Pioneer PL-50 alignment

[DENNYDOG]

Are you 100% sure the needle is in good shape? You could have the table set up perfectly and it wouldn't really matter if the needle is bad. Miss-tracking. Horrible sound. Maybe the stylus is bent?

Do you have any other cartridges you can try?

 

[keithpgdrb]

well, on my tonearm, the denon is not quite heavy enough, so I have to use the small mounting plate with the cart. the plate is structured in such a way that I can move the cart forward, but not backward to the 49". so, I've tried aligning it with the built in overhang guage one more time. gave it a quick listen with an old test record, and I still believe it is mistracking too much. I've really had it for tonight, so I'll give the baerwald a try on saturday maybe. or maybe I'll give up and take it somewhere, and spend money I dont have. I love the sound of my vinyl, but man I can see why people ran towards cds. lol!!

Are you 100% sure the needle is in good shape? You could have the table set up perfectly and it wouldn't really matter if the needle is bad. Miss-tracking. Horrible sound. Maybe the stylus is bent?

Do you have any other cartridges you can try?

This may indeed be the case, but I've always been super careful with my cart. unfortunately, I do not have another cart that will work on this table. my little shure cart just isnt heavy enough.

-what sucks even more, is I felt that things sounded better last night, before I reset everything!!

-as far as recordings, yes, some sound ok to me. like my nightfly album. that sounds pretty nice. but there is so much going on, that I dont know if I would catch any mistracking if it was happening. its my quiet acoustic piano lp's that are so hard to listen to. I have not attempted the van morrison again yet. sigh..

 

[aussiedan]

well, on my tonearm, the denon is not quite heavy enough, so I have to use the small mounting plate with the cart. the plate is structured in such a way that I can move the cart forward, but not backward to the 49". so, I've tried aligning it with the built in overhang guage one more time. gave it a quick listen with an old test record, and I still believe it is mistracking too much. I've really had it for tonight, so I'll give the baerwald a try on saturday maybe. or maybe I'll give up and take it somewhere, and spend money I dont have. I love the sound of my vinyl, but man I can see why people ran towards cds. lol!!



This may indeed be the case, but I've always been super careful with my cart. unfortunately, I do not have another cart that will work on this table. my little shure cart just isnt heavy enough.

-what sucks even more, is I felt that things sounded better last night, before I reset everything!!

-as far as recordings, yes, some sound ok to me. like my nightfly album. that sounds pretty nice. but there is so much going on, that I dont know if I would catch any mistracking if it was happening. its my quiet acoustic piano lp's that are so hard to listen to. I have not attempted the van morrison again yet. sigh..

Once you get it right, you can give yourself a big fat pat on the back, 'cause its worth it. The improvement it made to mine afterwards has been fantastic, not in terms of scientific adjustment, just listening pleasure.

Your construction level should be fine, if you use it right. When you get the bubble centered between the lines, turn it end for end and confirm the bubble is still in the centre. If so, your surface is level and your level is accurate. If not, your level is out, so half the error to get your surface level. Takes longer to get the level out of the garage that to do the job, well it does for me anyway.

It's taken me a while to get my wee brain arroud the difference an S arm makes. A straight arm generally swings radially from the pivot, with a possiblity of an angle at the headshell mount point, although most mount in line with the arm.
The S arm allows for a large angle at the mount, I guess effectively simulating a longer arm in a smaller space. The offset of the "S" increases the distance from pivot to stylus.
If I'm right, the longer the arm, the closer it tracks to a straight line, like the Master pressing was cut (enter linear tracking turntables).

That said; most protractors will be upet by this extra length/extra angle (unless compensated for), so the overhang becomes more critical to the stylus setting than angle dunno with an s arm.

The balance weight on mine needs to be set to zero, then pushed along the shaft until it balances. It needs to be running as if playing, then unplugged for the return mech to not interfere. PITA really. It originally had a removable plug in the weight end for heavier headshells/cartridges. How do you set yours to zero/balanced?

I had been running mine at 48mm, 1.5 grams. Now at 49mm and 2 grams. I didnt realise the weight I was running was 0.5 gram too light, according to the Ortofon spec.

A bit of adjusting yourself will get Van singing again. Don't rush to pay someone.

 

[keithpgdrb]

well, just a quick update. I got fed up with trying to make the denon 110 work on that tonearm. with the weight plate, I just couldnt get it in the 49" position to even try it. So, I took the denon off of my pl-50, and installed it on my new pl-600. The cart is the proper weight for that table, so it will work out. I purchased a replacement stylus for the original pl-35 cart that I found the table with. It is a much better weight for the arm. Since then, I have played with both the 49" measurement, and using the overhang guage.

Last night, when listening to an album at 49", I found a great amount of sibilance throughout the record. when I moved the cart to line up with the overhang guage, It seemed better. I'll have to listen with a more critical ear later in the day with another album, but it seems right now that the overhang gauge is the way to go. It would make sense for it to be that way.

I'm sure the pl-36 is not some amazing cart. I actually feel like I'm hearing more overall surface noise right now. But it could be a slightly dirty album. not sure.

thats the update. I'll be back with some balance tests.

 

[rush2112guy]

I have a Pioneer PL-A25 TT. I recently purchased a Orto 2M Blue for it and of course because it was a proprietary headshell,(restricted to their design) it wouldnt fit the headshell. So I sent it back to the needle doc and replaced it with the AT-440 ,so I will be going through the same thing here shortly.I hope I dont have to many problems. I will keep you posted.

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[gmku]

Does anyone have a recommendation on what method/protractor I should use on a Pioneer PL-50 turntable/S arm/Denon 110 cart. I've been having a horrible time dealing with mis-tracking and what sounds like un-even volume. Unless of course most albums are mixed favoring the right.

example - was listening to van morrison's tupelo honey album, and his vocals distort all over the place on some tracks. really irritating. anyone want to have a cartridge set up party? I'll buy beer and pizza.

Uneven volume and mixed to the right? I was having this problem because my amp was going bad. It could be your receiver/amp and not the turntable.

 

[keithpgdrb]

Making sure that the PLATTER is level front to back and side to side is great advise. Plus, when ever you change cartridges you should follow the setup instructions that are in the Owner's manual. Adjust the overhang, level the tonearm, set the BIAS (anti skate) to zero. Raise the rear of the unit 20 degrees or as close as you can get it. Now you can check and adjust the lateral balance. This is an important step. From there you should check the VTA and adjust if needed. Check and adjust the Azimuth, then the VTF and finally the correct anti skate value. This procedure has work well for me with both a PL-50 and a recently departed PL-31D.

Cheers,
Paul

I've always been irritated by that lateral balance process. how many inches up is 20 degrees?

 

[boreas]

how many inches up is 20 degrees?

Depends on the front to back dimension between points of support (feet). The simplest way to do it is with an angle finder. It's going to be 4" more or less and I suspect that the actual number of degrees of elevation is not all that critical.

John

 

[finnbow]

I've always been irritated by that lateral balance process. how many inches up is 20 degrees?

The sine of 20 degrees (opposite/hypotenuse) = 0.34. Accordingly, measure the length of the turntable base in the direction in question and multiply by .34. Then lift up one end by that amount.