Some Empire Turntable History
- Thread starter empirelvr
- Start date
Maraakate
Member
It appears so. I don't see any for sale on ebay.
That design gave me an idea though. I could make a thin flat piece of metal in the shop, drill the appropriate holes and make sure it extends outward in front of the arm and drill a hole in that area to hold the brush and tap the plastic for the grooves so I could experiment with different brushes and also weigh them on the paint mixer (which is calibrated to 0.001 gram) so I would know how much to offset the counterweight adjustment.
If that way works properly then it would allow me to add it between the cart and sled and if I decide to retip it then a warranty won't be void on taking it back. That's assuming I like the cart and it can be dialed in properly with the setup I have.
Maraakate
Member
I still haven't gotten around to experimenting with the antiskate addition. But, I see that my sony tonearm on the PS-8750 uses a similar design with a wormed gear that you spin the weight on to find the proper balance. I could also check the weight of that component and report back if anyone is interested.
Grainger49
Old Fart
I made my first arm damper from a paper clip bent into a 90 degree angle which was epoxied to the back of the arm, a parts box filled with STP and a couple of pieces of broken tape measure glued to the far end of the paper clip. That is very thin metal you might already have. The horizontal and vertical pieces were glued to damp rapid horizontal and vertical motion.
Sometimes - I have a couple that are NOS because I collect all things DiscWasher so I pay attention to when these come up on the auction site. Sometimes there are multiple units for sale at the same time and at other times none... timing.
Maraakate
Member
Denon DL-110 arriving today; but in the mean time I was looking at other cartridge reviews and someone has mentioned using a Dynavector 10X5 successfully in an Empire 398 according to the review. He doesn't mention a tonearm upgrade so I'm assuming it was a stock setup: http://www.needledoctor.com/Dynavector-10X5-Cartridge
Way out of my price range at this current stage of my life; but maybe in a few years when it's time to upgrade I'll see if it's a possibility.
The specs seem to be similar to the DL-110 but this cart does weight about 3 grams more than the Dynavector. The DL-110 is supposed to come with a weight for the headshell; but I'm not sure how much extra weight it adds.
Way out of my price range at this current stage of my life; but maybe in a few years when it's time to upgrade I'll see if it's a possibility.
The specs seem to be similar to the DL-110 but this cart does weight about 3 grams more than the Dynavector. The DL-110 is supposed to come with a weight for the headshell; but I'm not sure how much extra weight it adds.
Maraakate
Member
Okay. Got the DL-110 hooked up and it does at least track OK with the Empire. I haven't received the test record yet to test the resonance.
I found that setting the weight closer to 2.1grams would actual cause the needle to skip the opening lead in groove, so it's closer to 1.9grams. Kind of surprised that small margin made that much of a difference.
I heard some people call these cartridges very bright; but I haven't noticed that. I think it's a little more muted compared to the Stanton 500 V3 I was using. It also seems to be a little lacking in bass. However, I haven't played around with adjusting the arm height. With the weight spacer included it's about the same angle as the Stanton when checking it at eye level.
In any case, I'm still pretty impressed. It really does help minimize occasional surface noise and moderately noisey records. If you have a record that's way past it's prime it doesn't appear to help that very much though. Sibilance issues I had on my previous mentioned LPs are non-existant, except that Helium LP. It's nowhere near as bad as it was before; but it's still a bit there. However, I listened to the CD version and it exists there too. So, chalk that one up to overzealous mastering.
The output is a bit lower than the Stanton, but not a whole lot.
I hear a lot of people saying it has good imaging, and other various audiophile terms but I haven't really noticed anything special like that. I am very impressed in it's job of minimizing the surface noise and attacking sibilance and IGD.
When I get the test record I'll report back on the resonance and hopefully we can add this one to a list of potential carts to recommend without too much fooling around to make it work.
I found that setting the weight closer to 2.1grams would actual cause the needle to skip the opening lead in groove, so it's closer to 1.9grams. Kind of surprised that small margin made that much of a difference.
I heard some people call these cartridges very bright; but I haven't noticed that. I think it's a little more muted compared to the Stanton 500 V3 I was using. It also seems to be a little lacking in bass. However, I haven't played around with adjusting the arm height. With the weight spacer included it's about the same angle as the Stanton when checking it at eye level.
In any case, I'm still pretty impressed. It really does help minimize occasional surface noise and moderately noisey records. If you have a record that's way past it's prime it doesn't appear to help that very much though. Sibilance issues I had on my previous mentioned LPs are non-existant, except that Helium LP. It's nowhere near as bad as it was before; but it's still a bit there. However, I listened to the CD version and it exists there too. So, chalk that one up to overzealous mastering.
The output is a bit lower than the Stanton, but not a whole lot.
I hear a lot of people saying it has good imaging, and other various audiophile terms but I haven't really noticed anything special like that. I am very impressed in it's job of minimizing the surface noise and attacking sibilance and IGD.
When I get the test record I'll report back on the resonance and hopefully we can add this one to a list of potential carts to recommend without too much fooling around to make it work.
Maraakate
Member
As requested, here is a picture of the 980 arm with the rare factory anti-skate assembly. (FYI, the rod on the bearing assembly housing is a bit skewed. It should be pointing straight to the back in the 12:00 position, not the 11:00 position it appears to be in this picture.)
Was concerned about the skating with the Denon so I did a very very crude prototype out of a hex key, some tape, a paper clip, radio dial string and an antiskate weight from another turntable.
I tested it out with a LaserDisc that I had that has laser rot so at least now it's good for something. Took a lot of experimenting to get it pretty good. The weight I'm using is way too heavy as I had to bend the paper clip to get it hanging fairly high as you can see.
I have a 98 arm I scavenged for the counterweight so I can drill that out to see how far down I can go to tap a thread and then make it presentable. Currently just using really ridiculously strong tape.
Yes and no. The 108 was always known as a cartridge, it's people's insistence that it was a turntable model number as well that has gummed up the Empire info pool for too many years.
Maraakate is correct: the DiscTracker will not work on the Empire. It's meant to mount only on a "normal" headshell from the top, which isn't possible with any Empire tonearm.
Supposedly the DiscTracker didn't seem to work as it should anyway. Contemporary magazine reviews and other "chatter" through the years deemed it a failure at it's intended purpose. (At least -I- have never heard anyone have good things to say about it.) Which is a real shame, the need for such a product certainly was/is there.
Maraakate
Member
I have noticed with the Denon that I get this "stereo panning" bass. I don't want to say oscillation because it's not very violent; but with headphones on it's very obvious that the bass is moving around between channels. Would this indicate a tonearm mismatch ? I also wondered if it has to do with proper azimuth adjustments as I've never really bothered with azimuth adjustments on that stanton. The stanton seems to be a very forgiving cartridge.
I do have an oscilloscope so when the test record arrives I could run some tests and get a better idea of what is happening here. The anti-skate seems to be working well. There is a compromise that I've been unable to get it still at the beginning track when testing with the laserdisc. I redid the antiskate with a hair pin and instead of the larger weight I ended up using a small nut and this has given me much more fine tuning. I understand that anti-skating is a compromise and it appears to be better to aim for it sitting still closer from middle to end of the record because of IGD and the needle must work harder during this time. So I've aimed for that goal and it works very well.
Overall, the cart is good but the stereo panning bass issue is annoying enough that I can't really enjoy it with headphones. My loudspeakers work well enough to mostly mask it.
I also double checked my tonearm wiring to make sure everything is phased properly and it is. For fun, I reversed one of the channels and the phase is way off so we can rule out this issue. It also obviously does not happen with the Stanton.
? I also wondered if it has to do with proper azimuth adjustments as I've never really bothered with azimuth adjustments on that stanton. The stanton seems to be a very forgiving cartridge.I do have an oscilloscope so when the test record arrives I could run some tests and get a better idea of what is happening here. The anti-skate seems to be working well. There is a compromise that I've been unable to get it still at the beginning track when testing with the laserdisc. I redid the antiskate with a hair pin and instead of the larger weight I ended up using a small nut and this has given me much more fine tuning. I understand that anti-skating is a compromise and it appears to be better to aim for it sitting still closer from middle to end of the record because of IGD and the needle must work harder during this time. So I've aimed for that goal and it works very well.
Overall, the cart is good but the stereo panning bass issue is annoying enough that I can't really enjoy it with headphones. My loudspeakers work well enough to mostly mask it.
I also double checked my tonearm wiring to make sure everything is phased properly and it is. For fun, I reversed one of the channels and the phase is way off so we can rule out this issue. It also obviously does not happen with the Stanton.
Maraakate
Member
It appears to be something with my house wiring. If I use the Stanton it's still doing this effect but since that cartridge isn't of the same quality level it was harder to pick out that flaw. I noticed if I turn the amp down very low any input it's the same kind of sweeping hum. It's not a ground hum issue or anything like that. I tried moving the amp around and actually removed the amp took it in another room and the small hum is still there but no longer oscillating. I live in an apartment so maybe there's just crappy wiring.
I also played around with adjusting the azimuth with using a mechanical pencil lead sandwhiched in the center and tilting it either way. This actually helped resolve some LPs that seem to have a little trouble tracking on the inner groove for one channel. Originally was slightly distorted, but now it's good.
I tried another amp too and the sweeping hum problem still persists on the same circuit. Not really sure what it is but tried turning everything off. Anyways, really derailing the thread here. When the test LP comes I'll let you guys know the resonance frequency and hopefully it's mostly within spec. It appears to be considering everything is tracking fine.
I also played around with adjusting the azimuth with using a mechanical pencil lead sandwhiched in the center and tilting it either way. This actually helped resolve some LPs that seem to have a little trouble tracking on the inner groove for one channel. Originally was slightly distorted, but now it's good.
I tried another amp too and the sweeping hum problem still persists on the same circuit. Not really sure what it is but tried turning everything off. Anyways, really derailing the thread here. When the test LP comes I'll let you guys know the resonance frequency and hopefully it's mostly within spec. It appears to be considering everything is tracking fine.
Maraakate
Member
I'll bring it back around again. I'm actually just crazy and the Denon is just making the oddness of the song more obvious. Was mostly testing this with more Polvo and check this out:
-- The original song
-- Personal rip from the Stanton
It just appears their songs have some odd warbly bass going on. Don't know if it's because of the high pitched goofy tuning of the guitars mixed with the bass; but apologies for my insanity.
It just appears their songs have some odd warbly bass going on. Don't know if it's because of the high pitched goofy tuning of the guitars mixed with the bass; but apologies for my insanity.
rocknroll1
Well-Known Member
Need a little help for my 698, thought i had everything adjusted correctly and it sounds great but auto lift lifts arm about 1/4 inch early i.e. in the middle of last song. What do I have out of adjustment?
You need to rotate the entire back arm housing so the auto lift will lift at the right spot. Loosen the arm height screw a little and twist the entire arm assembly towards the back in extra small steps, always re-tightening the screw and checking if you got it right. When you have, you're there.
rocknroll1
Well-Known Member
Man you guys are great, asked the question 3 minutes ago and 3 minutes after that it is fixed. Thanks
