Discussion in 'Turntables' started by Jim Creek, Nov 14, 2012.
Who plays wet records ?
No, not responding to your post
I agree that all will wear out. It is a good thing, and gets the most life out of the stylus, if we can cause the wear to be even. I have not witnessed any record damage due to skating forces but LOTS of records damaged from worn out styli. Sound quality, it is hard to say, because, like you, I can't hear the difference by adjusting the AS.
BTW, much more stylus and album damage are created by an incorrect setting (which many tone arms dont even have) is the
angle The cartridge is riding (I forget the term and am too lazy to look it up) from side to side, when viewed from the front. Many old moving coils, including one I have by SAE have a vertical line on the front of the cart so this angle can be set with the stylus sitting on a mirror, or very, very flat album, by looking at its reflection. Some have elaborate measuring devices that test the actual output signal in various manners.
Myself, I worry far less about stylus damage (even on my moving coils) than I do album damage, which is a MUCH larger investment! Sadly, most times they are both damaged at the same time. Reach a level of comfort with the best you can do, balanced against the price of your cartridge, albums, and how picky you are. Then, enjoy the music.
My original post was concerned with the possibility of excessive wear on the groove wall that faces the spindle if no or low anti-skate is applied but it also would seem that as well as possible excessive groove wear it would also wear the stylus on that side as shown by tubewade's image above
I didnt think so, and again, enjoy the arm. I dont know what it is about turntables, but I just enjoy the aesthetics of the mechanical device, much as in the same way with watches....
It used to be a thing.
Boy that's the truth! How many times I have bought a first pressing that looks like a beautiful glossy slab of vinyl, only to be greeted by surface noise that wont clean away...
Thanks, I am the same but sometimes I get bogged down in the complexities of turntables/vinyl which can get in the way of the enjoyment.
I well recall. Never tried it myself, I recall hearing folks say once you had done it, your cartridge didnt sound right unless you played wet. I really cant comment, never tried it.
Exactly! At some point, you "picks your choices and pays your money" and enjoy what you have by listening. I used to constantly check and set voltages on my Pass Pearl 2. Havent done that in some while, I notice no degradation in sound quality.
I tried it, it can be useful for noisy records but way too much trouble.
My Pearl 2 has been powered on for years, I don't bother with it any more either, just listien to music!
I wet my records if my model 17 record cleaner can't get all the gunk out of the grove or if the record has been compromised with a Spherical or elliptical stylus. I wet the disc and dub it to CD, and throw the record away. If it isn't good dry when freshly cleaned, I don't want it. Wetting really helps with inner groove distortion or polluted records. With the proliferation of other sources for the same performance is the Lp you are having to deal with worth the effort? Some times yes, most of the time maybe, the rest of the time why bother. I mean if you love Toscanni, or other popular artists from the late 40's and 50's That are no longer popular, you do what you have to do.
In another forum, Harry Weisfeld of VPI (an anti skate minimalist), once suggested that without anti skate, and tracking at or slightly above the maximum rated tracking force, replacing the stylus every 500 hours might be a good idea. For me, that would mean replacing the stylus every 9 months as opposed to every 12 months (based on Shure's expected stylus life of 600-800 hours). A local shop with a stylus microscope confirmed for me that after 9 months, the degree of stylus wear was not presenting any danger to my records. For the improved performance I hear with my particular turntable/arm/cartridge combination when using the minimum anti skate setting, I can happily live with this level of reduced stylus life. The fact that a new N97xE stylus only costs $59 may have something to do with my easy acceptance of a 500-hour stylus life.
Setting a VPI's anti-skate is as easy as zeroing the VTF and giving the armwand connector an extra twist from neutral so the arm will drift away from the spindle when floating. The closer the headshell is to the spindle, the more force is being exerted by the wiring. Saying that the wiring can achieve satisfactory anti-skate is not bunk by any stretch.
Origin Live has an interesting article on the subject, and they address the twisted wiring approach used by VPI, saying, "A neat solution in some ways but the disadvantage is that side bias increases towards the inner tracks and you want the reverse to occur."
Their article also cites and links to the Kogen research I mentioned earlier in the thread, and that paper indicates that skating forces are higher at the beginning of a side than at the end.
I'm not sure just how much more force is being exerted by the wiring at the end vs. the beginning, but it does make sense why there'd be more needed at the beginning than the end. I set my VTF at the high end with one extra twist and notice no problems... as with most things hi-fi, TANSTAAFL.
I think the core of what I was trying to inject was that VPI's do have anti-skate using the wiring, so using the wiring vs. the lever with washers method that the new VPI's ship with is a different discussion than a simple pros and cons of anti-skate. The wiring method certainly isn't precise, but IMO is good enough.
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