Thanks, Mister P.
I have a set of used pair of Analysis Plus Oval 12s on the way. Boy, this can get expensive!
It was actually the Chickens who suggested the Kimbers. --they seemed so well-meaning.
Switching speaker cables from silver to copper; first impressions.
- Thread starter Brett a
- Start date
I have a set of used pair of Analysis Plus Oval 12s on the way. Boy, this can get expensive!
It was actually the Chickens who suggested the Kimbers. --they seemed so well-meaning.
Mr. Lin
Lunatic Member
IME my experience silver is almost always better, provided the materials, design, and construction are all of good quality. I don't think it's a question of silver playing the role of a tone control and tipping up the high frequencies, rather the silver is more transparent, and you're just hearing more of what's available from your system as a whole, the good and the bad. I don't really have anything against copper, there's nothing wrong with going all-copper and it sure is a hell of a lot cheaper - plus the sonic differences between copper and silver are ultimately small. But I've done a lot of experimenting with this in the last five years, I've also made dozens of my own cables of all different types, and it's clear to me that two things are better: solid core wire, and silver. Just my opinion of course.
Brett why didn't you just go for the 8TC? The difference has mostly to do with the dielectric I believe. I kind of like the appearance of the VS better though.
Brett why didn't you just go for the 8TC? The difference has mostly to do with the dielectric I believe. I kind of like the appearance of the VS better though.
Well, the first thing that comes to mind is that we are a complicated species. Trailing that, the 8vs were so lackluster, I got spooked on the brand. And trailing that, I'm scared and confused. :cry:
I've been intrigued by everything I've read about the Analysis Plus Ovals, I want to give them a try.
One of the senior sales guys at my local shop has offered these (below) to me from his personal stash for around $250 (or less I imagine)
"12' full bi-wire pair of Audioquest Midnight or Midnight+, I can't remember without looking. It's terminated with WBT-0681 spades"..."there are over $500 worth of WBT connectors. If it is something in which you might have interest, I'd be happy to bring them in. I think the Midnight was $15 per foot back when...It's a decent cable with a lot of control and dynamics."
What do ya'll think? Should I give those a try too?
Sure...why not. Try as many companies as you can. It is a fun journey and will in the long run reap you many benefits with great sound at your budget.
I remember trying their IC's - Copperhead (all copper IC) and King Cobra. These were just okay for me.
ledzep1968
Budding Audiophile
Thanks for the info, Arkay! I'll have to experiment with this. Maybe with my speakers that have a lower frequency range I'll use silver wire and the ones that have a more broad range, I'll use copper.
yes, that was a major part of my motivation to loose the Silver Sonics. also, re: the local offer, I don't need 12 foot runs. that's why I havent taken him up on it yet.
VinylRob
Vinylphile
><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯ `· .¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>
Speaker wires don't sound different...do they???
(JUST KIDDING!)
I recently sold a pair of Coincident Total Eclipses that had a Scan-Speak Revelator (silk dome) MTM set up and I have heard the Vienna line in many iterations throughout the years. My impression is that they have much of the same basic presentation qualities. I have run Coincident Technology wire for years and have been very impressed with its overall performance, and it is an all copper wire. They show up used occasionally at a very nice price and the retail steps a bit beyond your mentioned budget. Never the less I would highly recommend them.
Happy Listener, Happy Listening!
Speaker wires don't sound different...do they???
(JUST KIDDING!)
I recently sold a pair of Coincident Total Eclipses that had a Scan-Speak Revelator (silk dome) MTM set up and I have heard the Vienna line in many iterations throughout the years. My impression is that they have much of the same basic presentation qualities. I have run Coincident Technology wire for years and have been very impressed with its overall performance, and it is an all copper wire. They show up used occasionally at a very nice price and the retail steps a bit beyond your mentioned budget. Never the less I would highly recommend them.
Happy Listener, Happy Listening!
palasr
Active Member
I run a pair of Coincident Total Eclipse II, and have been a very happy user of Clear Day Double Shotgun for several years. It's an all silver cable, but has to be one of the least fatiguing, most musical speaker cables I've ever used; and (in the world of audiophoolery) are a relative bargain at $500 a pair. The Clear Days replaced a pair of much (much, much) more expensive Kubala-Sosnas, and I've never looked back.
Cables, like tubes, are the purists tone controls and as such are completely open to subjective opinion - what's good for one person's system may be horrible in another. Use and trust your ears.
Cables, like tubes, are the purists tone controls and as such are completely open to subjective opinion - what's good for one person's system may be horrible in another. Use and trust your ears.
VinylRob
Vinylphile
><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯ `· .¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>
Interesting. Both your ditching the KS's and not going with the same Coincident wire that is internal to the speaker... Your closing comment could not be more spot on in my opinion as well!
Happy Listener, Happy Listening!
Interesting. Both your ditching the KS's and not going with the same Coincident wire that is internal to the speaker... Your closing comment could not be more spot on in my opinion as well!
Happy Listener, Happy Listening!
VinylRob
Vinylphile
><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯ `· .¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>
Brett a, I hate to say what may already be coming to light for you... If you liked the wire (type) you had, why muck things up? Although I have never heard them, they sound like a quality wire for the price. Leaving the aluminum tweeter IMHO will be beneficial in the end but take some time getting used to. Moving away from a metal tweeter and silver plated copper will trim the high frequency feel, but the big question is... was it a false (or exaggerated) tip up or true upper frequency ambient detail??? Only your ears will be able to decide what sounds right to you. My opinion, you made a big step up speaker wise and now have to find the cable to match, your old cables may have been right where you need to be. A lesson in this? (in the perfect world) Try to not sell out of one component until you are sure you have found its replacement.
Not to take us off topic, here again is an excellent example of just how tricky and even experience dependent cables can be from kit to kit. Be careful not to jump to quick. Try everything you possibly can, in your kit. Take your time. And someone's choice, in their kit, with their ears, is just that. Have fun. (did those caveats just make it impossible to have fun?) You will be rewarded for your care and patience in the end, promise!
Palasr, Please, I don't want you to misunderstand my minimalist response, I have never heard Clear Day Double Shotgun and have little experience with Kubala-Sosnas and not in my kit so, who knows? I was very impressed every time I have heard it, though. I run TRS and have CST-1 spares and think they are both the wipe in their price range to about double that and like them in most kits that we have tried them in. I am a ardent NOS tube roller and a total timbre and tone freak, if that is any reference. I have never heard TRS Extremes and am saving for them as I now have CPRE-t's that are internal wired with it and have high regard for Israel Blume, his ears, and his engineering prowess.
Happy Listener, Happy Listening!
Brett a, I hate to say what may already be coming to light for you... If you liked the wire (type) you had, why muck things up? Although I have never heard them, they sound like a quality wire for the price. Leaving the aluminum tweeter IMHO will be beneficial in the end but take some time getting used to. Moving away from a metal tweeter and silver plated copper will trim the high frequency feel, but the big question is... was it a false (or exaggerated) tip up or true upper frequency ambient detail??? Only your ears will be able to decide what sounds right to you. My opinion, you made a big step up speaker wise and now have to find the cable to match, your old cables may have been right where you need to be. A lesson in this? (in the perfect world) Try to not sell out of one component until you are sure you have found its replacement.
Not to take us off topic, here again is an excellent example of just how tricky and even experience dependent cables can be from kit to kit. Be careful not to jump to quick. Try everything you possibly can, in your kit. Take your time. And someone's choice, in their kit, with their ears, is just that. Have fun. (did those caveats just make it impossible to have fun?) You will be rewarded for your care and patience in the end, promise!
Palasr, Please, I don't want you to misunderstand my minimalist response, I have never heard Clear Day Double Shotgun and have little experience with Kubala-Sosnas and not in my kit so, who knows? I was very impressed every time I have heard it, though. I run TRS and have CST-1 spares and think they are both the wipe in their price range to about double that and like them in most kits that we have tried them in. I am a ardent NOS tube roller and a total timbre and tone freak, if that is any reference. I have never heard TRS Extremes and am saving for them as I now have CPRE-t's that are internal wired with it and have high regard for Israel Blume, his ears, and his engineering prowess.
Happy Listener, Happy Listening!
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CarnahanBB
Super Member
you could ask Ryan what he almost bought instead of your DH Labs...
Hey Chris and Brett! I hadn't had an opportunity to try the DH Labs Q10 until tonight and I hope I'm not rubbing salt in the wound but OMG are these cables good! They seem to be a perfect match for my system! These are my first silver cables. I liked the T14 but these are on another level. I'm listening to John Denver so I can't comment on bass just yet but from mids on up the difference is remarkable. I wonder how the Vampire Wire would compare?
mfrench
Addicted Member
Well done!
The A-P's are amazing cables. I've run the Bi-Oval9's (9') since 1999 or so, and will continue to do so for as long as they last. Call me a fanboy.
palasr
Active Member
No worries my friend. You do bring up an interesting point about the Coincidents being internally wired with the stuff though; my response was more an audible epiphany than any need to run out and buy the cables. I've been in the audio strata for long enough now to trust my ears and little else, aside from the opinions of a few close confidants for whose ears I can vouch. Haven't subscribed to an audio magazine since The Listener went under.
CPREs, eh? Someone spent some change! I heard them at RMAF back in 2010, spoke with Israel for a while and generally enjoyed the room. I am especially interested in hearing a pair of his Frankenstein MkIIs in my own system. I'm currently running either my Berning ZH-270 or using a K&K Audio Dyna ST-70 triode-strapped, CCS-loaded KT88 stereo amp, that puts out around 9 watts (not much left of the Dyna aside from the OPTs and chassis). Both sound spectacular.
OP - sorry for the partial threadjack...
Art K.
The Voodoo You Do!
:thmbsp:
What is disappointing about the Analysis Plus' is that they stink like cigarettes, and even worse; air "freshener" (my new favorite oxymoron). There may be cat box mixed in there too.
/begin rant/
I've bought some used gear that obviously came from a smoker's house, but these are just incredible. So far, I've wiped them down with dish soap, all-purpose household cleaner, Goo-Gone, and denatured alcohol and I still want to open the windows in the living room. I never would have believed that so much stink could come off of two skinny cables.
Hell, it's even gotten into the skin on my hands and is staying there through multiple washings.
/end of rant/
/begin rant/
I've bought some used gear that obviously came from a smoker's house, but these are just incredible. So far, I've wiped them down with dish soap, all-purpose household cleaner, Goo-Gone, and denatured alcohol and I still want to open the windows in the living room. I never would have believed that so much stink could come off of two skinny cables.
Hell, it's even gotten into the skin on my hands and is staying there through multiple washings.
/end of rant/
Mister Pig
Pigamus Maximus
Good to hear that you like the AP speaker wire. I owned some a couple of years back, and used it with my Rowland Model 5 and Mourdant Short Performance 880 speakers. I found it to be a very good speaker wire, although significantly different than the silver ribbon speaker wires I used before. I also find that the interconnects are quite good, but not as good a value as the speaker wire. But I absolutely hate the power cords, they ar very dark and recessed sounding. I got no idea why they are so different from the other cables, but they are.
Sorry to hear about your smoke issue with this pair. I have had good success using Febreeze on some fabric covering a pair of Acoustat speakers that came from a smoker. You might want to consider that. Also if you know a car detailer, they have stuff that can effectively deal with cigarette smoke. Perhaps that is an avenue you can pursue.
Regards
Mister Pig
Sorry to hear about your smoke issue with this pair. I have had good success using Febreeze on some fabric covering a pair of Acoustat speakers that came from a smoker. You might want to consider that. Also if you know a car detailer, they have stuff that can effectively deal with cigarette smoke. Perhaps that is an avenue you can pursue.
Regards
Mister Pig
240sx4u
Lunatic Member
What is disappointing about the Analysis Plus' is that they stink like cigarettes, and even worse; air "freshener" (my new favorite oxymoron). There may be cat box mixed in there too.
/begin rant/
I've bought some used gear that obviously came from a smoker's house, but these are just incredible. So far, I've wiped them down with dish soap, all-purpose household cleaner, Goo-Gone, and denatured alcohol and I still want to open the windows in the living room. I never would have believed that so much stink could come off of two skinny cables.
Hell, it's even gotten into the skin on my hands and is staying there through multiple washings.
/end of rant/
That sucks. I had a pioneer elite stereo cabinet I purchased on ebay with local pickup, beautiful cabinet. I walked into the house and knew I was in trouble. That thing REEKED. I had to clean it what seemed like 20 times with ammonia based glass cleaner to get the stuff off. It was piano black and it looked all smeared until I got it clean.
Cheap glass cleaner with ammonia may be worth a try. That rubber jacket likely absorbed the odor unfortunately.
Evan
