Ortofon 2M Red to Denon DL 103 to ?

I googled "hearing music sound in a cartridge". It's a common thing, you're hearing the carts vibrations, which are sound waves from the record grooves. Interesting info. I thought something was wrong, but this is very common.
Put on an album, turn the volume all the way down, put your ear right up to the cart. You'll hear what I'm talking about.
We usually don't hear it because the music is playing, and the dust cover is down. Someone at one of the Frankenfest gatherings said its better to play a record with the dust cover lifted, won't make a sound chamber from the air vibrations from the speakers, which the cart will pick up. Been listening to vinyl this way since. Do I hear a difference? Couldn't tell ya.

I believe you are describing needle talk. Too much of it might be a problem. I almost never hear it unless I try to.

Just curious of your tonearm mass, cartridge weight, and tracking force?

You apparently love the sound so it may not be an issue.
 
Too bad you can't get that Cotter SUT to cooperate - I believe it's meant to go into the MM phono input at 47k - did you try that? You did say you got it used, so maybe it's busted? Then again if it sounds great without it - just enjoy!
I'm going to try it again. My coworker who worked in Cotters shop back in the early 80's said these are virtually indestructible. I have the instruction manual and I'll check it again.
Thanks for the push!
Cheers!
 
I believe you are describing needle talk. Too much of it might be a problem. I almost never hear it unless I try to.

Just curious of your tonearm mass, cartridge weight, and tracking force?

You apparently love the sound so it may not be an issue.
I'll have to look up the arm mass and cart weight. Tracking force set at 2.5 as stated in the instruction manual.
Cart is 14 grams.
 
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Medium mass arm, 19 grams effective mass from what I just found on line.

For a SL1900 tonearm (effective mass including headshell of 12g + cartridge & screws =19g)
 
Medium mass arm, 19 grams effective mass from what I just found on line.

For a SL1900 tonearm (effective mass including headshell of 12g + cartridge & screws =19g)

I think the arm effective mass of 12g it's correct for Technics. The 103 is thought to be optimal with higher mass arms, like upper teens to 20's. Some people add mass to headshell, and then to the counterweight, to accommodate this cartridge.

Not sure this is worth it if you like it as is?

Does the ZU mod increase the cartridge mass from the stock 8.5 grams? If so you are already adding mass then.

Cheers, Bob
 
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I think the arm effective mass of 12g it's correct for Technics. The 103 is thought to be optimal with higher mass arms, like upper teens to 20's. Some people as mass to headshell, and then to the counterweight, to accommodate this cartridge.

Not sure this is worth it if you like it as is?

Does the ZU mod increase the cartridge mass from the stock 8.5 grams? If so you are already adding mass then.

Cheers, Bob
Hi Bob,

Yes. ZU cart is 14 grams.
I'm trying the flip the mat approach, see if there's an improvement.
 
I'm an idiot! I had the arm balanced at 2.5 grams for the stock 103. The ZU cart is almost double the weight. I rebalanced the arm, and now it's very quiet between tracks, and needle talk is very low.
So thanks gents for your help!
 
I'm an idiot! I had the arm balanced at 2.5 grams for the stock 103. The ZU cart is almost double the weight. I rebalanced the arm, and now it's very quiet between tracks, and needle talk is very low.
So thanks gents for your help!

It happens to all of us from time to time. Brain carts ;)
 
It happens to all of us from time to time. Brain carts ;)
Oh yeah. I flipped the mat, and it didn't sound very good. Then I noticed very little sound from the right channel. WTF! Pulled the head shell, and all kinds of crud & dust on the cantilever & stylus. When I remounted it, that's when at eye level I saw it touching the vinyl surface. Now, it's sitting as it should and sounding great!
 
Thought I'd post a few pics of the Zu cart. It came in an original Denon box (I didn't have the box) with the test printouts. Every cart has a serial number printed on it as well. Very nicely done.







 
Too bad you can't get that Cotter SUT to cooperate - I believe it's meant to go into the MM phono input at 47k - did you try that? You did say you got it used, so maybe it's busted? Then again if it sounds great without it - just enjoy!
I read the user guide for the Cotter. The two ground wires should be connected to a common ground, I had each grounded separately. I'll retry it this weekend. Really curious if that's what caused the hum, and if the hum goes away, than how will the Cotter affect the sound.
 
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