NOS or new production?

Thatch_Ear

Addicted Member
What are you using and why?

For instance I have new production 300Bs. I like the sound and there is no way I am ever going to buy NOS WEs because of the price. Even the new production WEs are out of my price range.
In the same amp I am using RCA VT-229 6SL7s which I chose after rolling 6 pairs of NOS and not even considering using new production because the availabilty of the NOS US made tubes is good and the prices reasonable.
 
Lucky you!
NOS 6SL7s are still plentifull and relatively cheap-even the rare NU 6113s weren't expensive.
The amp in my main system uses seven (!) 6SN7s, 1 KT-66 and 2 845s. I'm using all NOS for the 6SN7s-4 Brimar 1988/6SN7GTYs (1950s), 2 Sylvania 6SN7WGTs(50s), 1 Syl. 6SN7W. The KT-66 is a GEC, the VAs suck. 845s are Valve Art. I have some 845Bs on order, won't pay for NOS 845s.
As a side note, the only current 6SN7 I find bearable, is the EH.
Jack
 
I like the sound and reliability of NOS tubes used in my gear.

If I run new tubes, I usually go for the Sovtek or Electro-Harmonix tubes as their reliability is very good(at least in my case) and the sound is almost as good as NOS tubes.

Ron
 
Well, yes... :)

I've got JJ EL84's in my HF-81, bought a quad of JJ 7591A's for my new to me Scott LK-72. I have vintage 2A3's (bought used from a friend) in my Paramours, and vintage 7591A's (courtesy Craig NOSValves Ostby?) in my recently acquired Fisher 500C.

I think the JJ EL84's sound fine... I am not up for the expense of a matched set of "good" vintage EL84's, new or used. Don't have an opinion on the new 7591's yet, as the Scott has a preamp issue and is essentially missing one channel. The old 2A3's (Philcos, nothing special) sounded better to me in all respects than the Sovteks or the Valve-Art new production tubes. BTW, the Valve-Art 2A3's are not bad sounding at all, and are a bargain IMO although I think QC may be an issue for those. The Sovteks are nice tubes but I paid less for the used Philcos!

In terms of small signal tubes, I mostly use vintage, but generally not top-end stuff, unless, like the Fisher, they were in there when I got it.
 
From my experience so far, the output tubes don't make as much of a difference as
the small signal tubes do as far as rolling for sound goes. And the nos output tubes
can be very expensive plus don't last like an input tube does.

So when I look to buy output tubes I look at new production mainly. Unless I find a
deal on nos.

The other way around on the input tubes 12a's/6922/6sn7 those kinds I use Nos or
at least nearly new old stock and find the prices on ebay and such reasonable for
what I go after plus to me the nos sound much better then new production.
 
Well, my experience so far has been mostly with the "N" rather than the "OS." Reason being I can afford the "N" and not so much the "OS!"

Been using JJ 5AR4s without incident for about the last 3 years. Haven't tried a Mullard or other NOS-I figure if it ain't broke, don't fix it. :thmbsp:

JJ and some older Rubys for 12ax7s. I have some RCAs and don't hear much difference worth mentioning between them and the JJs. The Rubys are considerably brighter than either though.

6L6GCs are JJ once again. Compared to the RCA 6L6GCs I've got I prefer the JJs, but then I'd bet the RCAs have more than a few miles on them.

For 7591s it's been the EH big bottle version. I wouldn't switch them for the Westinghouses that came with my 299C-those EH sound purty good to these ears!

Groove tube KT66s? Liked the sound, didn't like the sliver of orange on the plates or the extra heat from the power transformer pulling the extra .4 amps filament current.

That's it so far...

Best,
mojo
 
My preamp uses two each of 12sc7 &12sn7.NOS tubes in these tube numbers are very reasonable.My poweramps use a mix of current and old stock.Valve art KT-88, mullard small tubes,and a sovtek rectifier. David
 
I like my el34, 300b and 45 tube amps. I have had good luck with my TJ 300b mesh and for 45 tubes I keep scrounging pairs of used ones. I like the Cuningham 245 I have and my RCA and Sylvania and some others. I have not yet met any old 45 tube that I have not enjoyed listening to in my mono amps. I have been scrounging parts for over two years for my DIY 300b mono amps. I went with 12sn7 over 6sn7. The prices for good 6sn7 is outta sight. The 12sn7 are still really inexpensive, and very good souding. I bought a pair of vintage filament transformers to use those 12sn7 tubes in the 300b mono amps instead of 6sn7 tubes. As for rectifiers I used to use mullard 5ar4/gz34. I now use the coke bottle mullard gz33. I bought 4 from a guy in Australia many years ago. They are a drop in replacement for the 5ar4/gz34 as is the gz37. They look kinda funny in my 45 mono blocks as they are taller than my 45 tubes. Sovtek 5ar4 tubes have gotten the thumbs up from Wavelength Audio Gordon Rankin for reliability. I had a few grenade on me and some Chinese 5ar4 tubes almost 5 years ago. That left a bad taste in my mouth. They have improved a lot since then. As for my el34. I must spend more time with the newer el34 tubes to be honest. I have been using mullard el34 (not the new production ones) in quite a few amps. They sounded great in my 100 wpc CJ Premier 4 and they rock in my Klimo Kent el34 mono amps. But I am reading of very positive results with the new production ones. I have a new quad of JJ e34l to try and the SED are supposed to be good and some others. The good news is current tubes are getting better. That is really good because the stock of new NOS and used vintage tubes is getting more expensive every year. I have about 4 or 5 quads of matched mullard el34 left in my room stash. Sadly there is a lot of rebranding and fake tubes being sold on ebay. I posted a auction for some 12ax7 tubes at only $1350 for the pair at a buyitnow price. After I posted it on AA the auction was ended early. Today I am willing to try new production tubes where five years ago I was reluctant. As long as it glows it is in my tube amps. John C.
 
this is correct

Kegger said:
The other way around on the input tubes 12a's/6922/6sn7 those kinds I use Nos or at least nearly new old stock and find the prices on ebay and such reasonable for what I go after plus to me the nos sound much better then new production.

Kegger has this down right. The main difference between NOS driver tubes and new driver tubes is the quality of the glass and enclosure. New tubes tend to have thinner glass and are more susceptible to microphonics etc. For the output tubes, most new ones arent realy going to sound all that different (thats why the very knowledgeable scoff at tube rolling). i recently had some custom work done by one of our resident tube techs and when he replaced the tubes, went with NOS RCA blackplates and New New Stock Valve Art output tubes, and my amp sounds SWEEEEET!
:D
 
The main difference between NOS driver tubes and new driver tubes is the quality of the glass and enclosure. New tubes tend to have thinner glass and are more susceptible to microphonics etc.
Absolutely untrue. The major differences are in the quality of the internal parts and of construction. Some of the early driver tubes, such as 6SN7s from the 40's can be hideously microphonic, whereas the EHs are not. Same with many 6DJ8s. Despite that, I don't think current production small signal tubes will ever be as good as good NOS (note there was a fair amount of bad sounding NOS too).
 
I've used both NOS and new tubes, I haven't heard some of the more expensive NOS ones, but I have a few RCA's, cleartops and others. Depends on the application and how they are used. Like for a phase splitter of preamp duties, some of the new tubes out now are as good as anything ever made. The Russian 6H30pi, 6N1, and JJ ECC99 are getting excellent praise for their capabilities. I have a pair of the ECC99's and it's one of the best low MU, low RP, dual triode tubes I've heard yet. I also had some 6N1's but felt limited by using 6v heaters, but it was a very good as a phase splitter as well. The RCA cleartops seem somewhat veiled in comparison to those. I'm using the reissued Mullard EL34's and am quite happy with those so far. It's a little harder to roll 4 output tubes than a couple pre or phase splitters. I'd like to try those new GT EL34's that are suppose to be copies of the GE EL34. Unless some NOS tube is just so outstanding that it justifies some of these outlandish prices out there, I'm going to stick with new stuff. I don't mind spending up to $25.00 a tube for NOS, but over that then it is hard for me to justify. Especially after hearing some and not being overly impressed compared to some of the new stuff.

I'd also like to add, that the new GT 12AX7M's and Tung-Sol and JJ ECC803S is getting good reviews.
 
The Ei 12ax7's are good. Ken Stevens the designer of Convergent Audio Technology amps loves these tubes and would never consider NOS tubes.
 
The problem with using NOS tubes for a manufacturer is to get an amount so all your
equipment uses them and sounds the same. So almost all newer tube equipment will
come with new production tubes the customer can replace them with.

There is nothing wrong with most new production tubes and very few amps/tube types
make a huge difference when changing the output tubes so for most amps new tubes
on the outputs makes sense . They are generally cheaper then NOS and because they
wearout much faster then an input tube! Small signal Input tubes can last a long time.

I run NOS in the 12at7/12au7/12ax7/6dj8/6922/6sn7 and the other alike input tubes
that can truly change the sound quite a lot. And I pay no more than $25 a tube but
find I've got tele's and mullards and rca's and GE's and them all for those prices it's
the darn output tubes you can't find for good prices, you can find the small signal
tubes if you search. sure you can find outragous priced ones also DON'T BUY THEM!

Now as far as where they make a difference, generally the most difference can be had
in a piece of equipment by the first tube passing the signal and where NOS really seam
to shine is a driver tube not as much a phase splitter.

Now sure some designs and some tubes tend to put more of a mark on the sound of the
amp then others do. Generally the more simple the curcuit the more the tube will shape
the sound. And some tubes like say A 300B output tube "may" make a bigger difference
in sound on the amp the say a 6550 tube will. Try your amp with different tubes in each
area and find where the biggest change happens and concentrate on finding more of those
tubes for your amp and do some rolling if you want.

Not all tubes sound the same on all equipment. But there are some generalizations a
certain tube has a certain sound "to a point" that is true but just because someone
liked a certain tube in there system does not mean that it's a tube for you.
If someone has a system that's a little dull and they put a Telefunken in there and now
they have the top end there looking for does not mean that on your system with horns
that sound good and your using a mullard that the telefunken is for you, might be to bright!

"The above is just an example not meant as this tube sounds like that and does that"

Just like matching components for the sound you like so are tubes!

That really is the skinny on different tubes for your equipment. With "some" variance Of'course!
Nothing when it comes to audio is an exact.
 
Ken Stevens was not thinking of putting NOS in his products but was interested in hearing what NOS tubes would sound like in his equipment. I believe the Ei 12AX7's are built using the original Telefunken design.
 
I am DEFINITELY an OS guy......I do have trouble with the "N" part of the program, though, as they are expens-io!

In my McIntosh gear, (MX-110 and MC30's), they want GOOD tubes - the old brands. The 12AX7's always end up being Telefunken - any variance of that is a step back in my gear, IMO. And no matter what the other selections (the 12AU7 phase splitter in the 30's, for example), the old stock brands always do better than the new stuff does.

I have read some who like newer brands of tubes in their gear, often times those who run newer brands of gear........I surmise because the new gear is made to sound good on new tubes, where much of the old gear was voiced to sound good using brands like Tele, Amperex, Mullard, etc.

On outputs, I'm not sure as of yet - but I'll get a chance to compare the GEC KT66 vs the Valve Art Copy soon! I've been very interested in this comparison....and am finally gonna get a sonic peek at these smoked glass big boys. I've had a long curiosity about these.
 
I've heard good and bad about the Ei 12AX7's, most say they sound good, but they don't last and are sometimes very microphonic. I guess most retailers will go through tons of them just to sell a few good ones, that is reflected in the price, even though it isn't terribly expensive, I bet they can get a good deal on a 1000 at a time.
 
I am waiting on some Winged C SED 6L6GC's and will post how they did on my MC40's...
 
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