NordMende Parsifal C (circa mid 60s)

Discussion in 'Tube Audio' started by James Hart, Oct 12, 2017.

  1. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    Anyone have any experience with these radios? I searched a little, but didn't come up with much. The unit looks to be in great shape and the seller claims it worked daily for years up until a couple weeks back. Now it doesn't power on. Looks worth giving a shot since I am trying to learn more about tube amp design (mainly instrument, not hifi) and want a small tube set up for my little 9'x8' workshop.

    Worth $50?

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  2. gadget73

    gadget73 junk junkie Subscriber

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    I see a tube that has lost its vacuum, that would be a problem. Its the one with the white top. Not sure if its the output or a rectifier but either could make it go silent. It could have blown a fuse on the way out.

    German stuff works well, but generally its kind of a pain to work on. Circuit boards on that one though, so it may actually not be as bad as the old hand wired ones. Those were kind of awful if you don't have a lot of experience digging components out of layers of other parts.
     
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  3. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    yeah, I saw the hazed tube too... owner says he "thinks it is the transformer" when I inquired as to the symptoms of its not working, I'm pretty confident it will be something else.

    I have been studying instrument tube amps for a while, have some theoretical designs that I hope to start prototyping next year. Not a whole lot of practical experience beyond some component replacement on solid state gear, guitar wiring, and effect box building.

    This one looks like a clean enough layout to be a patient on my bench :)
     
  4. Tom Bavis

    Tom Bavis Audiophool Subscriber

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    Sams lists "Parsifal" and "Parsifal US" models, this is later. It is a U.S. import model since it has the 88-108 FM band.There's a later "Parsifal Stereo" model that looks close, Radiomuseum.org has the schematic. Output tubes and audio stage tubes are unobtanium - ECC808 and two ECLL800s
     
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  5. Sandstrom

    Sandstrom Hazlewoodism Subscriber

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    Heck yah, other than the above average servicing challenges looks to be a good candidate to be brought back to life!
     
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  6. gadget73

    gadget73 junk junkie Subscriber

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    oooh, ECLL800, thats a rare bird. 3 tubes in one bottle. That could honestly be a candidate for a rework of the amp board. Use the same basic circuit but with a pair of EL95's and whatever triode is appropriate
     
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  7. Retrovert

    Retrovert AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    The ECC808 is just a 6DJ8, right? Plenty of those for about $10.

    Since I didn't know the ECLL800 I looked it up. (Thanks for mentioning that tube number.) That is one neat-o combination of a dual pentode (common screen) and a triode for the splitter. Wow. That's an output stage in a bottle. No wonder they cost $50 apiece! The alternate number is a 6KH8, which is the same price.

    If one of those was bad I would build a board with three common tubes on it and plug it into the socket, and add a second filament transformer to power it. Makes sense to do both channels. Might need to rejigger a few resistors.

    Impressive integration. Two tubes doing the work of six. With a few more pins another pentode could be added to make a full audio amplifier in a single tube.
     
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  8. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    Seller just got back to me... asked if I want to take a chance on it at $35 so I said yes :) I'll be picking it up in the next couple days, turns out he is over an hour from me.
     
  9. Tom Bavis

    Tom Bavis Audiophool Subscriber

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    ECC808 is similar to ECC83, but with a COMPLETELY different pinout... but it's likely OK. If not, only $69.95 at Tube Depot... Only Grundig and Rogers used 'em, to my knowledge.
     
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  10. arts

    arts Super Member

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    When you get it going,you are going to fall in love with it.The sound quality is amazing,and it will certainly fill your workshop with beautiful sound!:)

    The piano key switches can be a real pain at times,but the very judicious application of DeOxit will usually put things back in order. For this job I strongly recommend the needle dispenser package.You really don't want to be soaking the switch wafer material and surrounding circuitry.
     
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  11. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    Well, a coworker lives 15 minutes from the seller and has my $35 ready to hand him this weekend. Contact info exchanged... I cannot wait :)

    Thanks for all the advice! Any suggestions on which schematic might be closest to what I have? None on radiomuseum seem like the same guts or case.
     
  12. arts

    arts Super Member

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    You will need to use the chassis # to track down the proper schematic,as this model was manufactured in many versions. Even if you cannot locate the actual schematic for your model,you can usually get close enough for horseshoes and hand grenades just picking one with the same tube lineup.
     
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  13. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    Makes sense... I was just hoping someone have the answer before I have it in hand to start my own serious investigating :)

    I'm loving the fact that this one has a pair of 2-way speakers, the ones I've seen online have either a pair of single drivers or one 2-way set. I can already picture it on a shelf over my workbench!
     
  14. Tom Bavis

    Tom Bavis Audiophool Subscriber

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    There are 7 and 8 tube models in that cabinet design, 6/675 and 7/675, both on Radiomuseum - they have different output tubes.

    If you need an ELL80 output tube, I think I have one. If you need an ECLL800 output tube, Mark Oppat mentioned that he had a few on the Antique Radio Forum. moppat at comcast dot net
     
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  15. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    Thanks, I'm at the shop and it is 30 feet away from my in my coworker's trunk. I'm going to grab it from him at lunch time and take a quick look inside... maybe grab a handful of more detailed pictures.
     
  16. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    ELL80... looks like it definitely lost vacuum. I don't have a tester, but it looks like ones that have.

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    I assume this is the number that will get me the right docs?

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    "Tape Recorder" is that output only, or can I play through that too? Does the speakers outs defeat the internal or run with them? (haven't started any research so forgive me if it is obvious)

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  17. Tom Bavis

    Tom Bavis Audiophool Subscriber

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    The 6/675 model may not be exact, but should be close - same tubes. Seems to be FM stereo too - was usually an option.

    Recorder connector is in/out - a DIN cable like this will let you hook up an external source: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B073GGY2RK DIN speaker connectors are a bit harder to find. I don't think they'll cut out internal speakers.
     
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  18. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    I saw that one and thought the same... guess I need to pony up the $20 fee to see high res schematics.

    Already have this in my Amazon cart https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0053O6CSW Since I will be plugging my LG V20 into it in the shop.

    I've just spent about 30 minutes unsuccessfully trying to track down the name of the speaker connectors... is it simply "DIN speaker"? Does anyone reproduce them? I know from experience with instrument amps (tube or otherwise) that increasing speaker surface is a way of increasing volume.

    I guess I could always build a small plate with modern connectors if it proves to me more Unobtanium ;)

    Do you have a spare ELL80 you can sell me? I'm watching a couple on eBay... but prices are all over the place, and the cheaper ones are over seas.
     
  19. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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  20. James Hart

    James Hart Webguy :: Bassist

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    Looking forward to spending some time cleaning this up this weekend... got an input cable ordered from eBay, got an ELL80 and some speaker connectors coming from Tom, printed the schematic that looks close for reference.
     

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