Possible Cure for Collapsed Stylus Suspension

I'd have to say that many of the aftermarket needles, especially budget ones, are not manufactured with the same level of care that the OEM ones were, but not entirely unexpected considering that they were probably going to sell for 1/4th or less the price of an original. Sometimes that lack of care can at least partially be improved upon, for instance cantilever alignment, to allow it to work better than it would otherwise. I don't know how one might lessen an excessive wad of adhesive like some of these have.

I can't remember cleaning any of those with solvent. I don't usually clean with solvent because of concerns about damaging the adhesive. I use a B&O stylus cleaning brush and Magic Eraser. Years ago I used the green paper that Linn recommend. Isopropanol is used on very rare occasions if other methods fail, most recently on a used AT stylus purchase that had a sticky wad of crud that wouldn't respond to the usual cleaning methods.
 
Well, that's weird! Turns out that the scale I was using had gone belly up.

When I set the VTF at 1.0g using the scale, the actual VTF was around 1.75g. Using a 5g test weight, the scale only registered 3.22g. So the mistracking I heard on that Louis Jordan record can't be attributed to too little VTF.

After setting the VTF correctly using a different scale, checked against the test weight, I could still hear mistracking. But I could also hear mistracking using my 2000T, though slightly less. Probably groove damage. Time for the Shure Era IV Audio Obstacle Course's tonearm resonance test.

Empire 2000T, @1.25g:
4, 5 & 6Hz normal
8Hz slight bouncing and barely audible distortion
10Hz somewhat more bouncing and more audible distortion
12Hz smoothed out to same level as @8Hz

SignetTK3Ea/ATN120E, @1.5g:
4, 5 & 6Hz normal
8Hz very slight bouncing with no audible distortion
10 & 12Hz normal

Shure V15/IV HE, @1.5g, brush down:
4 thru 8 Hz normal
10Hz very slight pulsations at cantilever
12Hz slight pulsations at cantilever, very faint distortion

Shure M97E/Astatic NMR stylus, @1.5g, brush down:
4 thru 10Hz normal
12Hzvery slight pulsations at cantilever, no distortion

Pickering V-15 Micro IV/D625E Generic @1.25g:
4, 5 & 6Hz normal
8Hz stylus hopping out of the groove, test aborted.

Okay, I suppose I got carried away but it's interesting to see how well the Shure Dynamic Stabilizer brush tames arm resonance.

So, the exercise wasn't an unqualified success. Though the WD-40 restored the orientation of the cantilever to something resembling normal, and the performance of the stylus was good on most of the records I played, it did run into trouble on one and it failed the resonance test in dramatic fashion. This could mean that, while it restored the appearance of the stylus, the WD-40 didn't restore the elastomeric propertied of the suspension to optimum. It could also mean that this particular stylus would have always performed poorly, right from the box. There's just no way of knowing.

The quest continues.

John

PS: my second scale just stopped working. Hope it's batteries.
 
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Probably is batteries. Does yours use AG12 cells? See if you can get the silver oxide version, SG12. Flatter discharge curve.

And thanks for doing all those tests! You mean that fad gimmick Dynamic Stabilizer actually helps?? Dang!
 
LR43. Radio Shack had some SR43s for $6.00 apiece or $13.00 for three. A new scale costs $12.00 on eBay.

John
 
Regarding scales, there are some available that use "AAA" batteries. Weird, expensive batteries will drive you crazy.
 
Same thing. We probably have the same scale.
scale, digital, side-load, from tomtop_uk.JPG
Radio Shack had some SR43s for $6.00 apiece ... A new scale costs $12.00 on eBay.
[Scream!] Shack is not the place to go unless you need it now. I was shocked to find that my local dollar store had whole blister sheets of alkaline button cells for a buck.
button batteries from Dollar Stretcher for VTF scale.jpg GLS button cell 40 pc blister, 00272.JPG
Likewise lithium coin cells. Smaller sheets of silver oxide cells, too. Failing that, take a look at batteriesinaflash.com.
 
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Regarding scales, there are some available that use "AAA" batteries. Weird, expensive batteries will drive you crazy.

The one that went all funny on me took AAA batteries. It also had the advantage of being able to weigh things that weigh more than 5g. I haven't been able to locate another.

John
 
Oh! I have more than one of those too, specifically because it did take AAAs. Good, but not as reliable, and with measurements not as consistently repeatable as with the 0 to 5g jobbie, and the display is upside down when doing phono stuff. But both of them can be had for less than $10 shipt on eBuy.
 
Oh! I have more than one of those too, specifically because it did take AAAs. Good, but not as reliable, and with measurements not as consistently repeatable as with the 0 to 5g jobbie, and the display is upside down when doing phono stuff. But both of them can be had for less than $10 shipt on eBuy.

That's the one!

John
 
Anyway, everyone should have one of the normal top-pan 200g, 0.01g-resolution scales. Handy for many things, but specifically useful for p-mount enthusiasts trying to put different styli and bodies together, and for others trying to pull mass out of their tonearms by finding the lightest headshells, et cetera. Weighing counterweights also-- important when you're using an ultralight headshell or integrated headshell like the first-gen Ortofon Concorde or the Empire ICS series.

How such a thing might be useful when dosing rubber suspensions with fish oil, I haven't the slightest. But at least I've acknowledged that we've gone off-topic.
 
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Same thing. We probably have the same scale.


[Scream!] Shack is not the place to go unless you need it now. I was shocked to find that my local dollar store had whole blister sheets of alkaline button cells for a buck. Likewise lithium coin cells. Smaller sheets of silver oxide cells, too. Failing that, take a look at batteriesinaflash.com.
Yes, I bought 3 sheets for $3 a few years ago, and each sheet had about 50 batteries of different diameter, thickness. Some fit my devices, others don't. Even if they're too small, I'm usually able to tweak a solution to be sure the make side (ie, negative) contact. They're alkaline, haven't found lithium or silver oxide. I've used them in watches, and they seem to work for about a year. Not bad at 2¢ each vs $6 at RS. Also used them in multimeters with fine results. I haven't seen them lately, which is too bad because I'm running out.
 
Same thing. We probably have the same scale.


[Scream!] Shack is not the place to go unless you need it now. I was shocked to find that my local dollar store had whole blister sheets of alkaline button cells for a buck. Likewise lithium coin cells. Smaller sheets of silver oxide cells, too. Failing that, take a look at batteriesinaflash.com.
Yes, I bought 3 sheets for $3 a few years ago, and each sheet had about 50 batteries of different diameter, thickness. Some fit my devices, others don't. Even if they're too small, I'm usually able to tweak a solution to be sure the make side (ie, negative) contact. They're alkaline, haven't found lithium or silver oxide. I've used them in watches, and they seem to work for about a year. Not bad at 2¢ each vs $6 at RS. Also used them in multimeters with fine results. I haven't seen them lately, which is too bad because I'm running out.
 
Another data point: currently a Japanese seller is listing NOS Astatic MF-100 cartridges one at a time, described as "defect" on the 'Bay. The translated description says it will only track at a considerably lighter weight than recommended. Sounded like a bad suspension to me, so I took the chance and ordered one for $130. It arrived a few days ago, and the suspension did seem pretty wiggly, so I added a tiny amount of WD-40 with a 30 gauge needle and waited 36 hours. Just put it in play, and it sounds great and tracks perfectly at the originally recommended weight. The seller has another one listed now -might be a good way for someone else interested in this cartridge to pick one up for a reasonable price.
 
I promised an update over two months ago (nov 7 '16), regarding a "fix" for a rock-hard old AKG P8ES suspension, a brand notorious for this problem. It had gone from a high-compliance cartridge a "no-compliance" cartridge. Unplayable. I soaked the rubber grommet repeatedly in lighter fluid (naphtha) and the cart played beautifully.

The question was, Would it last? I haven't played it a lot, I've been playing with other cartridges, but played it today and Yes, played great. It was famous in its day, and its .0002 minor-radius edge extracts enormous detail and nuance, and soundstage is enveloping. It does lack dynamics ("drama") compared to some of my other favorite vintage MMs. It may simply need more playing time to loosen up, or more naphtha baths. I'll try the latter because it produces results faster and seems to cause no harm.

I can now recommend it to others. It brings AKGs back to life, and lasts (at least 2+ months). It's harmless to all other parts, and safe to use. I expect (at least hope for) even further improvement.

Hope this helps someone....
 
Another data point: currently a Japanese seller is listing NOS Astatic MF-100 cartridges one at a time, described as "defect" on the 'Bay. The translated description says it will only track at a considerably lighter weight than recommended. Sounded like a bad suspension to me, so I took the chance and ordered one for $130. It arrived a few days ago, and the suspension did seem pretty wiggly, so I added a tiny amount of WD-40 with a 30 gauge needle and waited 36 hours. Just put it in play, and it sounds great and tracks perfectly at the originally recommended weight. The seller has another one listed now -might be a good way for someone else interested in this cartridge to pick one up for a reasonable price.

I'm considering it. Just how good do you consider this cart versus others? Thanks for the heads up.
 
I said screw it, and bought the Astatic MF-100. Let's hope it is truly a bad MF-100 .....WATCH YO MOUTH!

Just talkin' bout (the) shaft!

Man, I'm in a corny mood.
 
Shaftastic! And speaking of shafts, this will be very interesting, since we seldom (if ever) see a problem with the cantilever-under-tension-against-a-rubber-disc type suspension, the closest similar familiar example being the Audio-Technica design. If you want to see how complex the Mitachi/Glanz/Astatic can get, take a look at the patent for the cantilever/suspension.
 
Shaftastic! And speaking of shafts, this will be very interesting, since we seldom (if ever) see a problem with the cantilever-under-tension-against-a-rubber-disc type suspension, the closest similar familiar example being the Audio-Technica design. If you want to see how complex the Mitachi/Glanz/Astatic can get, take a look at the patent for the cantilever/suspension.

So, would you recommend just a tiny drop or two added with a toothpick to the base of the cantilever?
 
If that's what worked for funflyer, then yes, but of course examine/test the thing first to get a feel for what might have happened to it.
 
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Since I'm the one who offered the AKG "fix", I feel responsible (though, attorneys please note, not liable!) A drop or two on a toothpick won't do it. That suspension is like concrete. The stylus wouldn't track at all, it just stayed in the lead-in groove.

I removed the stylus assembly from cart, so no fluid would get inside. I propped the stylus so it was pointing straight up. In this position, the suspension forms a tiny "well" at the bottom. I filled it with the lighter fluid (keyword 'tiny' — 1 drop fills it) and let it soak. It doesn't soak for long, the stuff evaporates pretty fast. I refilled the well.

I don't know how many times I did it in all (should have kept track, scientific method and all that) and I often checked to see if there was any softening, or if my experiment was having adverse effects.

After about 20 refills (I'm guessing) I plugged it into the tonearm and — LO — it played, whereas before it wouldn't. Sounded very constrained though, so I repeated the procedure maybe a dozen times more. Yes, it clearly sounded much better.

It still sounds a bit constricted dynamically, not responding to sudden transients with the same explosiveness of my better cartridges. Unfortunately I don't have any really-crap cartridges to compare it to.

This is important: I was prepared to write off the cartridge. I was never going to pay serious money for a rebuild. As it happens, it was not destroyed, and the experiment is a success, though not 100%. At this point, I don't know whether to apply more solvent, and see what happens, or just let it play for 20 hours or so, like a normal cartridge "break in" process, and see what happens.

But if you value the cartridge, and aren't prepared to write it off, maybe best to leave it as is. I did receive a message informing me that a man named Axel in Germany replaces the AKG suspensions for about 80 euro. That's the only info I was given, and I can't verify it.
 
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