The ACA kit...
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Binkman
Lunatic Member
I read the entire thread and was writing a reply when timed out.. was locked.
I read nothing unfriendly about it just strong opinion. If you purchased said kt and got your feelings hurt? Send it back if not assembled is good advice from me if not previously posted.
aside-----------
I have more respect for the opinions of the experienced here than N.Pass' designs and would have posted asking "should I pull the trigger" before hand expense-wise.. these guys have saved me a lot of money!
I read nothing unfriendly about it just strong opinion. If you purchased said kt and got your feelings hurt? Send it back if not assembled is good advice from me if not previously posted.
aside-----------
I have more respect for the opinions of the experienced here than N.Pass' designs and would have posted asking "should I pull the trigger" before hand expense-wise.. these guys have saved me a lot of money!
vinylkid58
Super Member
I highly doubt it. Join the group over at diyaudio.com and leave the "haters" behind.
jeff
Binkman
Lunatic Member
Okay... tell us why this kit is worth the cost? Certainly only a very small niche in a big pond as Pass doesn't produce many of any one amp. I remember a latter design that depended upon transistors of limited supply on roll out. That means buyer pays the cost for smaller quantities. Looks? You'd have to be a bachelor because even the least decor talented woman wouldn't allow it in her living room. So if a bach. when you do get married it will go in the den or garage. You might get a prenup on that? 
I highly doubt it. Join the group over at diyaudio.com and leave the "haters" behind.
jeff
You're probably right Jeff. It's only a matter of time before the boo birds appear again. I've been at diyaudio for many years. I build the ACA about 5 years ago. The only reason I got involved with the previous thread was because of some of the ridicules statements being made.
Okay... tell us why this kit is worth the cost? Certainly only a very small niche in a big pond as Pass doesn't produce many of any one amp. I remember a latter design that depended upon transistors of limited supply on roll out. That means buyer pays the cost for smaller quantities. Looks? You'd have to be a bachelor because even the least decor talented woman wouldn't allow it in her living room. So if a bach. when you do get married it will go in the den or garage. You might get a prenup on that?
Okay... tell us why this kit is worth the cost? Certainly only a very small niche in a big pond as Pass doesn't produce many of any one amp. I remember a latter design that depended upon transistors of limited supply on roll out. That means buyer pays the cost for smaller quantities. Looks? You'd have to be a bachelor because even the least decor talented woman wouldn't allow it in her living room. So if a bach. when you do get married it will go in the den or garage. You might get a prenup on that?
I'd like to keep this thread as a discussion about the build and results of the ACA. If you want to discuss if it's "worth the cost" please start you're own thread.
1audiohack
Active Member
May I share something relative that I got to be a part of at INFOCOMM?
Tom Danley and Doug Jones did a loudspeaker maker lab. Doug said it took him several years to get INFOCOMM to let them do it. And I am sure DSL paid for the room and all the supplies.
The participants were nine people that signed up. They got a box with from memory:
Small cardboard swatch
Plastic drinking straw
20’ # 30 magnet wire
Plastic Solo cup and lid
1/4” X 1.5” bolt
1/4” nut
1/4” USS washer
1/4” fender waher
1/2” dia X ~ 4” wood dowel
1/2” dia X ~ 6” PVC pipe
2 NEO washer magnets
2 NEO rectangular magnets
1 NEO square magnet
Electrical tape
Super glue
Abrasive paper
The goal? Right, create a functioning loud speaker, or, a speaker anyway, in an hour and a half.
As the ME of the group I was asked to help the lost.
Before the group came I was pondering the “junior high” level of the task and being that INFOCOMM is really a heavy hitter show for the real pro audio and video industry, I was really wondering.
Doug Jones is however proffessor emeritus of acoustics at the University of Columbia U Chicago and has a better bead on teaching than I likely ever will so I kept my mouth shut.
Nine guy show up, Doug explains the exercise, tells them that if they are introverts like himself amd want to sneek into a corner and work by themselves, do it. If you want to team up and share resources, do it. Also you are not limited to whats in the box, if there is something that you think you can swipe from the lobby, go for it, at your own perril.
Also, if you do’t know where to start, we have a paper that wil get you to a working unit. Ready set go!
Three guys teamed, three guys got to work individually and three sit and stared at the contents of the box. Those were my guys.
About an hour in the first speaker is brought to the amp and connected. Listening closely, it was stated that is sounds like music, maybe live, I think I hear applause... Doug said OK let’s see what we can do to improve its efficiency and they went back to work.
I promised myself I would not touch anyones project as I have a habbit of taking over. My three guys all suceeded without much actual help, mostly question that hinted at answers and direction. I was quite proud of them.
In the end, everyone had a speaker that actually sounded pretty good considering and what surprised me a ton, was that none of them had ever done anything like this, and the utter joy they experienced having created something new like this with their own hands, that worked.
Afterwords I expressed to Doug how surprised I was over the whole thing. He told me that our world has really changed in out short lifetime and the last two generation have been led to believe that if you could simply look it up, that this l was all you really need and that the actual doing is nearly totally lost on them.
That was a real education for me.
I myself don’t know much about electonics. Electricity yes. I re-cone my own drivers and build my own enclosures and do my own integration but what happens in those little black things on the circuit boards is a mystery to me.
I have some very nice top shelf audio products but guess what I did a couple of months ago? Yup, I ordered some Amp Camp Amps, and eagerly await there delivery because I too hope to gain a little new understanding myself, by doing. I couldn’t care less what they cost. I hope DIY made something for their effort to market it.
My best,
Barry.
Tom Danley and Doug Jones did a loudspeaker maker lab. Doug said it took him several years to get INFOCOMM to let them do it. And I am sure DSL paid for the room and all the supplies.
The participants were nine people that signed up. They got a box with from memory:
Small cardboard swatch
Plastic drinking straw
20’ # 30 magnet wire
Plastic Solo cup and lid
1/4” X 1.5” bolt
1/4” nut
1/4” USS washer
1/4” fender waher
1/2” dia X ~ 4” wood dowel
1/2” dia X ~ 6” PVC pipe
2 NEO washer magnets
2 NEO rectangular magnets
1 NEO square magnet
Electrical tape
Super glue
Abrasive paper
The goal? Right, create a functioning loud speaker, or, a speaker anyway, in an hour and a half.
As the ME of the group I was asked to help the lost.
Before the group came I was pondering the “junior high” level of the task and being that INFOCOMM is really a heavy hitter show for the real pro audio and video industry, I was really wondering.
Doug Jones is however proffessor emeritus of acoustics at the University of Columbia U Chicago and has a better bead on teaching than I likely ever will so I kept my mouth shut.
Nine guy show up, Doug explains the exercise, tells them that if they are introverts like himself amd want to sneek into a corner and work by themselves, do it. If you want to team up and share resources, do it. Also you are not limited to whats in the box, if there is something that you think you can swipe from the lobby, go for it, at your own perril.
Also, if you do’t know where to start, we have a paper that wil get you to a working unit. Ready set go!
Three guys teamed, three guys got to work individually and three sit and stared at the contents of the box. Those were my guys.
About an hour in the first speaker is brought to the amp and connected. Listening closely, it was stated that is sounds like music, maybe live, I think I hear applause... Doug said OK let’s see what we can do to improve its efficiency and they went back to work.
I promised myself I would not touch anyones project as I have a habbit of taking over. My three guys all suceeded without much actual help, mostly question that hinted at answers and direction. I was quite proud of them.
In the end, everyone had a speaker that actually sounded pretty good considering and what surprised me a ton, was that none of them had ever done anything like this, and the utter joy they experienced having created something new like this with their own hands, that worked.
Afterwords I expressed to Doug how surprised I was over the whole thing. He told me that our world has really changed in out short lifetime and the last two generation have been led to believe that if you could simply look it up, that this l was all you really need and that the actual doing is nearly totally lost on them.
That was a real education for me.
I myself don’t know much about electonics. Electricity yes. I re-cone my own drivers and build my own enclosures and do my own integration but what happens in those little black things on the circuit boards is a mystery to me.
I have some very nice top shelf audio products but guess what I did a couple of months ago? Yup, I ordered some Amp Camp Amps, and eagerly await there delivery because I too hope to gain a little new understanding myself, by doing. I couldn’t care less what they cost. I hope DIY made something for their effort to market it.
My best,
Barry.
vinylkid58
Super Member
That's a great story Barry. Thanks for sharing.
jeff
jeff
Binkman
Lunatic Member
OP excuse me but you posted "worth the cost" I didn't. (didn't infer anything about your spouse, if applicable.. just that alone is worth consideration. Worth? as in value is vague. Again; why not post up reasons why people purchase this particular kit. Unless cost is no problem to buyer. then what is it? looks? what?
I'm just giving the opportunity to point out buyer opinion. a review link perhaps available?
I'm just giving the opportunity to point out buyer opinion. a review link perhaps available?
I'm just giving the opportunity to point out buyer opinion. a review link perhaps available?
That's not the title of the thread I started. Someone changed it. I wanted a discussion about the amp, not another cost discussion.[/QUOTE]
That's not the title of the thread I started. Someone changed it. I wanted a discussion about the amp, not another cost discussion.[/QUOTE]
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I'm pretty sure the several ACA threads at diyaudio are repleat with all the reasoning anyone would want as to why you should buy an ACA. Really, if raw distortion numbers are all you're after, Pass amps in general aren't for you. None of the FW amps except for the F5 are particularly clean. The Zen variations aren't real clean either. None of the Pass DIY designs are "middle of the road" except for maybe the Aleph J and the F5. They're all weird, quirky amps with oddball characteristics and mostly less-than-stellar measurements. Each is intended to drive certain kinds of speakers. But somehow they sound really good.
Binkman
Lunatic Member
I notice the orig. thread is 'unlocked' now. Only person(s) who can mod. a thread title or lock one are moderators or admins. must be new. I noticed that mods on duty are no longer visible.. hmm. well anyway your threads are back but now you have two.
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ReactiveLoad; makes a good comparative post/ summary. At least sums up Pass' designs.
slimecity
Super Member
I'm not taking sides here - BUT.....
You may be referring to nelson's SIT production transistor - basically a modern-day VFET - it was limited production because (as you'll probably know) VFETs/SITs havent been around for years and Nelson decided to rectify that. So he produced a limited run of the transistors and sold kits based on that to appease some of our insatiable appetites for the mighty VFET sound. Of course, what happened then is that the manufacturer went out of business.
so yes, that leaves buyers with an amplifier with irreplaceable transistors, but thats pretty close to the situation you are in with any VFET amplifier.
Nelson also designed a new amplifier design based around the Sony VFET 2SK82/2SJ28 - and sold off his stash of these precious devices to hobbyists to enable them to build this kit - the prices werent too bad either.
Note - Im definitely not much of a fan of diyaudio and in my view there is WAY too much attitude over that side of the net......
He's probably more likely referring to the fact practically every Pass design requires input JFETs that nobody is currently making. Namely the k170 and j74. Hopefully Linear Systems will bang out more soon, but until then you're stuck hunting your own down in the wild or using noisier parts .
Good to know!
Binkman
Lunatic Member
That rings a bell [SIT's] .. bits and pieces of the 'review?' page coming back..couple-3 years ago? and I think this high wattage beast had a crap load installed (dog if I can remember the model). Yeah I remember now! I responded to that...called it a waste because there were enough of these trans's in each unit to divide into making two perhaps three more units thus multiplying production and making a the design more affordable to more people but lesser power, I think I guesstimated design change at about 80-100w but all the oohs and aahs were the high watt output as is.
I initially posted over there (member here since 2012) never got a clear solution to what-ever? it was I was asking or was I guess snubbed or ignored. Then I hit on a.k. and got the answer fast.
No shi*?! wonder if his trans' design is susceptible to variac damage as other fet's?
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ReativeLoad: welcome to ak! (asylum) You fit right in.
