RUSH "Snakes And Arrows"

Tripqzon

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Artist: Rush
Title: Snake and Arrows
Year: 2007
Record Label: Atlanta/Wea
Genre: Rock

Boy was I surprised when I pressed the PLAY button on my remote.

First of all, This cd is really loud. I mean really LOUD!! I had to turn the volume almost all the way down. to get it at a comfortable listening level.

Secondly, there is no life to it. The dynamics are compressed big time. The music sounds squished and dull. I thought that the band would have figured out after their last release "Vapor Trails" that high recording levels and mega compression just ruin the sound. It's a real shame as I have been a Rush fan for as long as I can remember.

Thirdly, I'm really glad that I have a DBX 3BX III Dynamic Range Expander or I probably would not be able to listen to this cd and actually enjoy it. I have to run the Impact Restoration at ~11 o'clock, Expansion level at ~35%, and Threshold level at ~10 o'clock. I normally run them at ~10 o'clock, 20% and 12 o'clock respectively.

As far the content of the music. I love it. It is what you would expect from Rush. Diverse writing and Neil Pert is still a kick butt drummer. I love that there lyrics are not about hatred, foul language and womanizing. You know, the typical stuff you hear these days.:thumbsdn:

I give this cd a 6 out of 10 for sound quality and a 10 out of 10 for content.

Paul
 

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Tripqzon said:
First of all, This cd is really loud. I mean really LOUD!! I had to turn the volume almost all the way down. to get it at a comfortable listening level.

Secondly, there is no life to it. The dynamics are compressed big time. The music sounds squished and dull. I thought that the band would have figured out after their last release "Vapor Trails" that high recording levels and mega compression just ruin the sound. It's a real shame as I have been a Rush fan for as long as I can remember.

Paul,

I cannot for the life of me figure out why they continue to record this way. Because it will sound better on the radio or on MP3? Who knows, but it has kept me from buying new releases from what is one of my favorite bands.

I agree, it's a shame.

Ken
 
With recording quality being so bad it's no wonder people prefer to download lower bit rate versions of their favorite music. Why pay $18.00 or so for crap when you can get comparable crap for a fraction of the cost or free?

Paul
 
You guys are crazy! :p:

Yes this album does have a bit of clipping and is a little dense, but it is much better recorded than VT! Dare I say that is sounds fresh, dynamic, open, sharp, clear, detailed and organic? Yes I do! :D

I for one can enjoy it!

10/10 for album content, 8/10 for sound quality.

And as I addressed in a different thread, there is nothing wrong with Rush's recording for the most part on any of their albums save VT. Nothing that is unless you are overly picky and as Rush would say "Seeing the trees instead of the forest." No offense fellow fans, but it is just rock, not classical, what do you expect? Every Rush album is entirely listenable and some are even of very good quality, mastered or not (besides VT). This will sound condenscending and I don't mean it to be, but I really feel sorry for anyone who misses out on any band's great music because he or she is too concerned about an albums lack of perfect pure fidelity sound to be able to enjoy the content. I mean I have even managed to immensely enjoy VT! Imagine that! :rolleyes: But then if the only way I was able to listen to Rush was by having someone put the phone up to their boombox over a long distance crackly connection I would still listen to them! :screwy:

Quit being overly (anal)ytical and just rock out to a great brand new Rush album made 30 odd years after they started that is as good as anything they've ever done! :rockon:

PS: Rush has never been very concerned about getting radio airplay and they don't expect it, and I have some good quality mp3's of SnA that pale compared to the cd version. Wait untill I get the DVD-A version!

PPS: I don't know where you get your cd's, but I paid $10 at Circuit City for this one.
 
Yes, looking at the waveform, it is obviously quite maximized, but I don't find it near as unlistenable as Vapor Trails. Too loud? Turn it down! But...I mean, c'mon, it's rock and roll, it should be loud!
 
I listened to both VT and SnA back to back and it was like night and day. VT is bad, SnA is at least a good recording.

And again Rush has always been known for having well recorded and produced albums, I really don't understand the criticism.

Anyway, SnA is a fantastic album that is among their best and gets better with every listen. I highly recommend getting it: even if you don't like it or can't enjoy it's sound quality for some reason, what the hell, just trade it in to a used cd store, it's only $10-$15 anyway!
 
Permanent Waves said:
Anyway, SnA is a fantastic album that is among their best and gets better with every listen. I highly recommend getting it:

I couldn't agree more. Don't miss out on this superb album :guitar:
 
Don't get me wrong. I've listened to SNA a number of times and really love it. It is fantastic as I've come to know of Rush.

I highly recommend it to any Rush fan.:yes: :yes:

In fact, when I purchased it the clerk at the local Bull Moose store told me it was selling like hotcakes and he asked me if he should get it. I told him yes. If he likes Rush he would not regret it.

As far as VT, yes the recording quality is piss poor to say the least, but it still rocks.

Hopefully this clears my position on this excellent new disc.

BUY IY NOW!!!!

Paul
 
Tripqzon said:
Don't get me wrong. I've listened to SNA a number of times and really love it. It is fantastic as I've come to know of Rush.

I highly recommend it to any Rush fan.:yes: :yes:

In fact, when I purchased it the clerk at the local Bull Moose store told me it was selling like hotcakes and he asked me if he should get it. I told him yes. If he likes Rush he would not regret it.

As far as VT, yes the recording quality is piss poor to say the least, but it still rocks.

Hopefully this clears my position on this excellent new disc.

BUY IY NOW!!!!

Paul

piss poor is a little extreme, me thinks. Ill go one higher than your rating and give it a 7/10 for recording quality. Yes it is a recording meant to play on the airwaves somewhat, but it is definitely better than alot of popular rock recordings lately, such as Velvet Revolver, now that is piss poor ! At least the cymbals on the Snakes and Arrows album sound like cymbals!
 
exracer said:
piss poor is a little extreme, me thinks. Ill go one higher than your rating and give it a 7/10 for recording quality. Yes it is a recording meant to play on the airwaves somewhat, but it is definitely better than alot of popular rock recordings lately, such as Velvet Revolver, now that is piss poor ! At least the cymbals on the Snakes and Arrows album sound like cymbals!

He meant the recording on "VT" which stands for Rush's 2002 release "Vapor Trails" is very poor, and he is totally correct: the recording on that album is bad and demonstrably flawed, and has been shown as such by technical evaluations of it and even the band admitting there were problems in the final product (clipping, distortion, and compression).

In fact, SnA sounds so much better compared to VT it's amazing. I have listened to both shuffled together and it is like night and day. Again, I give SnA an 8/10 for recording and a 10/10 for content. Either way it won't dissapoint, it's a fantastic album, give it a listen! :thmbsp:

PS: I apologize if I gave offense to anyone with my earlier postings here, I was being sarcastic and joking, all in good spirit, but in text form it may not have come off as that.

PPS: SnA has debuted at #3 on the Billboard charts! Not bad for a bunch of mid 50 year olds who have been together for 30+ years! :D

Enjoy this great new album Rush fans and see you on the tour! :D
 
exracer said:
piss poor is a little extreme, me thinks. Ill go one higher than your rating and give it a 7/10 for recording quality. Yes it is a recording meant to play on the airwaves somewhat, but it is definitely better than alot of popular rock recordings lately, such as Velvet Revolver, now that is piss poor ! At least the cymbals on the Snakes and Arrows album sound like cymbals!

I did indeed mean that Vapor Trails is a piss poor recording. And yes there are worse recordings.
As I stated in my previous post I highly recommend SnA to any Rush fan.

Paul
 
Tripqzon said:
I did indeed mean that Vapor Trails is a piss poor recording. And yes there are worse recordings.
As I stated in my previous post I highly recommend SnA to any Rush fan.

Paul

I stand corrected ! yes missed the acronym VT there... never bought vapour trails and sounds like I shouldnt.

I agree with the latest recording, I just love the mix of music from the acoustic to the instrumentals especially the bluesy track 7 !:thmbsp:

lets hope they release another like it in a shorter period of time !
 
exracer said:
I stand corrected ! yes missed the acronym VT there... never bought vapour trails and sounds like I shouldnt.

No, you should buy VT despite its shortcomings, there is some awesome music on that album. Don't miss out :thmbsp:
 
BroonsBane said:
No, you should buy VT despite its shortcomings, there is some awesome music on that album. Don't miss out :thmbsp:

Agreed, VT is a fantastic album that I have throughly enjoyed despite it's bad recording, I think it's one of their best. :thmbsp: If they ever remaster it be sure to pick it up, and you may want to get it used anyway: I mean for $7 or so at a used cd store it would be worth the risk. :yes:

It all comes down to how sensitive you are to picking up on the flaws in the sound of any album from any band. 10 people will listen to the same album and some will hear nothing wrong, others will hear something that is off but not be bothered by it, and others will not even be able to listen to it. Many who have VT can not understand why so many of us think it has a bad recording/production/sound at all. Perhaps their hearing or equipment isn't as sensitive, or perhaps they're just not as picky as those who over analyze their music's recording to death to the point of missing out on the music itself because of some perceived flaw(s) within it of how it strays from how they think it should sound. :D

Don't miss out on any band's album or music you are interested in due to the opinions of others, simply get it and judge for yourself! :thmbsp:
 
exracer said:
I stand corrected ! yes missed the acronym VT there... never bought vapour trails and sounds like I shouldnt.

I agree with the latest recording, I just love the mix of music from the acoustic to the instrumentals especially the bluesy track 7 !:thmbsp:

lets hope they release another like it in a shorter period of time !

I hope you're right and their next release comes sooner than later.

Also, do get Vapor Trails and do judge for yourself.:yes:

Paul
 
True about the chart ratings for Rush being high in the first week partly because of years or decades long fans buying them, but it is still amazing because according to Billboard that is higher than any of their albums from 1984 on except for Roll The Bones (#3) and Counterparts (#2) (both of which were very popular when I was in high school, at least popular for Rush). And SnA debuted at #3, not peaked. VT, in comparison, only reached #6, Test For Echo #5, and even the great Moving Pictures itself only reached #3 (according to what I can find on it).

Also, let's face it, a lot of Rush fans from the 70's and early 80's have ditched them in the last 10, 15, or even 20+ years as they have gotten into their 30's, 40's, and 50's. I can't tell you how many times I've been out wearing a Rush shirt (starting when I was 15, I'm 30 now) and an older guy (looking to be in his 40's or 50's now and in his 30's back when I was 15) has commented on it and said "great band, nice shirt" but when I said thanks and told them about their lastest album and/or tour they almost always are surprised to hear they were still around and had a new album out or where still touring (and this has been my experience since '93 on with the older fans, from, again, their 30's back then to now in their 40's and 50's). I have not met one older fan who has commented on my Rush shirt(s) and then asked if I was going to see them on an upcoming tour or if I had got their latest album. For all they know Rush quit sometime in the late 80's (when they quit Rush upon entering their 30's or 40's) until I mention their newest album/tour. :D

So what I'm saying is that this album did not debut at #3 because of the small amount of Rush fans who have gone out to get every new album right when it came out since the late 70's or early 80's: there simply is not enough of them around anymore (and where their ever?)! Many who were big Rush fans from that time felt upon entering their 30's or 40's that they had "outgrown" or were "too old" for rock n' roll, and others quit Rush when they got into the synths and lighter pop type rock (some stopped with Signals, other's think Power Windows was their last great album, and others still quit them after Roll The Bones as it was too "poppy") as they felt Rush was getting too mellow or soft. Sure there are some hardcore lifetime Rush fans that have gotten every new Rush album and gone to see them on every tour since they have got into them whether that be the 70's, 80's, or 90's (I'm one of those! :thmbsp:) but there are lots of other fans that may have been very into Rush but yet drifted away from them (and the rock n roll of their youth in general) years or decades ago.

This album debuted high and is selling well not just due to older loyal Rush fans going out and buying it, but also the younger newer fans who are just getting into Rush. In fact, many dads who have gotten their sons into Rush are not the ones who have been buying the new Rush albums over the past decade, their sons are! The torch has been passed; Rush has become a generational band! :D

Anyway, that's mho on all of this.

PS: According the interviews I've heard and read, Rush really enjoyed the processes of making this album, maybe more than they ever have in the past, and are very eager to work with the producer Nick R. again. HOWEVER, they will be on tour all this summer and fall until a break for the Holiday season and then will probably do a second leg of the tour, so that takes us into the Spring of '08 and then I'm sure they want some time off to recuperate and be with their families (as due to Neil's losses a decade ago they are being sure not to neglect them in favor of work as they have had to and done in the past). So we are looking at least at the Fall of '08 for any real formal writing sessions to start (unless they write on the road during their touring, something they haven't done in about 20 years, or in their "off" time during the '07 Holiday break and '08 summer break, which I doubt) and possibly not until the spring/summer/fall of '09, or even '10 if they take their time. If I had to bet, I'd say another Rush album wouldn't be out until at the earliest the Fall of '09 and more probably sometime in '10 or even '11. Hell, they could even wait until 2012 just for fun and make it their last album as they will be almost 60 by then. Or perhaps this is their last album. Either way I don't see them touring in their 60's, their music is much too intense and fast paced for that.

Ok, sorry about the long post! Man can I blab on and on about Rush! :blah:
 
Permanent Waves said:
...others will hear something that is off but not be bothered by it, and others will not even be able to listen to it. Many who have VT can not understand why so many of us think it has a bad recording/production/sound at all. Perhaps their hearing or equipment isn't as sensitive, or perhaps they're just not as picky as those who over analyze their music's recording to death to the point of missing out on the music itself because of some perceived flaw(s) within it of how it strays from how they think it should sound.
I suspect many of them are numbed to inferior audio by listening exclusively to inferior audio. Personally, the only inferior audio equipment I own is in my car, and that's only due to the amount of road and engine noise -- I can still hear how bad VT is recorded, so I fall into the camp that finds it unlistenable. I can't listen to it, despite knowing it's good music.

And remastering it won't help -- they peaked out the A/D converters even on the individual tracks, not just at the mastering level. They'd have to re-record it, at this point. Yes, someone very meticulous could go through the entire recording and "clean it up", but (a) we don't really have that sort of technology yet, not at the non-highly-specialized professional level yet, and (b) why? It's their second-to-last album, they should still be able to re-record it.
 
Two quick posts:

Poohsan, you lucky bastard for getting to see them so many times live and be a fan for so long! :D I wish I'd been born earlier, I would have done the same. I'm just glad I got into when I did and have seen them in concert 5 times (6th will be this summer, and hopefully 7th if they come back around in '08). Congrats on being a true and loyal Rush fan for partically their whole career! :thmbsp:

About VT: according to this it HAS been remastered, but will not be released anytime soon: http://www.2112.net/powerwindows/VTnews.htm#remaster

I remember Alex or Ged saying they couldn't or wouldn't go back and re record VT because many parts of the songs were done on the first take from jam sessions and not re recorded later because the first take had some sort of "raw and instaneous essence" in it that could not be produced again. They felt that it was perfect that one and only time and if they tried to reproduce it later (whether now or during the VT recording systems) it would lose the passion it had. So instead we are stuck with a virtually unlistenable cd. :rolleyes:

Anyway, that link contains a lot of info on the whole VT recording/mastering mess.

PS: SnA is #1 on the billboard top rock albums! :thmbsp:
 
Oh man, Rush in the 70's! Hemispheres and A Farewell to Kings I got to see locally, they haven't been back since so I have to travel to see them. St. Paul Minnesota in September!!!
 
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