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used Oppo BSD-103 (longevity?) vs. other $300-$400 SACD players

Discussion in 'Digital Sources' started by foppy, Oct 10, 2018.

  1. foppy

    foppy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    707
    Location:
    western suburb Boston
    Hey all. My thrift-store-sourced Sony NS-3100ES has stopped reading many (not all) discs, and I wanted to look into getting another player, mostly for classical SACDs.

    I'm thinking of getting something in the $300-$400 range. I could likely get a five-year-old OPPO BSD-103 for around that.

    My main question: how long do these Oppo machines last? Is five years getting to the end of its lifespan? Would it be better to buy something new, like a Sony ubp-x800?
    https://www.amazon.com/SONY-X800-Re...pons&ref=sr_1_1_sspa&psc=1&smid=ALEWIQ2F9CQDR

    Or this Yamaha BD-S681?
    https://www.amazon.com/Yamaha-BD-S6...aha+bd&qid=1539184409&sr=8-1-spell&ref=sr_1_1

    These players feel somewhat disposable, which is too bad. Is Oppo different? I'm kicking myself for not grabbing a Pioneer Elite SACD player at the thrift a while back.

    All advice appreciated.
     

     

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  2. RT Fan

    RT Fan AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,146
    Location:
    NYC
    I bought my Oppo 103 used for $350 and am very happy with it, I cannot speak to its longevity, even though I am the second owner but it compared favorably with my Rotel 1072 cdp as far as audio reproduction was concerned. As to playing Blu-Rays & Dvds, I am quite happy with the machine.
     
    foppy likes this.
  3. nedseg

    nedseg AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    449
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    My 103 must be ~8 yrs old, and even sitting in a tight cabinet w/sub-optimal cooling, still works flawlessly.
    The thing is, aside from discs of all kinds, it has multi-channel analog outputs, network connectivity (I stream FLACs from both LAN and attached USB) and all kinds of configuration options. An amazing bit of kit.
     
    foppy likes this.
  4. hjames

    hjames dancing madly backwards ... Staff Member Moderator Subscriber

    Messages:
    12,071
    Location:
    VA near DC
    I got a 103D at closeout prices from Oppo last year -
    sold the 4 or 5 year old BDP-93 I'd bought new before that,
    and love the 103D ... nice features and some extra video enhancement circuits.
     
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  5. Duane

    Duane AK Member Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,826
    Location:
    San Diego
    The OPPO BDP -103 is very well built, plus it plays most discs with the exception of 4K ones. If you feel that going to UHD is in your future, then maybe the OPPO would not suit you. If the Sony player is anything like the majority of Sony's in the past few years, I would not choose one. They just seem cheap and disposable. Plus their menu systems are a bit of a nightmare. The OPPO's menu is pretty in depth and it's quite logical.
    As has been stated, there's no telling how long it would last, but it appears that older generations of OPPO players are still in operation.
     
    foppy likes this.
  6. robert_kc

    robert_kc AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    845
    Location:
    Midwest USA
    For classical music, there are many modern performances that were captured in hi-res audio (DSD or PCM) – and in a growing number of cases - Blu-ray (or Ultra HD Blu-ray) audio/video - particularly opera and ballet, but also symphony concerts. Here’s a few Bu-ray audio/video box sets of symphonies:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Bottom line: All of the following are relevant for classical recordings: CD, SACD, Blu-ray, Pure Audio Blu-ray, Ultra HD Blu-ray, hi-res PCM downloads, hi-res DSD downloads, etc. Stereo and surround-sound.

    Why limit yourself by buying a machine that plays only CD and SACD?

    Do you need analog (RCA red & white) connections to your amp, or only HDMI? Most cheap Blu-ray (and UHD) players do not include analog audio connections. They were designed to lower COGS (Cost Of Goods Sold) by eliminating analog circuitry and providing only an HDMI connection (e.g., for an AVR or HDTV).

    I suggest getting a player that enables you to enjoy an unlimited range of classical recordings. The newer Oppo machines are a good choice - they support a wide range of audio and video formats that are relevant to classical music, and the Oppo players have analog audio connections for 2.0, 2.1, and 5.1. Additionally, the Oppo machines support remote volume control, and built-in “bass management” (including line-level RCA subwoofer connection, and configurable crossover parameters).

    I own UDP-205 (two), BDP-105, and BDP-95, and am satisfied with their versatility and performance.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2018
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  7. foppy

    foppy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    707
    Location:
    western suburb Boston
    Thanks, I appreciate this and all the other comments.

    A few words on my situation. I have a modest but solid mid-fi vintage system: Marantz 4400 run in 2-channel, an Empire 598iii (usually) with a Stanton 681eee, and KEF 104/2 speakers. (So yes, I need RCA inputs.)

    My classical listening is mostly LPs, and I have gathered quite a few classical CDs and maybe around 30 SACDs.

    I think that where I am with this hobby now, both with the ratio of media I listen to (many more LPs than CDs and SACDs) and how much money I've been willing to put into it, the Oppo UDP-205, at $4000, just wouldn't fit.

    But I understand that my needs might change. The Yamaha BD-S681, and up the line at $500, the BD-A1060, handle many more formats than the Oppo BDP-103. (And yes, both have RCA inputs, though I notice now that the Sony linked above doesn't.)

    Maybe that's the choice I have before me. A relatively well-made, good-sounding, and lasting Oppo with limited capabilities that match my current needs, or a perhaps less well made, new Yamaha with wider possibilities.
     
  8. frahengeo

    frahengeo AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    815
    Location:
    Massachusetts
    I cannot comment on BDP-103. However, I do own a BDP-83 that I purchased new ~10 years ago. For the first 2 years, I used it 4-5 times per week and ~ 4 hours each time, but this became progressively less as I upgraded to a BDP-105D, and eventually a UDP-205. I still own the BDP-83, and it gets used maybe 3-4 times per month in our family room. It is still going strong.

    If earlier Oppo units are an indication of build quality, then you should get many more years out of the 103.
     
  9. nedseg

    nedseg AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    449
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    +1 to Robert_kc on bluray music titles...I'd just add that I've been astounded by the 2L releases - mostly smaller ensembles, 'contemporary' classical and a few jazz. The way they mic and mix their recordings is amazing. And now available as downloads in addition to bluray audio. Some of them are recorded/mixed (Hoff Ensemble) with the listener in the center (multi-channel versions). I use the Oppo more for those bluray audios than for any other disc format.
    https://shop.klicktrack.com/2l/?
     
  10. robert_kc

    robert_kc AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    845
    Location:
    Midwest USA
    I wasn't aware of the Yamaha BD-S681 - it looks like a good choice for someone shopping at that price point ($230 on accessories4less.com), assuming they don't need need UHD / 4k. What formats does the Yamaha BD-S681 support that the Oppo BDP-103 doesn't? The BDP-103 plays almost any disc except UHD, and supports the following: USB Hard Drive and Network (SMB, NFS, and DLNA): Stereo and multi-channel PCM up to 192 kHz. Stereo and multi-channel DSD up to 2.8 MHz (DSD64). I've seen only a very few music downloads available with higher bit-rates than 192 kHz PCM and 2.8 MHz DSD - not something I'd worry about.

    The Sony ES UBP-X1000ES appears to be a good universal player (including UHD / 4k) with analog stereo output, priced at $500 on crutchfield.com. There's a refurbished one on eBay for $280. I have no affiliation with any of these sellers. FWIW, If I only needed stereo I'd look hard at this $280 Sony ES UBP-X1000ES on eBay.

    I have no experience with either the Yamaha BD-S681 or Sony ES UBP-X1000ES, and haven't researched them thoroughly. It appears that neither of these units support multi-channel (surround-sound) analog output. And neither has bass management (i.e., subwoofer connection).

    I'm not aware of any other currently manufactured universal players with analog output. (There are discontinued products available used.)

    It's unfortunate Oppo ceased manufacturing. I paid $1300 each for two UDP-205. Apparently people are now trying to sell them for inflated prices.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2018
  11. robert_kc

    robert_kc AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    845
    Location:
    Midwest USA
    Just to clarify, the Blu-ray box sets that I listed above feature video - which I think can be an enjoyable way to experience a recording of classical orchestral (and chamber) music. And, of course, Blu-ray video is particularly beneficial for ballet and opera. (UHD / 4k videos of classical performances are slowly becoming available.)

    I also own Pure Audio Blu-ray (i.e., audio only) and SACD discs that feature multi-channel (i.e., 5.0 or 5.1 surround-sound). (I'm aware of a few multi-channel hi-res downloads, but I've not tried one yet.)

    Hi-res multi-channel (preferably with video) is my favorite recording format for classical music - played via an Oppo UDP-205 and vintage tube amps. (I also have 2 channel systems that employ UDP-205, BDP-105, and BDP-95.)

    I also own numerous hi-res (24bit/192kHz) stereo (2 channel) downloads - mostly from HDTracks. I'll have to check to see if I own anything from 2L. If not, I may give them a try. I'm sure I can find something from 2L I'd like - I'm always looking for hi-res classical recordings.
     

     

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  12. nedseg

    nedseg AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    449
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Just to be clear, the 2L Pure Audio Blu-ray's allow you to select stereo only playback from the disc menu (as well as various multi-channel options). Downloads are available in 'your choice'. Oh, and most of their Blu-ray's include a way to extract a FLAC version to your LAN/PC. I've found that the DSD hi-res formats take so long to DL I now prefer to just order the discs!
    Be sure to check out their 'future release' schedule, as well.
    http://www.2l.no/pages/preview.html
    Enjoy!
     
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  13. foppy

    foppy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    707
    Location:
    western suburb Boston
    Thanks, again. I guess I just assumed that the Yamaha could do more when confronted with this list of what it supports:

    DLNA, USB, BD-Video, BD-R / RE (BD-MV), DVD-Video, DVD-R / -RW (DVD-Video, DVD-VR), DVD+R / +RW (Video and VR mode), Super Audio CD, CD-DA, CD-R / -RW, MKV with H.264, MPEG PS, MPEG TS, MPEG-4, VOB, AVI, ASF, WMV, MP3, WMA, AAC, WAV, FLAC, ALAC, DSDIFF, DSF, JPEG, GIF, PNG

    I'm afraid my tech-addled brain sees this list and thinks "oh that's a lot, must be more than something built 5+ years ago." With no direct experience of these and other formats, and not even really knowing what they are, I see them as a lot of potential--but for applications I may never use. I don't see myself going to multichannel, by the way.

    For what it's worth, here's the (longer) list of what's supported by the Yamaha BD-A1060, at $500 (EDIT: at Accessories 4 Less, it's $350):

    DLNA, USB, BD-ROM / BD-R / BD-RE (BD-Video), DVD-ROM (DVD-Video), DVD-R / DVD-R DL / DVD-RW (DVD-Video / DVD-VR / AVCHD), DVD+R / DVD+R DL / DVD+RW (DVD-Video / DVD-VR / AVCHD), CD-ROM (CDDA / HDCD), CD-R / CD-RW (CDDA), Super Audio CD, MKV with H.264, MPEG PS, MPEG TS, MPEG-4, VOB, AVI, ASF, WMV, MP3, WMA, AAC, WAV, FLAC, ALAC, DSDIFF, DSF, JPEG, GIF, PNG.

    I appreciate your passing along the low prices you've found. Again, at my current level of interest and willingness to spend, it looks like it comes to a choice between the Yamaha BD-S681 at $230 or a used Oppo BDP-103 at around $350.

    Again, thanks to all the knowledgeable people contributing to this thread.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2018
  14. robert_kc

    robert_kc AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    845
    Location:
    Midwest USA
    I'm just curious, what are your thoughts on the refurbished Sony ES UBP-X1000ES on eBay for $280? Again, I haven't done exhaustive comparison, but it looks like it does everything the Yamaha does plus UHD/4k (which the Yamaha doesn't support).

    FWIW, here's what Crutchfield says about the Sony ES UBP-X1000ES:

    "A 4K Blu-ray player built for custom installations

    Sony created their ES-series UBP-X1000ES Ultra HD Blu-ray player with custom installers in mind. So what makes this 4K player better suited for "advanced" home theater setups? For starters, the sturdy frame-and-beam chassis combines with a honeycomb-like top plate to significantly lower vibration.

    Also, industrial-strength electrical shielding separates the video and audio circuitry for pure picture and sound. And of course, this player is designed to make Ultra HD Blu-ray discs look their best on your 4K Ultra HD TV."​
    • plays Ultra HD Blu-ray discs, 3D and standard Blu-ray discs, SACDs, DVD-Audio, DVDs, CDs and rewriteable discs
    • built-in audio decoding for Dolby® Digital, Dolby TrueHD, DTS®, and DTS-HD Master Audio
    • plays high-resolution digital music files via USB storage device; PCM files up to 24-bit/192kHz resolution, and 2.8 MHz DSD files
    • plays AAC, AIFF, ALAC, DSD (.dff and .dfs files), FLAC, MP3, WMA, and WAV audio file formats
    • optical and coaxial digital audio outputs
    • 1 pair of gold-plated stereo RCA audio outputs
    • Along with all the streaming video goodness, this player also turns your connected home theater speakers into a wireless music hub. Download Sony's free SongPAL™ app, and control the player from your iOS® or Android™ device. The app gives you wireless access to the music stored on your phone or a DLNA-connected server, plus streaming services like Spotify® Connect.
     
  15. foppy

    foppy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    707
    Location:
    western suburb Boston
    Sounds good, thanks for underscoring that one! Frankly a lot for me to process, but I will make sure that's part of my thinking, too.
     
  16. foppy

    foppy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    707
    Location:
    western suburb Boston
    An anticlimactic coda to this discussion--

    After playing an SACD which I knew would work on my current Sony (for some reason, it would read SACDs by not CDs), I popped in a normal CD, and it read that fine. Others, too.

    This morning I went back to the CD that started the problem, Karajan's Bruckner 4 from the complete DG cycle. Plays perfectly (--though the mastering leaves something to be desired, I think).

    So I'll ride this player until it drops. When we were discussing a new universal player, my wife said in her sweet, firm way, "maybe that's a Christmas present."
     

     

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  17. E-Stat

    E-Stat AK Subscriber Subscriber

    Messages:
    6,276
    FYI, I have a BDP-103 used almost exclusively for video. For audio, it's analog output stage with NE5532 op amps is just so-so. Nothing to get excited about. Never was particularly impressed with the fancier "5" flavors either. Different op amps (OPA1642) and still using a switch mode power supply.
     

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