Pioneer 12D

[Whitebear15]

Picked a classic turntable up from ebay yesterday Pioneer 12D its like new, came with a shure M75 ED type 2 cartridge. Well chuffed.
It works fine, was just wondering if anybody else owns the 12D, because when I set the platter running it starts of slowly just for a few seconds, it then gets up to speed. Is this normal? Cheers Rob

 

[62vauxhall]

No, not normal.

Had two of them years ago and that problem is most likely belt slippage. I had to change several as I was fond then of using a Discwasher while the record spun on the platter. One way to find out - get a new belt but if the problem persists look look to the motor. That is, after you check how freely the platter spins manually with no belt in place.

 

[mark warren]

I have one and that is not how mine starts out. I will say this they are fantastic turntables I have one plugged into my macintosh and its Awesome! I have other pioneer Turntables but for some reason this is my Favorate!

 

[Whitebear15]

Thanks guys, just lifted the platter and the belt just fell off, yes it looks like thats all the problem is, so easley sorted. I will order a new belt. Cheers Rob

 

[audiojones]

The trouble with commonly available replacement belts for that and many other belt drive turntables is the speed error that frequently occurs with the new belt installed. I'm not sure if anyone has ever found a good reliable source for belts that are properly sized and won't cause the speed error issue but it might be worth a search or asking in the turntable forum. It seems like every replacement belt I've ever purchased on eBay for a Pioneer or similar TT makes the platter turn a bit too too fast no matter what the seller claims about it "being the right one". I finally gave up on the last one and wrapped the platter rim with tape to increase the diameter and correct the speed, but there must be someone who sells a belt with the proper dimensions that will ride properly on the motor pulley.

 

[Bob]

check the older posts. the belts will slip off the speed capstan if they're the wrong size - we're
talking about fractions of a mm.

 

[Whitebear15]

Im going to order my new replacement belt fom Amazon, theres quite a lot of good reviews from people who have already bought belts from Amazon, bit more expensive than ebay thou.

 

[jobrewer1983]

Picked a classic turntable up from ebay yesterday Pioneer 12D its like new, came with a shure M75 ED type 2 cartridge. Well chuffed.
It works fine, was just wondering if anybody else owns the 12D, because when I set the platter running it starts of slowly just for a few seconds, it then gets up to speed. Is this normal? Cheers Rob
View attachment 1026509

Not normal, I have the 12D in my main rig. Love how simple it is. As you have found out, its most likely the belt.

while i do like the 12D one thing i dislike is the floating platter, at times it can be a bit sensitive. I have to be careful walking around it while playing or i can cause it to skip... I adjusted the tonearm, its just the table itself. Over all a great table though!

Kind Regards,
John

 

[Whitebear15]

Hi John, After playing with the 12D most of today, yes I agree, thats what I dislike about the 12D, also noticed the lever to lower the arm, moves the floating table making the arm jump as well.
Was going to get rid of my old Aiwa AP 2100k turntable, Im keeping it now, I like the semi automatic function on it, the 12D is manual only, its another thing I dislike about 12D.
Cheers Rob

 

[KentTeffeteller]

Picked a classic turntable up from ebay yesterday Pioneer 12D its like new, came with a shure M75 ED type 2 cartridge. Well chuffed.
It works fine, was just wondering if anybody else owns the 12D, because when I set the platter running it starts of slowly just for a few seconds, it then gets up to speed. Is this normal? Cheers Rob
View attachment 1026509

Your belt is slipping. You need a new belt, and some cleaning and lubrication where necessary. I own a PL 12-D myself and like my example, it performs very well. If you lack manuals, vinyl engine has them for download (You must join the forum to do so)

 

[jobrewer1983]

Hi John, After playing with the 12D most of today, yes I agree, thats what I dislike about the 12D, also noticed the lever to lower the arm, moves the floating table making the arm jump as well.
Was going to get rid of my old Aiwa AP 2100k turntable, Im keeping it now, I like the semi automatic function on it, the 12D is manual only, its another thing I dislike about 12D.
Cheers Rob

Hey Rob,

Agreed, I know you can adjust the springs, but that requires one to actually dig into the table. And while I've conducted a lot of restoration work, Im just to lazy. The funny thing is I had help from multiple AKers on the site trying to figure out why a set of JBL L-150 woofers would jump around so much while using the 12D, found out it was the inner platter.

you can use some paper to isolate the platter and that helps but its quite sensitive. you will notice your woofers jump with any movement.

With that said, as a run of the mill manual table, its got a great sounds. I run the Sure M91ED cart and i always have great sound. once you have the tone arm set up properly you will be set.

Kind Regards,
John

 

[432HzBob]

Great tables.
Simple, reliable and have a nice sound.
The full suspension, however, makes for LOTS of footfall feedback, at least in my wood floor house.
I found building a real wood plinth and slapping some dynamat and clay inside healped deaden some of the resonances.
Get a new belt (cheap), lube it up and should last you another 40 years!!

 

[jobrewer1983]

Hi John, After playing with the 12D most of today, yes I agree, thats what I dislike about the 12D, also noticed the lever to lower the arm, moves the floating table making the arm jump as well.
Was going to get rid of my old Aiwa AP 2100k turntable, Im keeping it now, I like the semi automatic function on it, the 12D is manual only, its another thing I dislike about 12D.
Cheers Rob

Hey Rob,

So it's not the best solution, but it works...

I use a little cardboard folded and placed between the platter and inner wall of the box. This will help with skipping, works quite well actually...

Good luck with it!

Kind Regards,
John

 

[Whitebear15]

Great idea John, I will try that, but the cardboard spoils the look of the turntable, a small price to pay to protect your records thou.I think the damping isnt working properly on my deck, because when I use the lever to lower the arm, its goes down to fast. Will look into that, think you can renew the damping fluid, read it somewhere on a AK posting. Regards Rob

 

[Whitebear15]

Hey Rob,

So it's not the best solution, but it works...

I use a little cardboard folded and placed between the platter and inner wall of the box. This will help with skipping, works quite well actually...

Good luck with it!

Kind Regards,
John

View attachment 1026891 View attachment 1026892 View attachment 1026893

Great idea John, I will try that, but the cardboard spoils the look of the turntable, a small price to pay to protect your records thou.I think the damping isnt working properly on my deck, because when I use the lever to lower the arm, its goes down to fast. Will look into that, think you can renew the damping fluid, read it somewhere on a AK posting. Regards Rob

 

[Whitebear15]

Hi John, Had my 12D to pieces this morning, I discovered that the floating table was on springs for the damping, at one time the springs had sponge pushed into them, this has rotted away making the turntable to sensentive to any movement. The black stuff on the photo is whats left of the original sponge. Solution is to cut new round peices of sponge. Im on with my 12D and up to now its a lot better. Update.. Deck now finished, big differance, can touch the lever to lower the deck arm and it doesant make the arm jump about. Also noticed that the motor rubble has gone, not sure why but glad.

 

[jobrewer1983]

Hi John, Had my 12D to pieces this morning, I discovered that the floating table was on springs for the damping, at one time the springs had sponge pushed into them, this has rotted away making the turntable to sensentive to any movement. The black stuff on the photo is whats left of the original sponge. Solution is to cut new round peices of sponge. Im on with my 12D and up to now its a lot better. Update.. Deck now finished, big differance, can touch the lever to lower the deck arm and it doesant make the arm jump about. Also noticed that the motor rubble has gone, not sure why but glad.
View attachment 1027037 View attachment 1027039

Well this is great to know. I've never had mine open, but now i know what i am looking for. I do have some sponge foam, and I do have some turntable oil. I may just crack into mine this evening. Thank you very much for the great info! I usually do not like messing with turntables, as there is a lot of work, and they are awkward to flip upside down with the tonearm. I may try mine this evening, and i do have a spare belt, and a new can or turntable oil. May just do a nice refresh on my table this evening.

Kind Regards,
John

 

[Whitebear15]

Well this is great to know. I've never had mine open, but now i know what i am looking for. I do have some sponge foam, and I do have some turntable oil. I may just crack into mine this evening. Thank you very much for the great info! I usually do not like messing with turntables, as there is a lot of work, and they are awkward to flip upside down with the tonearm. I may try mine this evening, and i do have a spare belt, and a new can or turntable oil. May just do a nice refresh on my table this evening.

Kind Regards,
John

Find a website on how to renovate a 12D, they mention the foam rotting away on there.
Instructions how to replace the foam are on the website.
http://mr-ives.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/restoring-pioneer-pl-12d-turntable.html

 

[jobrewer1983]

Find a website on how to renovate a 12D, they mention the foam rotting away on there.
Instructions how to replace the foam are on the website.
http://mr-ives.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/restoring-pioneer-pl-12d-turntable.html

Awesome, by the looks of it, i dont even need to flip the table, i can access the springs via the top platter.

Ok you have me sold, Ill be doing the update tonight. Oil, replace foam, and new belt.

Kind Regards,
John

 

[jobrewer1983]

Find a website on how to renovate a 12D, they mention the foam rotting away on there.
Instructions how to replace the foam are on the website.
http://mr-ives.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/restoring-pioneer-pl-12d-turntable.html

Hey Rob,

Thank you so much for the link and the info.

I was not able to get to it last night as I had a few things pop up, but I got it finished tonight! Fantastic, Fantastic, Fantastic!!

The foam in my table was quite soft, did not fall apart on me, but one can tell it's not as stiff as it should be. I ended up using some "pink package foam", and oiled the motor (top and bottom).

While it always sounded good, it would skip if you thought about taking a breath near it. What a world of difference.

I'm dialing in my tone arm now, and I can already tell it's more accurate now that the platter is not so loose.

Seriously put a grin on my face this evening!

Ok enough talk some pix:

Hope it worked, keyed this up on my phone.



That made such a big difference in sound quality, and leveled out everything.

Again, thank you!

Kind Regards,
John