Sansui SP2500 speakers

Discussion in 'Exclusively Sansui' started by max-greece, Oct 8, 2002.

  1. max-greece

    max-greece Member

    Messages:
    96
    I just picked up a pair of these for free from a familly member and actually prefer them for much of my music over my existing Klipsch Heresy 2's.

    The thing is I cant find out much about them. I know that they are rated at 80 watts RMS, were made between 1974 and 1976 and have 2 horn loaded tweeters, 2 mid-range drivers and a single 12 inch woofer but that is about it.

    Anyone happen to have a sensitivity rating for them? Better yet, an impedance curve, or a copy of the manual?

    Also, the cable attachments are those dreadfull clips. I wanted to replace these with more acceptable binding posts but alas on opening the speakers I find that the whole crossover circuit board is mounted in the way.

    If anyone is interested there are a bunch of pics of the speakers on my photo site at http://groups.msn.com/BatMax1photos/stereo.msnw?Page=2

    Ignore the first pic - that is just the new location of my Heresies (in the study).

    TIA

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  2. Grumpy

    Grumpy Krusty old SOB! Yes, I own Audiokarma Staff Member Admin Sponsor Subscriber

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    Max

    Here are some specs on your 2500's

    Freq Range 50 to 20,000 Hz
    Imp 8 Ohm
    Max watts 80
    Sensitivity 98 dB

    Hope this helps

    Grumpy
     
  3. Tonto Yoder

    Tonto Yoder Former member

    Messages:
    550
    Why the wide difference in opinions on Sansuis??? The other thread on SP-1500's brought out a range from "awful" (my thought of the SP-200) to pretty good.

    Do they vary that much from model to model?? Or do listeners vary that much??

    TY
     
  4. ProAc_Fan

    ProAc_Fan Addicted Member

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    TY maybe the source of amplifiaction makes a difference but I stand by my previous opinion of Sansui speakers. All I can say is I've never heard a pair that I would give a second listen too. And yes, I have heard at least 3 different models of their vintage speakers.

    Mike
     
  5. max-greece

    max-greece Member

    Messages:
    96
    FWIW

    I cant say I had any opinion on Sansui speakers until the weekend - hell - I didnt even know Sansui ever made speakers.

    Having browsed some of the limited info I have found on them I can say that Sansui seemed to have produced innumerable models in a fairly short space of time.

    I conversed with someone over on the Klipsch forums who had the model 2000. From what he describes they are not nearly as well put together as these things are.

    I can also tell you that the last thing I ever expected was to find myself moving my beloved Heresies out of the way to make room for these, but there you have it.

    I am not sure if my sig is working (havent looked at it yet) but if I got the coding right you should be able to click on it to see the surrounding electronics I have (all analogue/ tubes).

    Just as another FWIW type thing my friend who has accuphase electronics with quad 989 speakers (i.e. some seriously respectable kit) loves them - so it is not just me that is barking mad.

    Anyway in about 3 weeks the audiophile club of athens is going to descend on my house for a listening/drinking/eating session and I plan to subject them to the sansui's noise.

    Will be interesting to garner opinions...
     
  6. max-greece

    max-greece Member

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    96
    whoops - almost forgot

    Thanks Grumpy
     

     

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  7. Tonto Yoder

    Tonto Yoder Former member

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    550
    Max,
    do I remember correctly that the Athens Club had a pretty high pedigree of gear???? Seems like I've seen some posts with pics of impressive electronics.

    Generally, the members of this forum seem to have adopted the sensible position that "If you enjoy the sound, more power to you" so you needn't expect anything like ridicule for replacing Klipsch with Sansui. Not everyone will AGREE with your choice, but at least they'll do it politely.

    The particular Sansuis I was given were from someone in the military--he got them in the PX at a supposedly great discount;
    he actually still LIKED them, but that might have been nostalgia as much as the sound.

    TY
     
  8. bully

    bully member

    Messages:
    12,662
    Location:
    Near Lafayette, Indiana
    I know that some people have called the SP-2500 perhaps Sansuis better speaker system.
    They are very efficient, have a pretty smooth sound, and have a well-made cabinet (as I remember 'em). Mid-bass on up, they sounded OK, but the bottom really dropped below about 50 Hz.
    But, like it has been said before (well, by me, anyway ;) ), record albums often didn't have much below 60 Hz then, anyway.
    I preferred the CS-88A and CS-99A from Pioneer.
    But the Sansuis were OK.
    Much the same could be said and I've said it, for the Kenwoods from that same era.

    pete
     
  9. DaveM

    DaveM Active Member

    Messages:
    416
    I stand behind my orignal claim that my Sansui SP-2000's sound very nice when listenting to vinyl, accurate & very detalied but the lower end could use some help.

    However when listening to the radio they sound horrid, colored and cheap boxy sounding. Like it's a totally different speaker. Jeckyl & Hyde if you will.

    Of course I don't use these in my main system but I do hook them up every now and then to show them off, they really do sound good for spinning vinyl. I kid you not.

    Dave
     
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  10. THOR

    THOR Fearless Prophet

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    9,651
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    Good for you Max, see Pro Ac would never accept any pair of speakers based upon how they sound to him - he goes by their reputation so you will never see him have anything but contempt for lowly Sansui speakers, CV's too for that matter ;) :D ;)
     
  11. BeatleFred

    BeatleFred Super Member

    Messages:
    2,643
    Location:
    New York
    Being the Huge Sansui enthusiast that I am, I can tell you that Loudspeakers were not Sansui's strongpoint in the way that their amps, receivers and tuners were. Nothing unusual about that- just like Fender is known for their classic electric guitars and Martin for their acoustics- but not vice versa. Sansui made just about every type of hi fi type of product you can think of- cassette decks, open reels, turntables, etc..., so realistically I dont expect everything they made to be perfect. Sansui had their roots early on in making transformers and so they developed into a company whose forte' was in the excellent design of their amplifiers.

    Being the Sansui enthusiast I am, I of course did obtain a pair of their speakers to see how they'd sound a few years ago, which was the model SP-X8700 from 1979. The many large drivers were impressive as was the build quality. As for the actual sound, well..... not exactly my cup of tea. They, like most Sansui speakers are very efficient- thus not much amp power needed to hear music played Loud thru them. But in terms of sound quality- they seemed a bit tinny-sounding to me and no sense of any Soundstage, imaging etc... Huge 17" woofers- but so what if nothing special going on inthe bass dept anyway.

    However.... I have read comments by other people Online (Owner reviews at www.audioreview.com) who do like the sound of Sansui speakers. And thats fine. Whats important is how they sound to your ears-> and if you like them- I'm glad to hear it. Certainly cant beat the price you got them for:) Even in the other post about the Sansui speakers- worth a try for $65, I think. If it doesnt work out, $65 isnt a huge loss and I'm sure they could easily be resold Online- maybe for even more $$ to another Sansui spkr enthusiast.

    An online Sansui contact I have, and who did work as a Parts distributor for them back in the 1970's- agrees with my opinion on their speakers- SP-X8700's and most others -good for the loud disco music at the time but not in any way audiophile quality. He said of all the speakers Sansui made, the best model (and rarely seen) is the SP-L800 and 700's.
     

     

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  12. max-greece

    max-greece Member

    Messages:
    96
    Some observations (far too long - sorry)

    Interesting to read other's opinions on the Sansuis - especially Beetles as he had a pair.

    From what I understand the pair in question were http://www.retroaudio.ru/sansui/speak/SP-X8700.shtml

    The first thing I noticed about that particular model is that it is an asymetric design as opposed to the symetrical layout of my speakers.

    It has been my experience that asymetric designs often have serious soundstaging / imaging problems and therefore Beetle's observations do not surprise me in the least.

    These observations do not apply in my setup. One of the biggest changes in my system has been the improvment in the soundstage, not in terms of width, but in terms of depth. This is coupled with the second biggest change - image. The image cast by the Sansui's is far larger, more detailed and more credible than that of the Heresies.

    I should point out at this stage that I am a soundstage and imaging nut (if it wasnt already obvious).

    As an aside I would like to explain my logic when evaluating speakers that may help to explain where I am coming from.

    I always start from a simple premise. That is that almost any speaker can be made to sound good if it is mated to the proper front end and in a decent acoustic space.

    Acoustically I have the advantage over almost all of my fellow audiophiles (here in Greece) in that (out of pure luck) my living room has simply superb acoustics.

    I therefore happily take room acoustics out of the equation when evaluating components at home.

    That leaves the front end. To me evaluating a speaker is all about its marriage to the other components. My existing system was built around the Heresies. Much as I love the Heresy's I am the first to admit that they are a deeply flawed design.

    This seemingly was the opinion of PWK when he built them (the name is no accident and comes from the fact that he was forced to use a woofer for the bass as opposed to the horn loaded bass driver found in the other speakers in the heritage range).

    Couple this with the limited internal space available in such a small box, along with the sealed design and you have some fairly severe limitations.

    The other major feature of the Heresy is also problematic. The horn loaded drivers used for both the tweeter and the mid range driver. These are what gives the Heresy that unique Klipsch sound, but concurrently, and in common with the rest of the Klipsch speakers, they can sound brutally hard in the wrong environment.

    The cures for these ills are normally stated simply as using a tube front end to tame the highs and smooth out the mids. Couple this to a vinyl source and the result is as pleasant and relaxing a sound as it is possible to get out of Heritage speakers, if you position the speakers correctly.

    When I talk about positioning I am refering not only to their relative positions in 2 dimensions but I am including height in the equation.

    For me horn loaded speakers do not work well if the tweeter is at ear level (as opposed to other tweeter designs such as silk domes for example where that is the ideal level). Most people therefore mount the Heresies on low bases angled upwards. I have done the opposite. In my setup it is the woofer that is at ear height and I sit below the tweeter.

    This carries the major advantage of maximizing the direct bass effect (Heresies are weak in bass anyway) whilst eliminating the problems of bass reflections from the solid floor in my room.

    Of course to further boost the bass I use the one major leap forward in home music systems, a subwoofer - which, in my case is the REL Strata 3.

    The REL is the most musical sub I managed to find and integrates so well with the Heresies you dont know it is there until you switch it off.

    Now enter the Sansui's:

    On the face of it there are distinct similarities between the Sansui SP2500 and the Heresy. They have similar internal volumes, use a 12 inch woofer and have horn loaded tweeters. The mid range is 2 paper cones verses a single horn loaded driver.

    Sensitivity is similar at 98 db/w/m for the Sansui and 96 db/w/m for the Heresy. Both speakers are rated at 50 - 20,000 Hz.

    After a few days of listening to the Sansui's (which are actually running in - they have been used that little) I have found the following:

    1. They have a sweeter softer sound that is less obviously flavoured than the Heresies.
    2. They have slightly less impact (although that seems to be changing as they run in and I optimize things around them better).
    3. They have a larger face and more drivers firing out which creates simply more soundstage and a larger image when angled correctly.
    4. They are less tiring to listen to.
    5. They, in common with the Heresy, really benefit from tubes.
    6. The bass from the speaker is slightly muddier than the Heresy's (ported drivers usually are) but hits harder as the spl climbs.
    7. Their flaws are similar enough to the Heresy to benefit from similar vertical positioning and demand the use of a good sub.

    Someone else commented here that Sansuis work well with vinyl and I agree entriely (although I have not tried them with other sources).

    Overall I would say that you can probably get far more out of these speakers today than you could when they were made. The introduction of the sub-woofer in addition to the improvements in both tube amp designs (if not in tubes themselves) and in TT design really makes them shine like a new pin.

    FWIW - these go for ludicrously small amounts of money on ebay (at time of writing I saw 2 - one at $20 and one at $10) and are well worth the investment if you fancy a play.

    Sorry for the verbose reply - as usual I had too much to say for myself.
     
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  13. bully

    bully member

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    Location:
    Near Lafayette, Indiana
    Nah, excellent post, Max, and it makes the points about the Sansui 2500 I remember (a long time ago, admittedly) hearing.
    I do remember one guy had all Sansui gear. Early-70s, and no, I cannot recall the model receiver, he got it while in Vietnam, and it was most likely the TOTL available at that time (69-71). That set was tt, receiver, and the SP-2500. Typical college kid apartment in an older frame/lath house. Speakers were on the floor.
    Hmmm, I wonder if he got the speakers later. Ah, those days are so long ago ...
     
  14. max-greece

    max-greece Member

    Messages:
    96
    Thanks Bully

    I was hoping there would have been more of a response to my last entry. Must be sufficient food for thought there I would have thought....

    Ah well - back to brevity in posts from now on!!

    Thanks again
     
  15. pdxotica

    pdxotica Member

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    77
    Location:
    The Rose City, Portland Oregon
    I appreciate the comments, years later!

    Looking at a pair here for 40, need to go take a listen.

    :music:
     
  16. secretsenor

    secretsenor Active Member

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    179
    Location:
    Newcastle, Australia
    Hmmm... This would say more about the radio wouldn't it?

    Why is this so?
     

     

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  17. ferninando

    ferninando Lunatic Member

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    read the sp2500 spec sheet on sansui appreciation website
     
  18. bluesky

    bluesky Addicted Member

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    7,418
    I know many people don't like Sansui speakers. I really have no idea why. My pair of SP-2000s sound pretty darn good by any measure. Origional caps and I wouldn't even dream of taking the backs off to do anything. They sound great as is!! No reason to mess with em. If it ain't broke I ain't fixing it. They sound like the way they are suppose to sound, sure seems so anyway. Sure, I know, they aren't 2008 'state of the art' audiophile $5000 plus speakers, they are 38 years old and cost under $100. Plus shipping, and they weigh a ton. I could get a more expensive speakers if I wanted to, no problem. But why?? SP-2000s sound great. I am quite pleased with them. & it's the "Sound of Sansui", the unmistakable Sansui sound, the sound I have loved since 1969. It's nice! I guess I got a lucky pair.

    If your not into the ported speakers, try the AS (acoustic suspension) line, a totally different sound and really quite nice also, even better in it's own way than the SP series (speaker ported). They sound unbelievable. 40W. A tweeter and woofer. When you sit back and really listen to them your mind thinks just "wow".

    I sincerely hope you enjoy your SP-2500s as much as I enjoy mine!! :thmbsp:

    One other thing...they sound great with CDs too! Outstanding.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2012
  19. Morden2004

    Morden2004 Relaxin'

    Messages:
    5,899
    Location:
    Morden, Nova Scotia
    Always a personal choice

    I never criticize a members speaker choice because I can't live inside his/her head and I don't own their ears. :D

    Clearly, we can identify the metrics with test equipment, but that never tells the whole story. My own personal experience is that several times I have heard speakers with impecable specs which sounded like shit (to me) and some that looked like they were designed by a grade school science class but which sounded terrific.

    Go figure?

    So, how can anyone make reasonable suggestions vis-a-vis speaker selections?

    Paul
     
  20. pmsummer

    pmsummer simul justus et peccator

    [​IMG]

    I had some SP-300s that I gave to my son-in-law (who loves horns). A very nice speaker. Smooth. Heavy.
     

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