Surround Sound without subwoofer?

[89grand]

A lot of cable channels don't carry DD. I frequently see my preamp switch from "Dolby Digital" to "DD+ProLogic" when channel surfing.

I only watch HD cable channels, and my receiver almost always says "Dolby Digital" except during some commercials, then it will switch to "Stereo". Again, that's on HD channels, SD channels are probably often not broadcast in DD, I'm not really sure on that.

 

[Blackstone]

I recently switched from Dolby Pro-logic to 5.1 Dolby Digital and DTS and that sound difference is dramatic.

Same here. I had a used Pioneer D1s pro-logic receiver. It was my first step into surround sound and I thought ANY surround affects was great. Then I got a used Pioneers 7.1 (non-hdmi) receiver from craigslist for cheap. The D1S is still a fantastic for stereo use. But the Pioneer 7.1 just crushed it for surround. The jump from pro-logic to DD was shocking.

I've considered getting a hdmi receiver for the newer sound formats, but haven't pulled the trigger. I've listened to them in other homes. I currently don't feel the jump from DD to DD-HD is as great as it was from pro-logic to DD.

 

[RoldGold]

Ok, with my previous setup, I was a step behind Pro Logic. I had the L/R outputs running into my old Technics receiver directly. Only 2 channels. Boy, I didn't know what I was missing.

 

[ironhead17]

digital coaxil cable

Given that the DVD and the Sovy 5.1 AV receiver have the orange coaxil I/Oputs I procured a cable from Wally world and we watched "Frontier Writers" -- 1 word - AWESOME movie! I tried to decifer the difference beyond the cool little blue light that indicates coax, but couldn't. I'm sure I've got all the bases covered to maximize the potential, still w/o the sub, so over the W/E, I'll tinker w/ it. I'm sure there is more to learn and I'm like a kid in the candy store......:giggle:
All the help is greatly appreciated.

WP

 

[rgk5]

I juat watched "Inception" with no sub and there was plenty of bass. Follow the previous suggestions.

 

[RoldGold]

I've had very good success without a subwoofer, it sounds like a theater. I just watched The Dark Knight, and all the explosions I could feel.

 

[dusty42701]

I've had very good success without a subwoofer, it sounds like a theater. I just watched The Dark Knight, and all the explosions I could feel.

+1
Although I added a ridiculously powered subwoofer anyway.
For the longest time, I ran the home theater from the Yamaha itself plus one pro-audio power amp for the front channel, and that was plenty. But the addition of another pro-audio 1200w subwoofer really extended the low end range.
Overall, it was a big difference and a necessary one, but not a must by any means. As long as you have enough horsepower behind the front channel, you will be fine.

 

[whoaru99]

A lot of cable channels don't carry DD. I frequently see my preamp switch from "Dolby Digital" to "DD+ProLogic" when channel surfing.

I only watch HD cable channels, and my receiver almost always says "Dolby Digital" except during some commercials, then it will switch to "Stereo". Again, that's on HD channels, SD channels are probably often not broadcast in DD, I'm not really sure on that.

A fair number of digital channels carry sound in DD, but DD 2.0. The HD channels usually are in DD, but it may be just 2.0 or it could be 5.1, depending on the feed and what the cable co passes on.

 

[Blackstone]

I've had very good success without a subwoofer, it sounds like a theater. I just watched The Dark Knight, and all the explosions I could feel.

Of course YOU have success without a subwoofer. Those Sansui SP-X8000's have 16" woofers don't they? I don't think that's your average home front stage.

 

[89grand]

Of course YOU have success without a subwoofer. Those Sansui SP-X8000's have 16" woofers don't they? I don't think that's your average home front stage.

I'd be willing to bet money that either my 10" Velodyne sub, or 12" BIC sub actually play lower and louder than those 16" Sansui's.:yes:

 

[RoldGold]

You would think blackstone, but my Advent Legacy's are the ones that put out the bass.

I would agree 89grand, they are very very tight and move very little air. Plus they are in an enclosure 2 times too small. But even so my philosophy is, don't listen to better speakers then you won't know what your missing.

And almost every channel Verizon FiOS has is DD 2.0, and I use a coaxial connection.

I am considering making a powered subwoofer for my theater, and keeping all the speakers set as larges. I have noticed less bass than my previous setup with a 2.0 signal through RCA cables into my Technics SA-600. So a sub might not hurt as an addition. Maybe after a couple other purchases go through.

 

[DougMac]

Happy

I've had very good success without a subwoofer, it sounds like a theater. I just watched The Dark Knight, and all the explosions I could feel.

...But even so my philosophy is, don't listen to better speakers then you won't know what your missing.

I'm glad you're happy with your setup and it's working for you.

I was going to suggest you hear a good setup with matched speakers and a worthy subwoofer, but I see that may run counter to your philosophy!

I've read old specs on Advent Legacy and the -3db point is 38hz, which is very respectable. I have an SVS PB12-NSD and my measured -3db point is 19hz! Movies like The Dark Knight have a lot of LFE below 30hz. The Dark Knight is considered bass hot, that might be one reason you're impressed. While your Advents have done their best, be aware there's plenty of bass content beyond their reach. If you get a chance to hear a system capable of playing it at or near reference levels without distortion , I think you'll be amazed.

 

[michiganpat]

one thing to remember with the advents, being acoustic suspension, they roll off a lot shallower (iirc ~6db/octave, vs 12+ db/octave) than a ported speaker, so it's -10db cutoff is probably into the mid 20hz region.

 

[RoldGold]

Thanks everyone for your responses. I figure, if I know how good other surround sound systems sound, then Ill never be happy with mine.

I am thinking about experimenting, maybe switching the Sansui's to the rears and the Advents to the fronts. Mainly because everyone believes the Advents sound better. Any ideas? I am also planning on buying a good center channel. I was using an old no brand one I had laying around, but I had more success just not using one at all, because the center sounded so bad.

Unfortunately I have a lot of things I'd like to buy right now. Subwoofer, center, 750GB laptop 7200rpm HDD, among others. So I'll have to get my priorities straight.

 

[RoldGold]

I just switched my Advent Legacy's to the front speakers and the sansui's to the back. The sound quality difference is like night and day. I think my receiver mainly distributes the LFE track to the fronts when there is no sub connected and the Advents make the bass more rich and full than the sansui's. And the vocals are clearer and more human-like.

 

[Henners]

Again I was not clear. For devices that only output 2 channel PCM (Playstation2, Nintendo64, etc...) I switch with the TV. But the DVD player would run directly into the receiver, bypassing the TV. Thus the receiver would have the full surround sound audio track.

I actually just started bidding with ebay on a Pioneer AV 5.1 receiver w/o HDMI.

slightly off topic, but you're aware the PS2 can do 5.1 right?

 

[whoaru99]

Subwoofer, center, 750GB laptop 7200rpm HDD, among others. So I'll have to get my priorities straight.

For the sake of several points made in this thread, I'm hoping you've budgeted more for a sub than for a 750GB HDD. :scratch2:

 

[RoldGold]

I was not aware the PS2 can do 5.1. How is that? Mine only has RCA connectors.

Whoareu99: I'm selling a couple old hard drives to cover the cost of the HDD, and plan to sell an HTIB soon to cover the cost of a subwoofer.

 

[RoldGold]

Also, my PS2 is the original thick version. Not the slim version.

 

[whoaru99]

I was not aware the PS2 can do 5.1. How is that? Mine only has RCA connectors.

Also, my PS2 is the original thick version. Not the slim version.

The thick PS2 I have has an optical digitial (Toslink) output on the back. That's where you'd get the digital output for 5.1.

I'm not familiar with all PS2 hardwware versions though to know if optical output is on all of them or not.