Since vinyl has made a comeback, what about laserdiscs?

[zunde]

I've heard a lot about part of the reason for the vinyl craze being more than just the nostalgic sound of a record- it was also about the look of LP jackets and their cover art, the tactile feel of holding a record, and the idea that everything just seems more "musical" about it. All of this also lends itself to laserdisc IMO. LD jackets were beautiful to look at, since the art, photography, film info, etc was not scaled down to the point you'd need a magnifying glass. Plus a collection of laserdiscs on your shelf just looks way more awesome than those tiny DVD/ BR cases. Holding a big glossy LD and loading it into a player also seemed well, more conducive to my moviegoing experience than the 12cm discs we got with the "everything has to be smaller and more portable!" tech philosophy of the 90s and 00s.
The new vinyl is marketed with 180g and remastering hype. Why can't laserdiscs come back with the look and size, but with 4k UHD quality? Sure unlike vinyl the tech would have to change from analog based to digital, but so what. I can't imagine that would be too tough. If you still had some of those older laserdiscs, just incorprorate the old analog tech into the new players. Just like new USB turntables have done. Is there really a reason the outdated LD technology has to remain outdated? Keep the look and feel that made them so popular amongst videophiles back in the day, but give them a reason to shine again, just like vinyl.

 

[Tom Brennan]

LDs were expensive and cumbersome and useful only because at the time they had the best picture. I see no need for something as good as a blu-ray disc but many times larger and more expensive.

 

[blhagstrom]

LD is dead.
Just ambers of the fire remain.
As the last few working players die, so will all reason to keep the discs.

I play with them occasionally but without some form of 5.1, they just have no experience to them.

I’ve had TOTL, one was even a mint condition high end demo or display unit and the video quality is still less than a good DVD let alone Blu-ray.

The last of the repair knowledge is fading and there is no reason to keep it alive.

Like Edison wax cylinders, the tech to produce entertainment on demand has moved on.

LP was the best common available medium of recording distribution for analog, widely still available and the device for playback (turntable) is still widely available and common and can be repaired by handy people without specialized skills or tools.

LD is a dead end.

 

[zunde]

LDs were expensive and cumbersome and useful only because at the time they had the best picture. I see no need for something as good as a blu-ray disc but many times larger and more expensive.

View attachment 1083252

"Oh, laserdiscs were way too cumbersome!" Guess what, you just described vinyl compared to CD. You still have to get up and flip a vinyl album, that's not cumbesome? Yet its comeback proves people welcome that inconvenience. Oh and BTW, LD actually did away with that burden eons ago. "Oh LD was only useful because it had the best picture!" Guess what, CD technically had the best sound, and still does. Yet the vinyl comeback if nothing else proves that it's not always about what's technically more proficient. "Many times larger and more expensive!" You just described VINYL today. Been to Barnes and Noble and priced a new 180g remastered vinyl release recently? Thanks for a response that actually made all my points for me.

LD is dead.
Just ambers of the fire remain.
As the last few working players die, so will all reason to keep the discs.

I play with them occasionally but without some form of 5.1, they just have no experience to them.

I’ve had TOTL, one was even a mint condition high end demo or display unit and the video quality is still less than a good DVD let alone Blu-ray.

The last of the repair knowledge is fading and there is no reason to keep it alive.

Like Edison wax cylinders, the tech to produce entertainment on demand has moved on.

LP was the best common available medium of recording distribution for analog, widely still available and the device for playback (turntable) is still widely available and common and can be repaired by handy people without specialized skills or tools.

LD is a dead end.

"Without some form of 5.1??" You DO realize that LD was the first format to incorporate 5.1 channel Dolby Digital sound don't you??! And DTS??
"Video quality is less that BluRay." OMG. Did you just completely miss one of my main vital points about a LD comeback being able to incorporate the new HD, even 4K UHD technology??

Now, I get both of your points about vinyl being the best medium available for analog sound-- which is a big part of what people missed about it-- and why it seems questionable that anyone would want to handle a larger heavier disc for the same video quality as we get on 4K blu ray today. But again it's not all about the tech. A lot of what people ALSO missed about vinyl was the packaging: the jacket and liner artwork, the tactility of holding a record album, and the benefit of not having to scale down the accompanying photos, art, and liner notes on the insert slips to the size of a pea. I guess maybe there are people who framed CD insert slips and hung them on their walls but I've never seen it. Same holds true for LD. As I stated in my previous post, and I'll state again, it's not always about the actual A/V-- many times it's about the presentation. LD boxed sets were a thing of beauty. True booklets (and in some cases, actual books-- Star Wars Definitive Collection anyone?) could be incorporated into the packaging. Actual poster-size posters as well. Jacket cover artwork and/ or graphics that actually catch your eye (much like vinyl), not some tiny cover SLIP that you shrug off as you open a plastic case.

Your responses really disappoint me. They're so shortsighted. If you can't appreciate that media is in many ways more than just the info you're pulling off a disc, and that media has always been presented better in the larger formats, and that that should be part of the visceral experience of owning music and video, then you're in real trouble.

 

[Bill Ferris]

"Oh, laserdiscs were way too cumbersome!" Guess what, you just described vinyl compared to CD. You still have to get up and flip a vinyl album, that's not cumbesome? Yet its comeback proves people welcome that inconvenience. Oh and BTW, LD actually did away with that burden eons ago. "Oh LD was only useful because it had the best picture!" Guess what, CD technically had the best sound, and still does. Yet the vinyl comeback if nothing else proves that it's not always about what's technically more proficient. "Many times larger and more expensive!" You just described VINYL today. Been to Barnes and Noble and priced a new 180g remastered vinyl release recently? Thanks for a response that actually made all my points for me.





"Without some form of 5.1??" You DO realize that LD was the first format to incorporate 5.1 channel Dolby Digital sound don't you??! And DTS??
"Video quality is less that BluRay." OMG. Did you just completely miss one of my main vital points about a LD comeback being able to incorporate the new HD, even 4K UHD technology??

Now, I get both of your points about vinyl being the best medium available for analog sound-- which is a big part of what people missed about it-- and why it seems questionable that anyone would want to handle a larger heavier disc for the same video quality as we get on 4K blu ray today. But again it's not all about the tech. A lot of what people ALSO missed about vinyl was the packaging: the jacket and liner artwork, the tactility of holding a record album, and the benefit of not having to scale down the accompanying photos, art, and liner notes on the insert slips to the size of a pea. I guess maybe there are people who framed CD insert slips and hung them on their walls but I've never seen it. Same holds true for LD. As I stated in my previous post, and I'll state again, it's not always about the actual A/V-- many times it's about the presentation. LD boxed sets were a thing of beauty. True booklets (and in some cases, actual books-- Star Wars Definitive Collection anyone?) could be incorporated into the packaging. Actual poster-size posters as well. Jacket cover artwork and/ or graphics that actually catch your eye (much like vinyl), not some tiny cover SLIP that you shrug off as you open a plastic case.

Your responses really disappoint me. They're so shortsighted. If you can't appreciate that media is in many ways more than just the info you're pulling off a disc, and that media has always been presented better in the larger formats, and that that should be part of the visceral experience of owning music and video, then you're in real trouble.

+

 

[blhagstrom]

"Oh, laserdiscs were way too cumbersome!" Guess what, you just described vinyl compared to CD. You still have to get up and flip a vinyl album, that's not cumbesome? Yet its comeback proves people welcome that inconvenience. Oh and BTW, LD actually did away with that burden eons ago. "Oh LD was only useful because it had the best picture!" Guess what, CD technically had the best sound, and still does. Yet the vinyl comeback if nothing else proves that it's not always about what's technically more proficient. "Many times larger and more expensive!" You just described VINYL today. Been to Barnes and Noble and priced a new 180g remastered vinyl release recently? Thanks for a response that actually made all my points for me.





"Without some form of 5.1??" You DO realize that LD was the first format to incorporate 5.1 channel Dolby Digital sound don't you??! And DTS??
"Video quality is less that BluRay." OMG. Did you just completely miss one of my main vital points about a LD comeback being able to incorporate the new HD, even 4K UHD technology??

Now, I get both of your points about vinyl being the best medium available for analog sound-- which is a big part of what people missed about it-- and why it seems questionable that anyone would want to handle a larger heavier disc for the same video quality as we get on 4K blu ray today. But again it's not all about the tech. A lot of what people ALSO missed about vinyl was the packaging: the jacket and liner artwork, the tactility of holding a record album, and the benefit of not having to scale down the accompanying photos, art, and liner notes on the insert slips to the size of a pea. I guess maybe there are people who framed CD insert slips and hung them on their walls but I've never seen it. Same holds true for LD. As I stated in my previous post, and I'll state again, it's not always about the actual A/V-- many times it's about the presentation. LD boxed sets were a thing of beauty. True booklets (and in some cases, actual books-- Star Wars Definitive Collection anyone?) could be incorporated into the packaging. Actual poster-size posters as well. Jacket cover artwork and/ or graphics that actually catch your eye (much like vinyl), not some tiny cover SLIP that you shrug off as you open a plastic case.

Your responses really disappoint me. They're so shortsighted. If you can't appreciate that media is in many ways more than just the info you're pulling off a disc, and that media has always been presented better in the larger formats, and that that should be part of the visceral experience of owning music and video, then you're in real trouble.

AH! Now i see your main point.

I agree the large packaging was part of the experience.
100%.


What I thought you meant.

"Will (the old) LD players and discs do a resurgence?"

As in should we collect and hoard the players and discs because the will become popular and desirable again? And there will be a way to repair those machines?

No.


You really mean "Will big plastic discs and large electronic machines to play those discs to watch high quality movies become a product?"

Right?

No.


If you missed it, the world (US) went digital.
The human desire for instant gratification, coupled with the Internet has allowed for a way to stream movies on demand.
Physical medium is so, like, dinosaur man.
From what I've seen of a majority of the snowflakes, there is no interest in collecting or keeping things.
Use once and move on.
No respect for or nostalgia for yesterday, or the things and people from then.

Book stores are dead/dying.
Music stores are going/gone.
Movie rental is going/gone.
Cable TV is dying.

Its all internet now.

People are on their smart phones all day long.
Can't even stop to drive.

Product makers are targeting !/$. ROI.
A hard fact about business is it only exists to make as much profit as fast and cheap as possible.
If crap sells, and it does, then how fast can we turn out mountains of shit.

If you look to the history of companies that tried to be great in the AV world over the last 20 years, you will find a lot of failures and dead bodies.

Lexicon?
California Audio Labs?

 

[Bob]

the very first question to ask is whether there are any manufacturers of LDs? as it is, even
the SACD only has 3 factories (left?) in the world.

if there are, is someone willing to redesign the protocols and formats to use up the real estate
of the LD, otherwise, it wouldn't fill the disk. or add all the various formats from VCD onwards,
and add all those 4K/8K/16K/DTS/MQA/2019-flavors. and then retrofit all those to the older
players and convince someone to build new players BUT at less than 10K per unit.
(maybe some Chinese manufacturer: they created the VCD while the first world spent billions
on Betamax and VHS, and at one time, created their own "DVD" standard that never caught on)

here's an idea for you (could be that mission changing future). design a thin plastic carrier that
a CD/DVD/DVD-A/Blu-ray/SACD/2019-new-format will fit in, patent it (soon - real soon to capture
prior-art credentials), develop prototype and sell to all labels. it will be:

12" album complete with great front graphics, perhaps even a centerfold, and back written story
and a 12" inch insert that holds the CD-sized media

revolution, and could be that very needed idea to revive CD/SACD/DVD/Blu-ray sales.

 

[Tom Brennan]

Your responses really disappoint me. They're so shortsighted. If you can't appreciate that media is in many ways more than just the info you're pulling off a disc, and that media has always been presented better in the larger formats, and that that should be part of the visceral experience of owning music and video, then you're in real trouble.

I’m not in trouble of any type because I don’t share your fey taste for obsolete media and features unnecessary to do a job.

You know what, when I got rid of the about 20 feet of LDs I once owned I had trouble even giving the goddam things anyway, even such supposedly desirable discs like the Star Wars “Face” set, the Criterion version of Zulu and the restored version of the Wayneamo. And in Chicago, a large market. So I think your putting value on something that evidently has little or no value is tilting at windmills.

 

[Bob]

DSD.

could be like 30ips master tapes. kept by owners and released over and over again
(LP, MFSL-LP, cassette, R2R, DVD-a, SACD,2020-format) or in plain-speak, the beatles
in US-labels, Parlophone, mono and stereo, blue box, remastered, anniversary, etc editions.

SACD is supported by several markets but not the US. we are far past buying media - streaming
is king - video, audio, etc.

so SACD via DSD only if media sales increase.

 

[zunde]

You really mean "Will big plastic discs and large electronic machines to play those discs to watch high quality movies become a product?"

Right?

No.

Yet, it happened with vinyl.

If you missed it, the world (US) went digital.

And then, went back to analog based vinyl.

 

[zunde]

I’m not in trouble of any type because I don’t share your fey taste for obsolete media and features unnecessary to do a job.

You know what, when I got rid of the about 20 feet of LDs I once owned I had trouble even giving the goddam things anyway, even such supposedly desirable discs like the Star Wars “Face” set, the Criterion version of Zulu and the restored version of the Wayneamo. And in Chicago, a large market. So I think your putting value on something that evidently has little or no value is tilting at windmills.

And when I got rid of all my vinyl, back in the early 90s, it was an obsolete medium that had little to no interest anymore, and I got pennies on the dollar for anything I had.. And then it came back.

You also keep leaving out the "discs can be updated to reflect the newer technology" part.

Shortsighted.

 

[Tom Brennan]

And when I got rid of all my vinyl, back in the early 90s, it was an obsolete medium that had little to no interest anymore, and I got pennies on the dollar for anything I had.. And then it came back.

You also keep leaving out the "discs can be updated to reflect the newer technology" part.

Shortsighted.

Records were a mass medium, LDs weren’t. Don’t expect a medium to be bigger as nostalgia then it was in the first place, even records didn’t do that. Especially since so few people have any experience with LDs to be nostalgic about.

Updating LDs to new technology, when smaller devices do the job as well, is an unlikely event.

A person needn’t see merit in every cockamamie notion that’s floated to be open minded. If your notion goes anywhere I’ll allow to being shortsighted. I doubt I’ll have to.

 

[zunde]

Records were a mass medium, LDs weren’t. Don’t expect a medium to be bigger as nostalgia then it was in the first place, even records didn’t do that. Especially since so few people have any experience with LDs to be nostalgic about.

Updating LDs to new technology, when smaller devices do the job as well, is an unlikely event.

A person needn’t see merit in every cockamamie notion that’s floated to be open minded. If your notion goes anywhere I’ll allow to being shortsighted. I doubt I’ll have to.

I've read some of your other posts on here, and I get that you're a cold, uncreative person who lets simplicity drive your thoughts and actions. That kind of attitude = shortsighted. You're a K-car person in a Tesla world.

 

[blhagstrom]

Yet, it happened with vinyl.



And then, went back to analog based vinyl.

No, not really.
It's a niche market.
And it wasn't re-engineered for a new format.
And it never really completely died.

And vinyl is not a huge thing now.
I still throw away tons of vinyl and turntables.
The good tables I do bother trying to flip are damn near give away.


You seem to be convinced you are onto an insight about the future of LD.
So be it.

I will not be investing in any company bringing out "new and improved laser disc tech".

 

[MannyE]

To answer the question...

No.

 

[MannyE]

I've heard a lot about part of the reason for the vinyl craze being more than just the nostalgic sound of a record- it was also about the look of LP jackets and their cover art, the tactile feel of holding a record, and the idea that everything just seems more "musical" about it. All of this also lends itself to laserdisc IMO. LD jackets were beautiful to look at, since the art, photography, film info, etc was not scaled down to the point you'd need a magnifying glass. Plus a collection of laserdiscs on your shelf just looks way more awesome than those tiny DVD/ BR cases. Holding a big glossy LD and loading it into a player also seemed well, more conducive to my moviegoing experience than the 12cm discs we got with the "everything has to be smaller and more portable!" tech philosophy of the 90s and 00s.
The new vinyl is marketed with 180g and remastering hype. Why can't laserdiscs come back with the look and size, but with 4k UHD quality? Sure unlike vinyl the tech would have to change from analog based to digital, but so what. I can't imagine that would be too tough. If you still had some of those older laserdiscs, just incorprorate the old analog tech into the new players. Just like new USB turntables have done. Is there really a reason the outdated LD technology has to remain outdated? Keep the look and feel that made them so popular amongst videophiles back in the day, but give them a reason to shine again, just like vinyl.

Because they don't need a huge disc the size of a vinyl record and a $$$$ player to distribute amazing sound and video. It's like wishing someone brought back mechanical printers if they could make the resolution higher.

 

[zunde]

Because they don't need a huge disc the size of a vinyl record and a $$$$ player to distribute amazing sound and video. It's like wishing someone brought back mechanical printers if they could make the resolution higher.

There wasn't ever an artistic creativity associated with packaging printers.

That's why the response above about keeping the current disc format but improving the presentation it comes in might be the best response in this thread. It's certainly the only open-minded one.

 

[zunde]

No, not really.

And vinyl is not a huge thing now.
.

Tell that to Barnes and Noble who has completely disposed of their in-store CD sales in favor of vinyl.

 

[Tom Brennan]

I've read some of your other posts on here, and I get that you're a cold, uncreative person who lets simplicity drive your thoughts and actions. That kind of attitude = shortsighted. You're a K-car person in a Tesla world.

No, more a Crown Vic person.

Odd of you to equate a nostalgic regard for obsolete at worst and unnecessary at best technology with Tesla.

 

[zunde]

Odd of you to equate a nostalgic regard for obsolete at worst and unnecessary at best technology with Tesla.

Really? How so? Because Musk took a failed, obsolete technology (electric cars, tried way back in the early 20th century and again--slightly- with the EV-1) that the industry "experts" said would never fly, applied new ideas and strategies, and made it work.

And anyway, my comment wasn't as much about the LD tech as it was about your shortsightedness. Every single post you make furthers my point for me. It's crazy.