Prelude MTS drivers

Discussion in 'Infinity Loudspeakers' started by PatBB, Feb 1, 2012.

  1. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    I have been hearing a sort of rattling noise from one of my speakers for a while now, usually when listening to piano music at the start of and during a crescendo. It is audible, but not very loud, so that it takes a while to admit to one's self that there is something actually wrong.

    Researching the issue I came across a thread on A'gon dating back a few years where I realized that this is a known issue.

    By listening carefully I think that I have narrowed down the problem to the 3.5 inch mid driver.

    Well it appears that replacements are no longer available, here in Canada, or in the US for that matter. Since these are CMMD drivers, an Infinity proprietary technology, there are obviously no other sources of anything that could properly replace this driver.

    What would you guys do in such a situation?

    Double down and buy more used towers hoping that the mid will be ok and cannibalize them?

    Learn to love the noise and hope it doesn't get worse?

    Get in touch with Infinity distributors world-wide to see if anyone has them and are willing to send them out of their own market?

    Is there anyone out here who can repair these drivers?

    Any information and suggestions would be greatly appreciated as now being retired the financial resources are not what they used to be.

    Thanks.

    Pat.
     

     

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  2. uvafan420

    uvafan420 LiKe It LoUd

    Messages:
    295
    I would check with Infinity first, if you have not already. You mentioned they were not available in Canada and USA, but was this through contacting Infinity directly? Sometimes they will have certain old drivers still in stock. Not all obviously, but some. They could also tell you some old dealers and repair places that possibly could have them.

    Next bet would be check out the big old auction site every now and then.

    And as you pointed out, you can let someone look at them and see whats wrong with it. Infinity/Harmon should be able to help guide you to someone.


    hcgcustomersupport@harman.com
    hcgparts@harman.com
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2012
  3. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Thanks.

    I dealt with the Canadian distributor here in Montreal, JAM industries. They are always very helpful. Harmon, on the other hand, excludes inquiries by people not in the US from their product support section of their site.

    I have sent emails to Harmon and to two repair facilities, one near where my daughter lives and the other the nearest from my place, and no one as replied as yet.

    I see that other Infinity models newer than my Prelude MTSs did use a 3.5 inch CMMD driver and am now trying to see if that is available and if it can be a substitute for the original drivers in my towers.

    It is a shame what has happened to Infinity in the last decade.
     
  4. uvafan420

    uvafan420 LiKe It LoUd

    Messages:
    295
    Yes it is... Someone needs to do as someone did with Aragon, and that is buy Infinity back and produce good stuff again. Harmon does not seem to care about it so why not sell...
     
  5. jt45

    jt45 Super Member

    Messages:
    2,014
    Location:
    Allons,Tn
    You happen to have that model number on the driver ? I can take a look at one of my Infinity's, that might help narrow it down some. Doesn't the primus series use those drivers ? I think both my center channel and some 363s my stepson is using both have a midrange around that size.
     
  6. okeeteekid

    okeeteekid Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    801
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    I Had a pair preludes a few years ago that i sold only because the mids are known to be faulty and are no longer available from infinity, the coating used on the neo magnet peels off and scrapes the voice coil, found this out when i took apart my old mid, Harman denies any such problems yet many people have complained of the same mid problems, i would think the 5 inch mid bass driver would have the same issues as it is also neo but i think that it is crossed over low enough so that you wouldn't be able to heat it scraping, i also spoke with a rep at Harman last week and he said infinity won't be making anymore high end speakers because there is little demand for them, so i said to him if that is the case... then why did Harman buy out infinity if you guys don't want to make any quality products? all he could say to me was... good question, i feel that there should be a law that if you are not willing to support your products you should not be allowed to sell them, shame on HK
     

     

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  7. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Thanks, Seeing as though they have no replacement parts, can the drivers not be repaired in some way?


    Thanks!

    PS I guess that Harmon attitude settles any notion I may have had of finding a nice pair of Revel Salons!
     
  8. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Jt 45,

    They are CMMD drivers and it is 3.5 inches in diameter. I left a message at the Canadian distributor asking them to see if any replacement drivers were available for some of the newer speakers using such a driver and asking whether it might be a substitute for the original one. No answer yet...

    Thanks!
     
  9. jt45

    jt45 Super Member

    Messages:
    2,014
    Location:
    Allons,Tn
    Should be some numbers on the back of the magnet or maybe on the basket somewhere, I was thinking IF the primus drivers might be a drop in, I could do a quick check on one of mine and that might help you locate one.

    Checking Harmons website shows that 3.5 inch driver (p/n I90GB90) as not available. It was priced at 125.00

    Further checking shows my primus towers to have 4" mids and my Center Channel has 3" drivers wich dont even show up on the support/parts page at harmon's site.
    Sorry I couldn't be of much help.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2012
  10. uvafan420

    uvafan420 LiKe It LoUd

    Messages:
    295



    There is a demand for great speakers. If not, none of the rest of the large speaker manufacturers would be in business today. Their sells blow, not because of low demand, but because of the low demand to buy their particular products and the support one would get after they buy them.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2012
  11. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Thanks,

    I can't even figure out how to remove these drivers from the tower, although I haven't really tried as yet. Called Harmon and the call was transferred to the parts department. Had to leave a voice-mail. No one called back. I am not holding my breath. Sent an email to the UK distributor. The one in France has no email! That covers the two languages I know. Maybe a message in English would be understood in any of these countries. I will try but it sure is not looking too good. Considering that unlike in years gone by no one really keeps any stock of spare parts on hand relying on the manufacturer or distributor and FedEx, I seriously doubt that any of the warranty repair centers would have any. I read that it is the coating on the magnet that flakes off or something. This may be factual maybe not. I wonder if the driver itself could not, somehow, be fixed. It's not like a burnt out voice-coil or anything, there is sound coming from the driver, but a lot of distortion can sometimes be heard on some music segments (usually piano) No way am I going to be able to get anything that out performs these Preludes for the money I have to put on speakers.

    We shall see!
     

     

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  12. StimpyWan

    StimpyWan AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,962
    Location:
    Blue Ridge Mountains!
    The Intermezzo 4.1 uses the same midrange driver. But, of course it's not in stock at Infinity either:

    http://www.harmanaudio.com/search_browse/partlist.asp?Parts=ITM4.1TBLKL&BrandId=INF&MarketId=HOM

    Also, keep an eye out on eBay Germany. Infinity speakers seem to be very popular there, and parts show up more often on eBay Germany, for the higher-end Infinity models, than on our eBay. The Germany Infinity Service Center may have parts too:

    http://www.infinitysystems.com/home...S-TOWER&Language=ENG&Country=DE&Region=EUROPE

    rw soundsystem
    JBL/Infinity Service Deutschland
    Breslauer Straße 8
    Öhringen 74613
    PHONE: 07941- 649 110
    FAX: -649 112
    JBL@rw-soundsystem.de

    Write an email to them, and then use Google 'Translate' to convert it into German, before sending. And maybe you'll get lucky, and get an English speaking support person!

    Finally, short of finding a junk pair of Intermezzo's, Preludes, or a Prelude Center, I think I'd try Jt45's suggestion and pick up the cheapest Primus 360/361/362 or 350/351 Center that I could find, just to see if their mid might work...???

    Oh yea, one other thing: did you pull a mid and check to make sure an internal speaker wire isn't vibrating against a mid or woofer? An errant wire can make strange buzzing sounds, rubbing on the back side of the mid/woofer cone, especially if a specific frequency or volume level excites the wire, which could then cause it to buzz or rattle. Worth a look!

    Good Luck!
     
  13. StimpyWan

    StimpyWan AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,962
    Location:
    Blue Ridge Mountains!
    Just found this on eBay (not mine, just trying to help) - Infinity Platinum TSS 1100 Satellite Speaker:

    "SAT 1100 Satellite: The TSS1100 satellite speaker has dual 3-1/2" M.M.D. cone midranges and 3/4" M.M.D. dome tweeters. The acoustic suspension enclosures are made of brushed extruded aluminum, a design that was also borrowed from Infinity's Prelude series. The unique, all-metal construction provides extreme rigidity and internal damping to virtually eliminate resonance, so you hear the music or movie soundtrack just the way it was intended. Recommended Amplifier Power Range: 10-125 watts.

    120Hz to 20kHz Satellite Speaker Frequency Range (+/- 3dB)
    89dB Speaker Sensitivity (2.83V @ 1 meter)
    3500Hz; 24dB/Octave Speaker Crossover Frequency
    Gold-Plated Binding Posts
    Size: (H x W x D): 9.25" x 4.13" x 4.38"
    Weight: 4.5 lbs"

    It's cheap, and worth a shot! Two mids for half the price of one (correct one). May be good enough to hold you over until the correct mid comes along.
     
  14. jt45

    jt45 Super Member

    Messages:
    2,014
    Location:
    Allons,Tn
    +1 :thmbsp: and a much better deal. This is the route I would take.
     
  15. okeeteekid

    okeeteekid Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    801
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    The only 3.5 inch mid drivers that will work with the prelude towers are the drivers from a prelude center channel speaker, intermezzo 4.1 towers and the matching intermezzo center channel speaker, the intermezzo drivers are the same as the ones used in the preludes, preludes/intermezzo 3.5 inch mid drivers have neo magnets, all other infinity speakers that use the 3.5 inch mid driver do not have neo magnets.
     
  16. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    Hi,

    I have found a pair from Germany. The price factoring in the shipping, brokerage and duties will be steep, but it is orders of magnitude less than finding anything comparable as replacement speakers.

    Thanks to all for the help. A special tip of the hat to StimpyWan for providing me with the email address of the German distributor.

    I should get them in a couple of weeks and will gladly tell you what the bottom line figure is.

    Thanks again.

    :thmbsp:
     

     

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  17. StimpyWan

    StimpyWan AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,962
    Location:
    Blue Ridge Mountains!
    Thanks PatBB! Glad that I could help. :D

    And even better, I'm glad that you found the correct drivers from the German distributor. I hope you receive them promptly, safe & sound! :banana:

    Finally, why can't Infinity in the U.S. be that supportive??? :thumbsdn: I have to wonder if warranty laws vary by country? May be that Infinity Germany has to provide support for a longer period of time, by law? :scratch2: Or, maybe you just got lucky! Either way, you'll be up and playing in no time...:music:

    Oh yea, keep us updated, and let us know if the new drivers fix the original problem!
     
  18. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    The drivers were delivered today. Seems there was no fee for brokerage or customs duties, unless the invoice will be sent separately by DHL. Total cost for two 3.5 CMMD drivers with Pay Pal fee and shipping is 311.11 euros or about $406 CND.

    Does anybody know where I can get a service manual for the tower?

    I have downloaded the manual for the woofer free for notihng, but I could only find an outfit for the MTS tower that advertised the service manual for $4.99. I paid the amount and all I got were two pages showing an exploded view!

    I have sent an email to these people complaining. I will wait to see if I hear from them and, if not, will gladly disclose who these rascals are.

    Now I have to replace the one noisy driver and it seems that getting to it is quite a job. Driver replacement on my Paradigms was a charm compared to what is required to get to the driver with these Infinitys.

    Thanks!
     
  19. StimpyWan

    StimpyWan AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,962
    Location:
    Blue Ridge Mountains!
    I found this that 'might' help:

    "To Service the Prelude MTS Tower: 1) Lay the loudspeaker down on a padded, level surface with the drivers facing upwards. Enclosure will have a tendency to roll, so it must be propped; then remove the grille. 2) Extract all (12) rubber grille retainers; this can be accomplished by carefully pulling them out of their cavities with long-nosed pliers or similar tool. 3) Remove the (12) Philips screws that are now exposed. 4) Carefully lift the fully loaded baffle off the cabinet.

    Sounds fairly straight-forward, so it shouldn't be too difficult. I also attached the Technical 'Manual'. It can't hurt to have (if you don't already have it).


     

    Attached Files:

  20. PatBB

    PatBB New Member

    Messages:
    14
    All is well that ends well

    Well I replaced the driver in the noisy speaker last weekend and listened to a lot of piano this week as the noise was heard mostly on piano music, and all is now well with the speaker in question.

    Strangely enough though the mystery of the "faulty" driver is still not perfectly resolved as I discovered something inside the speaker when I opened it: a glob of hot glue about two inches long and sort of tear shaped was loose inside the speaker. The glob was not inside the plastic sub-enclosure for the mid-range, but near one of the small bass drivers.

    Well since I did not want to reassemble the baffle and close up the speaker merely to see if the removal of the loose glob would have been enough (not to have to go through the motions again and run the risk, no matter how small, of damaging something with an errand screwdriver of finger) and since I had the new driver on hand after so much effort to get it, I installed it.

    The original driver, from a simple visual inspection, looks perfectly alright. So what I read on another site about the coating on the magnet coming off and falling on the coil as a cause of noise is not borne out in my case.

    So all is well that ends well, I have a brand new replacement driver for future use if required, and the original one that could very well be operable also.

    Thanks for the help!
     

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