You obviously hate the Mac stuff and the Altecs.
Please put your mind at ease. Send them to me and i'll send you the AVR of your choosing
Please put your mind at ease. Send them to me and i'll send you the AVR of your choosing
Out with the tubes, and in with the SS
- Thread starter opusarlo
- Start date
opusarlo
Active Member
I have been playing my shitty AVR since before I posted this. I am currently listening to Phil Collins tell me he doesn't care anymore. Everything is maxed out ( wife is in Florida), and it is magic...I love it just like this.
opusarlo
Active Member
LOL, I was waiting for this post...HA!You obviously hate the Mac stuff and the Altecs.
Please put your mind at ease. Send them to me and i'll send you the AVR of your choosing
opusarlo
Active Member
If you remember my first post...I heard this gear 20 years ago, and it was magical...the very same pieces..not similar...the very same ones. He had SDA SRS speakers, but I was a noob...I know nothing more about what he had firing off.
darkblue94
The Devil made me do it.
Sell off the McIntosh gear and never think of it again.
darkblue94
The Devil made me do it.
This leads me to wonder just how competent the technician responsible for the restoration is.
opusarlo
Active Member
with my AVR, the Cornwalls sounds perfecto with the horns on top....with the Mac gear in top running condition, it is very top heavy. If I were to stick with the Mac gear, I would remove the Altec horns for sure.
opusarlo
Active Member
I had not thought about that....This leads me to wonder just how competent the technician responsible for the restoration is.
Are you using a "loudness" control, or DSP tone control or something else with the AVR, or just running it flat? Top heavy is what I would expect from that combination, unless it has a custom designed crossover, with any amp, tube or ss
opusarlo
Active Member
flat
I listen to Pipe Dreams (NPR organ music program) with a MC240 driving a pair of 90 dB Boston Acoustics T1000 tower speaker. Sound is nothing short of glorious - even at respectable volume levels. The speakers are supposed to be 40 - 20K +/- 3 dB but they definitely go deeper than that. Cornwalls don't go that deep but are far more sensitive than the T1000s. By adding the horns the mid frequency energy is dramatically increased leading to the perception that bass is lacking.
I strongly believe that the Cornwalls used alone will produce a much better result - assuming the electronics are working to spec.
Also, weak output tubes will seriously impair amplifier performance (especially at power-consuming low frequencies) so these should be double checked as well.
I strongly believe that the Cornwalls used alone will produce a much better result - assuming the electronics are working to spec.
Also, weak output tubes will seriously impair amplifier performance (especially at power-consuming low frequencies) so these should be double checked as well.
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Superampman
AK Member
Anything other than flat eventually becomes fatiguing, room correction notwithstanding.
opusarlo
Active Member
This is what I will test when I get the gear back...The Cornwalls sound amazing on the Kora Galaxy so there is hope
darkblue94
The Devil made me do it.
Vintage McIntosh tube gear while not "flat" is not hardly fatiguing in any way. 
I own 2 dozen tube amps – so clearly, I’m a fan. All of my tube amps are vintage made-in-USA. All have been electronically restored by a professional technician. (I also own several SS amps.)
I have one mono system, one 2.0 (stereo) system, two 2.1 (stereo plus subwoofer) systems, and one 4.2 system (left, center, right, a single rear, and 2 subwoofers).
I’ll focus on my basement 4.2 system: Source: Oppo UDP-205. Front, center, and left speakers are Klipsch RF-7 II. A single rear speaker is a Klipsch RF-7. Subwoofers: SVS SB16-Ultra, Klipsch R-115SW. I use a variety of vintage tube amps (7189, 7591, 6L6GC, EL34, KT88). When playing hi-res recordings (SACD, Blu-ray, Pure Audio Blu-ray, 24/192 FLAC) this system can deliver the full dynamic impact of large scale orchestral music and opera – including music featuring pipe organ. And sound fabulous doing so.
The Oppo universal players (e.g., UDP-205, BDP-105, BDP-95) feature "bass management" - i.e., a built-in crossover, and a connection for a powered subwoofer. With Oppo's bass management, the low frequencies are off-loaded from the main amp and speakers, thereby facilitating greater overall dynamics. Even without the subwoofers, my RF-7IIs can deliver satisfying bass for most music when driven by a tube amp. Obviously, a Mahler symphony requires more power than pop music (which generally has little dynamic range).
(BTW, in my TV room system, I have an MC240 driving Klipsch Palladium P-37F. Subwoofer: Klipsch P-312W. The source is an Oppo BDP-105. No problems with dynamics, or deep bass, or natural timbre.)
I’ll offer 2 observations:
The good news is that if you decide to sell your McIntosh tube gear, you’ll find that they hold their value quite well (particularly compared with an AVR).
Good luck.
I have one mono system, one 2.0 (stereo) system, two 2.1 (stereo plus subwoofer) systems, and one 4.2 system (left, center, right, a single rear, and 2 subwoofers).
I’ll focus on my basement 4.2 system: Source: Oppo UDP-205. Front, center, and left speakers are Klipsch RF-7 II. A single rear speaker is a Klipsch RF-7. Subwoofers: SVS SB16-Ultra, Klipsch R-115SW. I use a variety of vintage tube amps (7189, 7591, 6L6GC, EL34, KT88). When playing hi-res recordings (SACD, Blu-ray, Pure Audio Blu-ray, 24/192 FLAC) this system can deliver the full dynamic impact of large scale orchestral music and opera – including music featuring pipe organ. And sound fabulous doing so.
The Oppo universal players (e.g., UDP-205, BDP-105, BDP-95) feature "bass management" - i.e., a built-in crossover, and a connection for a powered subwoofer. With Oppo's bass management, the low frequencies are off-loaded from the main amp and speakers, thereby facilitating greater overall dynamics. Even without the subwoofers, my RF-7IIs can deliver satisfying bass for most music when driven by a tube amp. Obviously, a Mahler symphony requires more power than pop music (which generally has little dynamic range).
(BTW, in my TV room system, I have an MC240 driving Klipsch Palladium P-37F. Subwoofer: Klipsch P-312W. The source is an Oppo BDP-105. No problems with dynamics, or deep bass, or natural timbre.)
I’ll offer 2 observations:
- Tube amps can sound wonderful when in a proper state of repair, and when paired with the right speakers. IMO classical music is more likely to reveal the subtleties of amplifier sound, because the sound of a violin – and, moreover, a large scale orchestra - is complex. And we know what classical music sounds like when performed in its intended venue (symphony hall or opera house), with no electronics involved (i.e., no PA system, sound reinforcement, etc.). In other words, the concept of “high fidelity” sound – or faithfulness to the original performance, is – IMO – more relevant for music that involves natural instruments than for electronically generated music.
- Tube amps can be a PITA. (I currently have 2 tube amps in the shop awaiting repair.) On the plus side – vintage tube amps are repairable because they have point-to-point wiring and discrete components. I have a pair of 1950s era McIntosh MC30s that have been restored and sound fabulous. How many AVRs will be working 60 years from now? Will you be able to replace ICs in an AVR?
The good news is that if you decide to sell your McIntosh tube gear, you’ll find that they hold their value quite well (particularly compared with an AVR).
Good luck.
Audio memory is a fleeting thing, even more so over 20 years.
And SDA SRS speakers are not Cornwalls.
And Cornwalls are not SDA SRS.
Conventional wisdom says speakers can make the biggest apparent change of sound in a system.
So an audio memory from 20 years ago with totally different speakers may or may not be a fair "test" of your current system.
In addition, more than once other AK members have questioned the use of the add on horns.
Maybe they are right, maybe they aren't.
However, if you say the current sound sucks then it does. To you.
And you are the one that matters.
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damacman
Resident Psycho
My restored MC225 is flat within 1.5dB from 15-75Hz and within .2dB from 20-20kHz. Don't get much flatter ... [ http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/mc225-fully-restored.591099/ ]Vintage McIntosh tube gear while not "flat" is not hardly fatiguing in any way.
The OP simply has different needs than what a 40wpc power amplifier can deliver - hence my recommendation above.
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darkblue94
The Devil made me do it.
I agree with you completely sir. It's too bad it isn't working out for him. I'd love to have that MC240 to go with my C22 and MR71 but for the lack of funds I can not do it at this time.
