The Evolution and Progression of Members Systems

Discussion in 'General Audio Discussion' started by 4-2-7, Jun 15, 2016.

  1. just dave

    just dave vintage rules!

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    I'm not being negative, that's what they call them around here.If you like them that's all that matters.Whatever you have is fine by me.
     
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  2. musichal

    musichal poet emeritus Subscriber

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    You have a beautiful system. I, too, am somewhat surprised at your speaker choice, but then I've never heard them, though I'd love to. Those 275s are impressive. Have you ever considered trying out an ARC pre? An SP-11 (or -10 or -9) would lead to some interesting comparisons for you to share with us. I'm not denigrating what you have at all... your stuff is beyond my paygrade, at least from the electronic component perspective. I'm very happy with the Khorns.

    Your new table/arm combo looks very nice and I'm sure the sound matches appearance. Thanks for all the pics.
     
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  3. E-Stat

    E-Stat Super Member

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    4,147
    With respect to imaging, my concern would be for the pre-Floyd Toole speaker design approach used by JBL in the 70s and 80s as implemented in the L250. To wit - running a driver (the 5" midrange) beyond its ideal range for consistent directivity.

    Toole is all about delivering consistent directivity across the entire spectrum - as am I which is one reason I've favored truly full range electrostats for forty years! Directivity falls off significantly when the driver's piston diameter exceeds the wavelength reproduced. The 5" midrange runs all the way to 5.2 kHz where the wavelength is 2.6". It is common that a tweeter will narrow its directivity at the top of its range, but the effect is gradual and usually not noticed. When, however, you transition a challenged driver to one sitting right in the middle of its sweet spot with wide dispersion, you get a discontinuity that I find noticeable. While I haven't heard the 250, I've heard other JBLs that used the same approach. Instruments that span both drivers render a somewhat peculiar "hourglass" shaped image with fundamentals in the lows and midrange reproduced normally, but with the upper midrange and lower highs comparatively shrunken only to transition (and return) to a wide perspective at the top.

    If you look at current JBL designs like the LSR6332, you find that it restricts the 5 incher to 2.2 kHz before transitioning to the tweeter. I'm sure its directivity sonogram plot would look more consistent.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2016
  4. dfunghi

    dfunghi AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Location:
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    What I love most about this thread? That I can show my wife all these pics of so much gear, hoarding and outright excess to remind her how conservative I have been. She needs to see how much "worse" it can get.

    Back in the day I was a Kenwood and Pioneer receiver guy with Jensen or KLH speakers, TEAC tape deck and KW TT. I owned a pair of Sennheiser HD 414 that I used when I listened loud in the basement and went undetected by family. My friends all thought those cans were super cheap and crappy when they saw them (due to small size and minimalist build) but were shocked when they heard them. Most people had JVC or Sears (white and black) brand cans that looked like you should be flying a WWII bomber.

    My summers were spent at a friends home near the beach on Long Island and he had a hand me down Fisher 400 with no case and few knobs, hooked up to hand me down Bose 901 (with EQ) and I forget what TT we used. His dad (where hand me downs came from) upstairs had MAC amp(s), NAK deck and Thorens TT also running into a newer version of the 901s. We were not allowed to touch it. (1972-1975 or so)

    In the 1990's I went all HK / Denon as I had a connection to rep and got amazing deals on display units from factory. JBL bookshelf and eventually Signet bookshelf.

    Most recently I began with an Anthem Integrated II (upgraded by Chris at factory in Ca but no phono), Thorens TD 150 MK II, Vandy 2Ce, using the Holman Apt pre as a phono stage only. Have since moved to CJ PV 1 > MAC 2205 > running the NAK 680zx (and soon the 600), Pioneer PL 570 (V1), AR EB101 (late model, akin to "The Turntable, worked on by Marc), Pioneer RT909, all coming out of Vandy 3A.

    The 90's stuff is collecting dust (HK amp, Denon CDP, HK Receiver), the original stuff was either sold or stolen over the years and long gone. SX 949 was my last Pioneer and I knew who stole it but could do little about it in those days. That was in 1979.

    Oh yea I also had a few walkmen and discmen over the years.
     
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  5. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Smart Ass Sponsor Subscriber

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    Hi Hal, I left of at around three years ago so I do have a lot more to add. I sure would like to see or here what you've been using over the years till today.
     
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  6. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Smart Ass Sponsor Subscriber

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    Thanks but please let's not have this thread drift off on some speaker debate, that's not the topic here.
     
  7. musichal

    musichal poet emeritus Subscriber

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    Unfortunately, no (or very few) pics. But, it began with this:

    upload_2016-6-17_14-37-24.png


    upload_2016-6-17_14-38-32.png

    and this:

    upload_2016-6-17_14-41-31.png

    with this:

    upload_2016-6-17_14-43-47.png


    That was almost twenty years ago, after divorce left me starting over. I struggled along with this anemic-sounding, bland amalgamation for almost a year, when this happened:

    upload_2016-6-17_14-48-21.png


    upload_2016-6-17_14-50-7.png

    Well, that sounded more better, but then I met my wife, and a year or so later on my birthday she surprised me with:

    upload_2016-6-17_14-53-5.png and

    upload_2016-6-17_14-53-57.png and

    upload_2016-6-17_14-55-1.png and

    upload_2016-6-17_14-56-11.png and (to be cont'd)
     
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  8. musichal

    musichal poet emeritus Subscriber

    Messages:
    8,400
    Location:
    Norman OK
    cont'd:

    upload_2016-6-17_14-59-49.png and
    [​IMG] and




    upload_2016-6-17_15-1-4.png

    What a woman! What a birthday!

    Then I found, at a thrift:

    upload_2016-6-17_15-2-52.png grills off:

    upload_2016-6-17_15-3-29.png

    Even better.

    Later, I traded this:

    upload_2016-6-17_15-5-31.png for this:

    upload_2016-6-17_15-6-31.png oh, yeah

    After a few more miscellaneous additions, but mostly saving my "disposable" income and selling a few things, I made the recent additions of the Khorns and ST-70 variant, which have been pictured recently in several threads.

    http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/whats-your-latest-audio-purchase.418419/page-164

    When I heard this, I became convinced that making one big upgrade beats making six little ones that are often arguably side-ways moves anyway.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2016
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  9. dfunghi

    dfunghi AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Agreed 100%
     
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  10. Nightwisher

    Nightwisher Farer In The Goldilocks Zone Subscriber

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    Awesome thread! I've got a picture or two of my first iteration of my system and my newest iterations that I'll add a bit later. Keep the good stuff coming people! :thumbsup:
     
  11. Brindabella

    Brindabella Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    702
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    The following is a tweak from a previous thread/post, I hope you don't mind me cheating by not typing the same thing a different way, but I thought it would help give context to how my audio journey has evolved;

    This is a really nice thread, very personable. I am 50 yrs no kids of my own, my partner, Lana, also no kids, lives separately from me (to avoid the chaos) plus it has given us the opportunity to compete on everything from gardening, house decorating, cooking and who is the better 4WDer - for the record (but don't tell Lana I said this ;)) but I win on all counts hands down :naughty:. I stopped full-time work in 2002 and fortunately financially secure, but I still try and do a bit of consulting from home just keep the brain ticking along. I also opened a couple of stores importing unique new and antique furniture and homewares in 2005 to 2009 but the international travelling to keep 2500 sq meters of retail and warehouse space full was not fun and took its toll. My life is now filled with gardening, cooking, interior design, camping & 4WDing, riding the motorbike, I collect old meccano, art, residential property, working with wood - mostly furniture restoration, music & audio gear and I do full-time foster care.

    Music and audio are in my DNA, my first transistor radio at 7, first 3 in 1 stereo at 12, first real hifi Sony TA-AX6 amp, Infinity RS7b and a p mount TT from Technics SL-Q 200 (I think) and dedicated audio room at 16 (converted garage). Sometime later a set JBL L15's were mine and my employer gave me as a bonus a SL1200mkII + AT125lc cartridge. Worked Friday nights and Saturdays mornings selling department store hifi while in school (1981) and when I finished school at 18 I was poached by a hifi specialty store and within a year was managing the shop with 3 staff. At 21 my professional life changed and although I maintained a nice hifi I really only kept up with my music collecting till the early nineties when I could no longer find new vinyl to buy.

    In 1999, I decided to buy a new sound system; Denon PMA 1500ea, 2 x Sony 400 CD stackers, 2 x Sony 300 CD stackers, Jamo D590 speakers and kept my Technics SL 1200k11 with an Audio Technica AT125lc cartridge at the time - since up-graded to an Ortofon Bronze. All my old hifi gear was still boxed from moving around since 1995 and I just decided to leave it boxed. In 2004, on a whim I bought a pair of B&W804's that when I got them home I never unboxed till 2011. Unfortunately, major depression was and still is from time to time an issue which undermines my life, but fortnightly counselling, strong medication and a busy life with foster caring, my partner and music/audio really making a big difference to keeping the black dog in the kennel as much as possible.

    It was not till 2011 when Lana and a friend (John) were helping me get back on my feet again after a long depressive state I re-connected with audio in substantial way. John had brought some photos of us in our youth and in the back ground of one of the photos were these AR94's John had bought from me back in the day when I was retailing. He had long since lost them in a separation, they were a nice speaker which we both missed him owning. We wondered if people actually sold their old audio gear, was there a market for secondhand speakers or even electronics? We sat at the computer and for the first time ever registered with ebay and Lordy Lordy were we surprised. Within a few weeks I owned a pair of AR94's and discovered there were whole online communities dedicated to vintage and modern audio. I lurked around Audiokarma and finally decided to join in 2013, apart from ebay AK is my first and only online participation.

    It had never occured to me the notion of collecting audio - I guess well collecting new audio would be cost prohibitive - but collecting a combination of new and vintage well that was definitely do-able. Although I have bought about 20 CD players and around 10 or more amps and receivers; that part of my collection is only just now starting to get interesting. It has been my speaker collecting that has given me the most joy to-date; JBL L15, Infinty RS7b, Wharfedale W30, Wharfedale E70, JBL 80lt, Kef 104ab, Infinity Kappa 7, AR 94, Celestion Ditton 66, Yamaha NS200m and recently sold my B&W804's hoping to upgrade to 801's and also sold a pretty battered pair of NS1000 to replace with either NS1000m or maybe 690II's. Plus on the hunt for some JBL L96, AR9 or 90's, Kef 107, something IMF and set of Maggies would be nice too.

    The young fella who has been living with me full-time for 4 years, he's 9 now and just loves audio as well. We regularly rotate source, amp, speakers and cables into his bedroom and he loves my audio sessions of just sitting and listening or pulling things apart to try different combinations and hear the differences/synergy just as much as I do. Every night just before bed we sit at a couple of computers to go through all the audio ebay listings for that day and decide/argue together what will go on the 'watch list' a ritual if I did on my own I would never be forgiven for.


    The following photos are from my rental house 2006 to 2014 so before the young fella and audio collecting and everything sorta fitted in. Once the audio addiction took hold in 2011 and the young fella took over the house it was inevitable that I would run out of space fast. In 2014 the owners of the house I rent needed to sell so it was a good time to move on http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-vic-wyndham+vale-115831879 (just a few commercial pics rather my naff ones). A friend was building and asked if I would rent his place which was to be considerably bigger. So everything was boxed and placed into storage for what was supposed to be a few months which dragged out to 20 months and we moved in about 3/4 months ago - ummm when I say we have moved in no paintings on the walls, almost none of the hifi gear is hooked up and much is to still find it place in the house. BUT, I do have a much larger kitchen/dining/family area for my gear/sound to breath better. AND I have a dedicated listening room 4.3m (14.1ft) x 4.5m (14.8ft) still not an ideal configuration but so much better than what I had in the other place which was tiny (you will see in the pics).

    New house: I have just finished building a audio wall storage system on castors so I can get behind (photo's to come) as I want everything I own connected for listening. I have also spent the 2 years restoring speakers and amps that are going to be keepers - which is still an ongoing process. At the moment only the bedroom system is going, one in the young fella's room and a Kenwood M1 & C2 + cd player and I rotate speakers as they have been coming back from restoration at more than $500 bucks a pop + amp restorations - financially only so much I can commit and the young fella won't give up pizza Fridays. So at this stage it is an ongoing project to get rooms up to standard/sonic treatments and decorated - and we are still only half way through the boxes in the double garage - still much to do.

    I will attach the photos on the next post,

    Rob :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2016
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  12. Brindabella

    Brindabella Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    702
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    Last house in 2014
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Home sound absorbing panel under the AC
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Home sound absorbing panel above the blue cabinet
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Rob :)
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2016
  13. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Smart Ass Sponsor Subscriber

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    She sounds like a wonderful woman, your a lucky guy Hal.

    Yep great speakers and some nice tubes can make anyone happy. Thanks for posting some history.
     
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  14. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Smart Ass Sponsor Subscriber

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    Rob that was a very nice post and after reading it it's like who cares about the audio. However the audio is a vehicle for some piece of mind for you and and a spark of desirer in the young fella. Good job lovely home and rooms you have and glad you have someone special to share it with.
     
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  15. mkane

    mkane AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    5,362
    Location:
    103 miles N. of S.F.
    Used this ASL el34pp for 10yrs along with a tt that stoped working so it was mated with a CDP
    [​IMG]

    Then bumped into AK and was anonymous for quite a while, silently doing my research. Almost bought a new tt. After signing up I was swayed towards used. Bought this from another AK'er

    [​IMG]

    And this from another

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. mkane

    mkane AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    103 miles N. of S.F.
    Not to mention the tt I purchased

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  17. mkane

    mkane AK Subscriber Subscriber

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    Location:
    103 miles N. of S.F.
    And we have had Klipsch speakers since 1980. Currently modded Cornwalls downstairs and Heresy's upstairs.

    [​IMG]


    Not to mention pre amps and such
     
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  18. onwardjames

    onwardjames Hoardimus Maximus Subscriber

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    15,172
    Location:
    Kentucky
    Dang, Brindabella, this looks like something out of my home!

    [​IMG]

    Looks like my kind of place. You have some nice stuff here.


    Keep them coming, this thread rocks.

    Oh, and Dan, about those "kabuki" speakers.....I scored a pair of truly mint Sansui SP2500's, and didn't care for the sound - until I spun a record. Whoa! That's a bit better, now isn't it? I thought.

    Gave them to my sister, whose kids went apechit on them and ruined them beyond a restoration. Sigh....

    I'm still a little miffed about it, but whaddaya gonna do?

    They were far better than I had thought, and I wish like heck I had kept and recapped. Absolutely staggering build quality, if an odd, non-typical layout.

    I think it's cool you run some Mac goodness thru them. And hey, where's those little tiny Sonys you talked about once?? :)
     
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  19. 4-2-7

    4-2-7 Smart Ass Sponsor Subscriber

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    Im getting there, hehehe, I don't think most people know what I goof around with when they look at my main system only. I don't feel the need to post about everything I buy or have. When I was into classic cars more I would have fully restored cars, and drag home untouched projects cars that would pull me away from far bigger investments I had going on. You mentioned those little Sony's, well look what is sitting on my floor right now..

    IMG_0837.jpg

    A full system I found the other day at GW and the speakers looked like the other ones, but they are a little different. The stereo is Cassette, CD and tuner, optical outputs and as well as a sub output. I had it playing alone, to the main system, and to my 18" Velodyne sub.

    Now you just got me side tracked...;)
     
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  20. musichal

    musichal poet emeritus Subscriber

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    8,400
    Location:
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    Do you check the thrifts monthly? weekly? daily?
    Do you get a tight feeling in the pit of your stomach thinking someone may beat you to something good?
    Do your friends and family 'make jokes' about intervention?
    If so, lay down your wallet and step away from the thrift... :deal: :D :deal: :music:
     
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