, Mar 20, 2017.

  1. 7.62

    7.62 Gearhead Subscriber

    Messages:
    444
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    just wondering if these 2 are decent tables,

    Music hall MMF 5
    &
    Pro-Ject debut carbon TK-27

    Thinking about one or the other and wanted to check if there's any issues I should be aware of ?
     
  2. tnsilver

    tnsilver AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,135
    Location:
    Boston
    They're made at the same old Tesla plant in the Czech Republic. It's known they share parts, design and construction but I'm not sure what the business relationship between Pro-Ject & Music Hall is all about. I kind of always liked the Music Hall design and their spin on the look of their models slightly better but I doubt the internals and construction level is much different.
     
  3. 7.62

    7.62 Gearhead Subscriber

    Messages:
    444
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    Ok, I had no idea they were made in the same place, I'm kinda leaning towards the pro-ject for finish it looks pretty nice, figure I'd get the ortofon red or blue cartridge and call it good. It's the last piece to complete my audio setup.
     
  4. Audiofreak71

    Audiofreak71 Active Member

    Messages:
    311
    Be aware of the dreaded (Project Motor Hum) some are ok some are very bad. I owned the Project Debut carbon esprit DC and could never get the hum gone, so that was the end of it for me. Went vintage after that and never looked back, been a happy camper ever since.
     
    cratz2 likes this.
  5. 7.62

    7.62 Gearhead Subscriber

    Messages:
    444
    Location:
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    I've been trying to bid on vintage tables losing every time, it's seriously ticking me off. I wasn't aware of the Hum issue with the pro-ject so Thank you I'll have to do more research
     
  6. Audiofreak71

    Audiofreak71 Active Member

    Messages:
    311
    The right one will come along if you keep at it. Your welcome, that's what we're all on here for, to learn, educate and have fun. :thumbsup:
     
  7. Bubbalouie

    Bubbalouie Active Member

    Messages:
    317
    When I was looking to add a turntable to my system and seeing what my options were for modern, I decided to go vintage. I have a Dual 721, Dual 1219, and a custom AR XB. If you want to go vintage, contact Bill Neumann at Fix My Dual and explain to him what you want and he will get the turntable built. Also, he has the largest parts inventory for Dual tables in the US. Getting a Dual from Fix My Dual, it will last your lifetime and possibly your children as well. I am completely happy with both os my Duals and would definitely buy from him again. Awesome CS is hard to beat.
     
  8. Wildcat

    Wildcat ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ Subscriber

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    SCS, MI (near a lake)
    As far as I remember it, the factory only manufactures the products. The design is ultimately up to Pro-Ject or Music Hall. Some shared componentry I'm sure, but there are unique parts to both, especially the higher you go up each respective line.
     
  9. cratz2

    cratz2 Super Member

    Messages:
    3,638
    Location:
    Indy, IN
    If you want to go modern, could you order a Pro-Ject from a reputable dealer that has a great return policy?

    I've read much about the Pro-Ject hum but I know three folks with low and mid level Pro-Jects and all are fine.

    What is the source of the hum? Is it a motor thing or an isolation thing?
     
  10. Audiofreak71

    Audiofreak71 Active Member

    Messages:
    311
    That's the thing no one knows exactly what is causing the hum and Project has been contacted about the issue with no recalls in sight. There's a big write up about this somewhere and numerous talks on forums about it. Mine was very bad and myself as well as my dealer tried everything. I decided in the end to not go forward with project anymore. That's not to say there a bad company and this is something that happens to all there tables, this is only my experience and those that have had the similar issues.
     
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  11. hoodie

    hoodie Doughnut Whisperer Subscriber

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    I've owned a few Pro-Ject and Music Hall turntables and only had 2 that had the dreaded hum. With both decks, I replaced the motors and tried a number of small isolation mods to help eliminate the motor noise, but the one thing that worked best (for me) was to replace the stock Pro-Ject drive belt with a belt that was a bit larger in diameter (looser). The stock belt seemed too tight and stressed the motor which in turn made it hum. Might not be a cure all, but it worked.
     
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  12. eb2jim

    eb2jim Super Member

    Messages:
    1,504
    I have dealt with Needle Doctor for ages. They sell and service just about anything, but for new I would go there first. You can deal on line, on the phone or in-store, and they have the stuff, know it, and are authorized dealers for both Pro Ject and Music Hall. My two cents.

    As for used/vintage, just check what shows up on Craigslist or search on ebay. I got a turntable I wanted just because I decided to check ebay before I went to bed. One popped up buy it now in the box for $89. I bought it then.

    Good luck!
     
  13. Jeff K

    Jeff K Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    561
    +1 on Needle Doctor. Can't beat them for service and support. I returned a 60 pound $2500 amp and they even covered return shipping. I expected to pay more than $50 to ship it. Didn't lose a dime.
     
  14. bberkom

    bberkom AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    404
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    I had a project debut III for years that eventually developed motor hum/rumble. The motors are simply not well isolated and suspension wears out. I tried some mods with some success but never got rid of it. Sold it eventually.
     
  15. 7.62

    7.62 Gearhead Subscriber

    Messages:
    444
    Location:
    Las Vegas
    You guys kinda saved me as I was going to pull the trigger on a pro-ject, I don't want to fool around with a known issue. They can't all be bad but not worth the chance. The Needle Doctor, great site so I've narrowed it down to these three. One is from Uturn.

    Audiotechnica lp120 in black, really not much I don't like other than the built in preamp.

    Denon Dp-300F with Ortofon red, this is the front runner right now. Like everything !

    Uturn Special, really digging the darker wood plinth, very sexy. The only thing I don't like is the lid, it feels really cheap and when raising it always felt like it was going to fly off. Experienced that from my basic.

    As far as a thorens, dual....etc I have the WAF to deal with. She doesn't like the way they look :rolleyes:.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017
  16. vinyl1

    vinyl1 Super Member

    Messages:
    3,482
    Location:
    Oronoque
    One other thing you might try is demo/closeout/late-model used. You get more table for your money this way, it you are willing to look around. MusicDirect, and probably other vendors, have a large number of demos and closeouts available. You can also find buys on the 'Gon and USAM if you know what you're doing, but with used turntables it is best to buy locally.
     
    hoodie likes this.
  17. trinhsman

    trinhsman Active Member

    Messages:
    358
    I've owned both Pro-Ject and Music Hall tables. Like them both. But from your original post, I would opt for the Music Hall 5, especially if you can do the newer 5.3. I own the 9.1 with Ortofon 2M Black cartridge and it really sweet. Currently have an AR XA turntable at Marcmorin for his magical touches. I have been told once done, I may want to sell my 9.1. If that happens, all I can say is WOW.
     
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  18. Chubba

    Chubba Active Member

    Messages:
    324
    Location:
    StCatharines Ont Canada
    Really like my music hall 9.1.Good luck on your choice.Cheers
     
  19. 1tumbleweed

    1tumbleweed Kozmik Kowboy Subscriber

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Colorado Front Range
    Pro-Ject = designed in Austria by Pro-Ject, marketed in the USA by Sumiko.

    Music Hall = designed by Music Hall, which is owned by Roy Hall.

    As said, both come out of the same plant, but the two companies are not connected otherwise.

    Cheers,
    Larry B.
     
  20. vinyl1

    vinyl1 Super Member

    Messages:
    3,482
    Location:
    Oronoque
    It's hard to believe there is absolutely no connection at all. Say Roy Hall designs a table, and asks the Tesla guys to cost it out. They might come back to him and say, "Look, the main bearing you specified is very similar to the one on the Pro-Ject RPM. If you used the same identical bearing, we could save you 30% on the cost of the bearing." And of course Roy, being a frugal Scotsman, is going to listen very seriously to that sort of proposal.
     
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