New Yamaha integrated amps

I have a Yamaha RX 777 that has a basically identical amplifier section as the A-S801.

It has really good imaging and has good warmth and depth to it.

I think it would be a winner. It's just a matter of hunting down the best price. :thumbsup:

My new to me RX-777. New in 2001, the TOP-ART amp section has been carried over into a succession of 90-100 wpc integrateds and receivers.

 
Yup, I've seen a couple of different models with basically the same amp section so you know Yamaha really likes this design. I think beyond these models you start getting into the big ass power supplies. :thumbsup:
 
Yup, I've seen a couple of different models with basically the same amp section so you know Yamaha really likes this design. I think beyond these models you start getting into the big ass power supplies. :thumbsup:

My new to me RX-777 got me interested in the latest integrateds, the A-S1100, A-S2100, amd A-S3000. Looking at, not buying, lol. All of them are rated around 100 wpc but as you noted, the difference is in the ability to handle lower impedance load which is a direct benefit of a larger transformer. Not saying the RX-777 is the very poor man's A-S3000 but with reasonably efficient 8 Ohm speakers, the RX-777 offers a good serving of the family sound. I tried the 777 with 4 Ohm speakers and didn't hear any compression even at rock SPL. The amp did heat up a little but did not threaten to runaway.
 
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I agree, If I had the $$$ I would like to buy some of the new higher end Yammy toys and ditch the rest of my stuff.

Unfortunately, there are practical things to do like fund my "retirement" ;)
 
My hope is that the Yamaha will offer better pacing and detail/resolution than my Sansui. I really like the Sansui don't get me wrong, and while I have a few dozen jazz discs, the bulk of my play through is punk and reggae. So the speed/pacing is important. And yes, many of these albums weren't well record (in relative terms), I feel like I am missing some sharpness/detail.
 
I got my A-S501 last night and my initial thoughts are mixed. It does have the energy, excitement, detail and sharpness I was looking for

BUT (everyone has a big but)

With my Focal speakers its got like next to zero mid bass. I played with the knobs a little and was shocked to see that the bass knob attenuates at 20hz. Which says to me "we don't want to put a bass knob on this thing, but we will so people won't complain". As my speakers start rolling off at 80hz down to 50hz, the knob, even when cranked does little.

I reset all the controls and went Pure Direct. Great energy and slam but even less mid bass. I added my cheapo 12" sub and it brought some of it back. I'm using this specifically for vinyl playback and yes, am using the onboard for now (Lounge is my front runner for a new one).

I was also surprised that to get the same volume my Sansui achived at 11'oclock the Yammy was at 2 o'clock. Weird.

My Focals can playback some really nice supple low end, but they aren't doing it now.
 
I bought a Yamaha A-S801 just a couple of weeks ago. No problem with mid bass, whatsoever, but I'm only using Pure Direct. The sub has a low pass filter permanently set to 90 Hz which is a good match for my BW CM6 S2's, but I can see where it might be a problem for other speakers. It's a very cool integrated amp that easily handles my (one and only) 352 kHz album (I Robot). The loudness control will add quite a bit of bass extension, but it won't work with Pure Direct. If you aren't happy, you should return the 501 and think about an alternative. What Focal's are you using?
 
I bought a Yamaha A-S801 just a couple of weeks ago. No problem with mid bass, whatsoever, but I'm only using Pure Direct. The sub has a low pass filter permanently set to 90 Hz which is a good match for my BW CM6 S2's, but I can see where it might be a problem for other speakers. It's a very cool integrated amp that easily handles my (one and only) 352 kHz album (I Robot). The loudness control will add quite a bit of bass extension, but it won't work with Pure Direct. If you aren't happy, you should return the 501 and think about an alternative. What Focal's are you using?

I have a sub running but I feel like I am not using the Focals for all they can do. They are 807v's on stands. I can sit right in the sweet spot against the wall and get a touch of that sub bass but not anywhere else. Plus, using the phono I find the volume to be at 1'oclock to be loud. My Sansui would get to 11 o'clock to be loud (at 1/3rd the wattage).
 
I had the A-S500 for awhile and it took a week or two to get used to the flatter / leaner / controlled sound of the Yamaha. Once I did I found it very pleasing and enjoyable. I would give it a couple of weeks before you make a final judgement. Also the gain on the Yamaha phono section is kinda low which is why you have to turn it up.

I now run Focal's with a Cambridge amp and it's nice pairing. NAD is also another great match with Focal speakers.
 
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I had the A-S500 for awhile and it took a week or two to get used to the flatter / leaner / controlled sound of the Yamaha. Once I did I found it very pleasing and enjoyable. I would give it a couple of weeks before you make a final judgement. Also the gain on the Yamaha phono section is kinda low which is why you have to turn it up.

I now run Focal's with a Cambridge amp and it's nice pairing. NAD is also another great match with Focal speakers.

What kind of music do you listen to mainly?
 
I have a sub running but I feel like I am not using the Focals for all they can do. They are 807v's on stands. I can sit right in the sweet spot against the wall and get a touch of that sub bass but not anywhere else. Plus, using the phono I find the volume to be at 1'oclock to be loud. My Sansui would get to 11 o'clock to be loud (at 1/3rd the wattage).

I wouldn't be concerned with the position of the volume knob. I don't think it is a good indicator of the relative power of an amp because you don't know what value volume pots are being used in each of the units. In the guitar amp world, a 250kOhm pot is going to have a much different volume curve than, say a 1 MOhm pot. Plus the tapers differ from pot to pot. Some are more linear while others have an exponential setup (audio taper). You could crack open the units and look on the back of the pots to see if they are different values, but I assume that the Sansui is a vintage unit, and who knows what they were using back then. Even the brands of the pots are going to make a difference in what you hear.
 
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One last thought on volume, one of the tricks that audio manufacturers use to sell their gear is to use pots that have a lot of gain in the first 1/3 or so of their travel. This gives potential consumers the illusion that the unit is very powerful because it gets loud very quickly. This is a great marketing strategy since the majority of consumers can only discern differences in volume from one unit to another.
 
Well, my "last thought" was certainly premature. I did think of another reason that Yamaha uses a gradual volume taper for their new integrated amps. They are targeted for the audiophile market in spite of their low cost. The loudness control is actually quite thoughtfully designed, but in order for it to work the way it was intended, users need to be able to turn the volume down to sufficiently low levels. Thus you have a very gradual volume taper.

As far as the bass and treble controls are concerned, the two bands centered at 20Hz and 20kHz, apparently have a fairly broad band, so they control frequencies all the way up to 400Hz and down to 3.5kHz respectively. This would, again, indicate a very audiophile-like design.

When I master my recordings, the last thing that I do before printing them is to add either a Pultec EQ or in many cases, a Maag EQ. Both of these have the ability to add back fullness on the bottom and air in the top bands that gets lost in the mixing process. The bands that I use are typically 20 to 40 Hz bass, and 10 to 20 kHz treble. The idea is not to mess with the overall mix by shifting the EQ decisions that I have already made, but rather to add back low end punch and high end transients for sonic impact. Lots of phase cancellation occurs during mixing, especially in the 20-40 Hz range with kick drums, synths, and electric bass all competing for bandwidth. So the final mix can sound "light" in the bass. Same thing, albeit to a lesser exert with the transients centered way up high. So a sub bass and air band EQ fix that problem.

When you listen to a recording, you probably don't want to mess with the original EQ settings that the engineer intended. You might, however, want to compensate for your less than perfect listening space which may have too much or too little sub bass; ditto with the ultra high end. The low and high ranges on the Yamaha EQ are not going to muck up the recording, but will allow you to compensate for your room characteristics.
 
Well, my "last thought" was certainly premature. I did think of another reason that Yamaha uses a gradual volume taper for their new integrated amps. They are targeted for the audiophile market in spite of their low cost. The loudness control is actually quite thoughtfully designed, but in order for it to work the way it was intended, users need to be able to turn the volume down to sufficiently low levels. Thus you have a very gradual volume taper.

As far as the bass and treble controls are concerned, the two bands centered at 20Hz and 20kHz, apparently have a fairly broad band, so they control frequencies all the way up to 400Hz and down to 3.5kHz respectively. This would, again, indicate a very audiophile-like design.

When I master my recordings, the last thing that I do before printing them is to add either a Pultec EQ or in many cases, a Maag EQ. Both of these have the ability to add back fullness on the bottom and air in the top bands that gets lost in the mixing process. The bands that I use are typically 20 to 40 Hz bass, and 10 to 20 kHz treble. The idea is not to mess with the overall mix by shifting the EQ decisions that I have already made, but rather to add back low end punch and high end transients for sonic impact. Lots of phase cancellation occurs during mixing, especially in the 20-40 Hz range with kick drums, synths, and electric bass all competing for bandwidth. So the final mix can sound "light" in the bass. Same thing, albeit to a lesser exert with the transients centered way up high. So a sub bass and air band EQ fix that problem.

When you listen to a recording, you probably don't want to mess with the original EQ settings that the engineer intended. You might, however, want to compensate for your less than perfect listening space which may have too much or too little sub bass; ditto with the ultra high end. The low and high ranges on the Yamaha EQ are not going to muck up the recording, but will allow you to compensate for your room characteristics.

Thanks. MY previous amp had a basic loudness button that popped +8 or +10 (I forget) at 50hz. Its bass knob was also located at 50hz which, for my speakers meant I could really get that full and supple sound. I agree with you about Yamaha's subtractive method of the loudness button as I read extensively about it. But I still am dissatisfied about the lack of bass. The common thinking is that "its not there so don't worry about amplifying it" and thats wrong. It is there, the amp seems to be voiced to not objectify it. Also, the "add a sub" thing.....I have a janky sub and it does add that sub bass back but the problem in my head with this is that I know, and have had, my speakers rendering these frequencies with the previous amp. While P.E.'s Fear of a Black Planet still renders bass that the Focals couldn't render on the previous amp, it beautifully rendered the lower register organ parts from The Cure's Plainsong. The Yamaha glossed over that organ part which, for me, makes for a less appealing listen.

I turned PD off and unplugged the sub and zero'ed out the tone controls and started over. I have the bass at 4' o'clock and while it brings in say 50% of the mid bass back to the sound, the lower frequencies (bass drums especially) are more of a "thud" than a "thump". The shame is that the Yammy has such a nice sound stage and a upbeat and engaging top end that its a bummer it chooses not to do the same for the low end.

I'll be spinning vinyl all this weekend and then I'll have to really ponder the future. Its a beautiful piece of hardware and does so much right. I think if I only listening to acoustic guitars and vocals this would be THE premier amp. I would rather spend money on a nicer phono stage than a sub. Subs and apartment living aren't a good mix for me. I will though try again with the sub as I want to make sure I give the amp its due.
 
I turned PD off and unplugged the sub and zero'ed out the tone controls and started over. I have the bass at 4' o'clock and while it brings in say 50% of the mid bass back to the sound, the lower frequencies (bass drums especially) are more of a "thud" than a "thump". The shame is that the Yammy has such a nice sound stage and a upbeat and engaging top end that its a bummer it chooses not to do the same for the low end.

Found this on Stereophile. Wonder if the Yamaha is just a bad match for the Focals?

"However, its tweeter is so extended in range and consequently so revealing that careful matching with other components and recordings is warranted. With the finest associated gear and recordings, the Chorus 807V achieved a level of performance that competed with much more expensive speakers."
Read more at https://www.stereophile.com/content/focal-chorus-807v-loudspeaker-page-2#CAG73ekQ6F8oYkVh.99
 
Found this on Stereophile. Wonder if the Yamaha is just a bad match for the Focals?

"However, its tweeter is so extended in range and consequently so revealing that careful matching with other components and recordings is warranted. With the finest associated gear and recordings, the Chorus 807V achieved a level of performance that competed with much more expensive speakers."
Read more at https://www.stereophile.com/content/focal-chorus-807v-loudspeaker-page-2#CAG73ekQ6F8oYkVh.99

Possibly, but again, my last amp had wonderful bass. Almost too much. In fact, if you take from say 300hz drown from the old amp and 300hz up on the Yammy, I would be offering to give people money to buy one if they were on the fence (hypothetically of course).
 
So I spun vinyl late into the night and all day today so far.

What I can say is that if I sit in the sweet spot there's decent (passable) bass. Clean and low (but not super low). Move out of that sweet spot and it rolls off fast. I've never experienced that before.
 
So I spun vinyl late into the night and all day today so far.

What I can say is that if I sit in the sweet spot there's decent (passable) bass. Clean and low (but not super low). Move out of that sweet spot and it rolls off fast. I've never experienced that before.
Make sure that your speakers are not out of phase. If you are using a sub, rotate the phase 180º.
 
Make sure that your speakers are not out of phase. If you are using a sub, rotate the phase 180º.
I did recheck that. They are in phase (red = +). Seems like to get any type of decent bass without a sub the bass is very focused. As this is in the living room though it doesn't work for me. Bummer.
 
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