SAE TWO amp and tuner any good?

MikeCh

Super Member
I've got a buddy who's got an SAE TWO A14 amp and T7 tuner for sale. They aren't in the best of cosmetic shape and he's wanting to get rid of them. He's asking $150 for the amp and $25 for the tuner. Looking on the bay for completed auction prices (to get an idea of value), I don't see one for the A14.

Two questions...are these prices ok? and are these good sounding units?

I have zero experience with SAE thus far.

Thanks,
Mike
 
A little background on SAE. The SAE Two are OK, but not highly regarded, as it SAE was sold to DAK, and production standards were lowered and production went to Asia. I, personally, think the prices you stated are a little high.

High End Series
>
> Mk series: Two Tone style. Black and Champaign/Silver or Black or
> Silver. Rack mount and Analog Meters optional.
>
> *1st generation: 1970-1972
>
> MK2 & 2B, MK3 & 3A, MK4 & MK23
>
> (Very limited sale of the MK23...always in the shop....thing. A
design
> ahead of the technology needed to make it really work.)
>
> *2nd generation: 1973-1975
>
> MK31B, MK3CM, MK4DM Note: MK31B lasted till 1977
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Simple next generation product line taking
> advantage of all the rapid new semiconductor advances that had
ocurred.
> It replace all the older MK series products. SAE also offered
> professional rack mount versions of these amplifiers on special
order.
> (I have yet to find a MK4D in rack mount).
>
>
> *Early 3rd generation: 1975-1976 Replaced MK3CM and expanded.
>
> MK24 & MK25 (The MK25/2500 was what the MK23 was intended to be.)
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Home audio two tone versions of next
generation
> of 00 amps. They did not have the rack mount option of the 00 amps
but
> they kept the new fan cooling system which later would be a bad
thing
> for home audio market.
>
>
> ======
> 00 Series: All black and rack mount & LED or Analog Meter Standard.
> Units 200W/chan and above had fans.
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Simple next generation product line but ONLY
> available in black rack mount profession look which was the "in
thing"
> and a very hot seller in Japan. Also of note is in 1978, SAE
expanded
> into the consumer market with the SAE TWO series clearly saying
this is
> the high end.
>
> *Early 3rd generation lineup: 1975-1976 Replaced MK3CM and
expanded.
>
> 2400 & 2500
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Professional all black versions rack mount
> versions of MK24 and MK25 amps. New fan cooling system.
>
> *Standard 3rd Generation: 1976-1980
>
> 3100 (197:cool:, 2200, 2300(197:cool:, 2400L(1997-), 2600
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Two tone home audio version now completely
> dropped. Pro version only. Fan cooling became a selling problem in
> high end home audio market (2400L, 2600) which would not be
addressed
> until 01 series with its wide scale adoption of the non fan turbo
flow
> heatsink technology introduced with the 2200! The future adoption
was
> foretold by the 3100 and 2300 introduced in 1978. The LED meter
system
> introduced on the 2200 migrated to the 2400 becoming the 2400L. The
> 3100 and 2300 were also introduced with LED meters along with a new
> splashier boxy LED meter scale silkscreen markings that introduce an
> additional new color...blue. The new LED meter marking style
migrated
> to the 2200. Thus you can find two styles of 2200's out in the
market
> place. Later in production, internally most of the amps had their
> transformers upgraded to the more efficient toriodal (round) design.
>
> ======
> 01 Series: All black rack mount, no fan and rectangular LED meters
> only. Except for the SAE logo, text was now in a new font.
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Due to the X series introduction, the 01
series
> became, dispite the fact model 01 series was better than the 00
series
> in many regards, a midrange product line. It held the same pricing
> structure the former "high end" 00 series had. It hard to say if
this
> was 4th generation or not. It circuits were designed in parallel
with
> the X series. 100% turbo flow heatsink design eliminated fans for
home
> audio applications.
>
> *Early 4th generation: 1980 only. Replaced 2400L and 2200.
Transition
> models only.
>
> 2201 & 2401
>
> Marketing/Engineering: The 2401, and later higher power levels,
showed
> that turbo flow heatsink was great for home audio applications, but
> would not cut it under true professional audio (rock concert)
> applications. SAE had to introduce a seperate rack mount fan
cooling
> system accessory.
>
> *Standard 4th generation: 1981-1986 Replaced the entire 00 Series
and is
> black panels and rack mount.
>
> A201, A301, A501 & A1001
>
> Marketing/Engineering: In 1983, SAE broke out into the true PRO
Audio
> market with the P-50, P250 and P500. The P250 and P500 were based
on
> the A501 and A1001. Fan cooling system were not integrated since
there
> were no mechanical changes to the chassis and thus the rack mount
fan
> cooling system used by the 2401 was still offered. The P-50 was
unique
> in that it came with a built in fan and squeezed into a 1U rack
chassis.
>
> =====
> X Series: Silver/metallic gray? Rack mount sharing mechanical's of
01
> series.
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Introduced at the end of the 00 series and
> promoted as being the new ultra high end. This instantly pushed
the 00
> series into midrange status which later was picked up by the 01
series a
> year later. Some say the literature had a hard time explaining,
from a
> technical point of view, how much better the X series was above the
01
> series such that it's higher price could be justified. It also
looked a
> lot like the 01 series except not in black. Not a big seller from
what
> I can figure out dispite it having the longest production life. It
also
> created a 3rd product line for SAE. Potentially very confusion for
a
> market used to only two product lines.
>
> *5th Generation?: 1979-1989
>
> X25A, X15A and X10A
>
>
> =========> Consumer Line (Asian circuit design or influence)
>
> SAE TWO Series: 1878-1984 All black with analog meters when
needed. No
> rack mounting.
>
> A7 and A14
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Address mainstream consumer market place
using
> SAE name as leverage. 100% Asian design.
>
>
> ======
> 02 Series: 1985-1989 All black rack mount with LED meters.
>
> A202, A502
>
> Marketing/Engineering: Replaced SAE TWO series. Lower Cost Asian
version
> of 01 series design. Initially held the consumer space product
line but
> sold side by side with some of the 01 series. It later replaced the
> entire 01 series in 1987 as the last of the 01 series products were
> withdrawn.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Mark Gurries
> Linear Technology
> Power Supply & Battery Charger Applications Engineer/Manager
 
Thanks Mark!! Hope it helped the OP, I sure liked having those tidbits of history for some of my fav's,cleared up some confusion i've had about the 01 and 02 stuff I've had over the years.

Craig
 
Thanks Mark! Wow, sure is some history there with SAE. I think I'll pass on this offering for now.
 
Glad to be of some help. BUT, I am not Mark Gurries... Mark compiled this history, and it's posted on the Yahoo SAE Talk site. I left his name on the bottom to give him the credit. He is the Moderator and a walking compendium of all things SAE.

There are tons of links, photos and technical info, specs and so forth, on SAE GAS and SUMO.

This SAE site is very friendly and is visited by James Bongiorno himself... James will answer questions about his designs.

Check it out!

SAE_Talk-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

Tony.
 
I have an SAE Two A7, which I believe is in the same family as the A14. It was one of my first purchases on my downward slope into vintage, and I like it a lot. It sounds much better (night and day) than the Yamaha HT receiver I replaced with it, and has a good phono stage. I like my Marantz and Sansui units better, but I have nothing bad to say about the SAE TWO whatsoever. It's more of a taste thing...the Marantz and Sansui receivers I have exhibit more of a 'liquid' sound, for lack of a better description. I paid probably around $150 for it, but it was from a shop that checks out everything and gives you a warranty.

I have no experience with their tuners.

hope this helps
john
 
Thanks Mark! Wow, sure is some history there with SAE. I think I'll pass on this offering for now.

If you are interested in SAE, I'd say stay away from the "TWO" line. Parts are non-existant and makes it difficult to repair the TWO series.

The 00 and 01 series are very good. The 2400-2600, 2401 and 2401L, 2200 are all good choices for amps. They continually increase in value for cosmetically clean and properly functioning units.

The SAE MKIV tuner is right up there with the Sequerra, the Marantz and the Mac TOTL tuners as well. Won't be $25 though... :nono: But it's way less expensive than the aformentioned tuners. A real sleeper.

The GOLD colored faceplate SUMO Charlie "The Tuna" have all been personally aligned by James, and after he left SAE, he took his equipment with him, and subsequent Charlies did not get the complex alignment sequence, because Morris Kessler did not want to invest the money for the proper RF tuning gear.
 
I have an SAE Two A7, which I believe is in the same family as the A14. It was one of my first purchases on my downward slope into vintage, and I like it a lot. It sounds much better (night and day) than the Yamaha HT receiver I replaced with it, and has a good phono stage. I like my Marantz and Sansui units better, but I have nothing bad to say about the SAE TWO whatsoever. It's more of a taste thing...the Marantz and Sansui receivers I have exhibit more of a 'liquid' sound, for lack of a better description. I paid probably around $150 for it, but it was from a shop that checks out everything and gives you a warranty.

I have no experience with their tuners.

hope this helps
john

The SAE TWO series is NOT crappy gear; Just really not up to the standards set by the 00 and 01 series. Then there is the replacement part issue.

Here is a post from the SAE site:

>I am relatively new to this site as well but thought I would speak up
>in defense of SAE TWO equipment. My A14 held up for more than 20 years
>before failing, giving me great audio service during that period under
>a wide variety of conditions including driving 4 BA A200 speakers
>while using a DBX dynamic range expander. While I am waiting for my
>unit to be restored I have bought two other A14's to have in reserve.
>The only downside seems to be availability of correct parts. While I
>have never had the pleasure of comparing the TWO series with the 00
>and 01 amps, I can't imagine ever thinking the TWO series as being
>being terribly inferior. Of course that ringing in my ears just might
>hinder my ability to be a good judge of quality fidelity ;-)
>
True. They perform and are as reliable as any other well made Asian
designed and manufactured Audio products. Same consumer league price
and performance wise as Pioneer, Technics, Marantz products in the same
market of that era.

Best Regards,

Mark Gurries

And:

Hi - The SAE 'TWO' equipment was lower end gear for the mass market, not
made by the original SAE company. The gear was designed overseas and
made there.

The SAE '02' gear was designed in the US and made overseas. The '01'
and '00', like the A501 amp or the 2200 amp, are the pieces to get.
Designed and made in the US.

I have most of the '02' series and some of the '00' series. They are
great.

It all depends if you are looking for 'OK' gear (the TWO series) or
'GREAT' gear (almost everything else).
 
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I've had an SAE Two PA10 preamp and an A10 power amp for 20 + years having bought them new in Germany at the PX. Both still work great and the preamp is still my main preamp price on the amp may be a tad high given the cosmetic issues but my amp has performed (and still does) superbly all these years
 
I bought the SAE two amp /preamp when they came out and I love it..still have it ..sounds better than any of the other receivers i have. I have the top of the line sansui and the SAE sounds MUCH better so I sold the sansui. I would recommend one if it is in mint condition... Having said all of that, my goal is to get a top of the line McIntosh..I think that tubes are where its at...also I am looking for a mint condition Akai 510 of 570, the clay in the head has to be intact. Mine is about 85% intact and sounds great but want another one. I just screwed buying one from some guy in germany, lost $400.
 
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Thought I’d bring this thread up-to-date. I Just refurbished an SAE Two system given to me, a T7 rx, and A14 integrated amp. The Tuner has a quality of richness of audio long lost in contemporary tuner’s of less than very extravagant prices. The A14 is just plain pretty and also sounds great. This is great mid-grade classic gear now. The new lack of IC's, post pandemic, has made a new perspective. This is based on the used price points of these, compared to the (downward trajectory) of new Chinese made audio gear of similar prices. Enjoy it while you can.
 
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The Sumo Charlie was a tuner which people seemed to either love or disrespect.

https://www.fmtunerinfo.com/reviewsS-Z.html#sumo

The 101 series was very solidly built; I had the parametric equalizer for a while. I would like to get the T 101 tuner for its aesthetics; it had good specs. When "Vacuum Tube Valley" evaluated tuners, one of their panelist said the 101 was his solid-state favorite. That time at SAE was after James Bongiorno was gone.

Alas James Bongiorno passed away a few years ago.
 
Thanks! Disrespecting this particular tuner means a true “tin ear”. When a tuner displays a lushness from those few FM stations left that broadcast in full bandwidth, less compression, that means the tuner is “open” to that. Dynamically and frequency wise. If you want honky mids, great, your good for other. I’ve just refurbed Drake TR-4 audio section vintage 12ax7s. The quality is obvious (those ears making comments on the T7). Best
 
I got an SAE tuner from the PX in Germany, worked well until a lightning surge took out the regulator ckt, since retired for a Sony 444ES tuner from HfH ReStore.
 
I got an SAE tuner from the PX in Germany, worked well until a lightning surge took out the regulator ckt, since retired for a Sony 444ES tuner from HfH ReStore.
Hey, Pio1980, sorry to hear! I took a direct lighting hit to the house in 2012 (there is no boom ....when you are the center). Arcing from the ham radio antenna grounding system. The IC stuff was toast in the house. The Tube gear survived with some cap replacement. Tube stuff can withstand. Good luck with the Sony 444. Best wishes.
 
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